teenyboone
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 05:36 am
teenyboone wrote:
okie wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
okie wrote:
Keep a sharp eye on this story. Discounted home loan speculation for Obama's 1.65 million dollar home.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/07/02/obamas-received-discounted-home-loan/
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2039886/posts

This may take a while to unravel.


Already debunked. You gotta work a little faster with the smears, Okie.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/7/2/15120/21794/654/545493

Seriously sad.

Cycloptichorn

I am not sure, cyclops. I read your kos article, which provided little information to debunk the claim, and of course we know that Dailoy KOS is unbiased don't we? How come he apparently paid no points or fees? I have just gone through this process, my credit is as high as it can be, and I wasn't told the same thing about a loan, fact is the up front fees seem to be standard procedure if you get a home loan, not a line of credit loan. But I am a nobody out here, but we know that Obama is a prominent Chicago politician, but we all know that has no impact on such loans in Chicago, don't we?

http://patriotroom.com/?p=493

And how about Chris Dodd getting special treatment, but apparently nobody cares?

By the way, congratulations to MM, and I wish you happiness until death do you part.

I prefer Occom Bill's response but what's the big deal? What McSame didn't get a BIG deal when he MARRIED all that money? Is THAT what she wanted? A BEER-drinkin', DRUNKEN SAILOR? No disrespect to all of the OTHER men who sail, my HUSBAND being ONE of them! :wink:


I TAKE THAT BACK! Makes ALL Navy men look like the DRUNKS, they're NOT! Cool
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 09:07 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
okie wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
okie wrote:
Keep a sharp eye on this story. Discounted home loan speculation for Obama's 1.65 million dollar home.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/07/02/obamas-received-discounted-home-loan/
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2039886/posts

This may take a while to unravel.


Already debunked. You gotta work a little faster with the smears, Okie.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/7/2/15120/21794/654/545493

Seriously sad.

Cycloptichorn

I am not sure, cyclops. I read your kos article, which provided little information to debunk the claim, and of course we know that Dailoy KOS is unbiased don't we? How come he apparently paid no points or fees? I have just gone through this process, my credit is as high as it can be, and I wasn't told the same thing about a loan, fact is the up front fees seem to be standard procedure if you get a home loan, not a line of credit loan. But I am a nobody out here, but we know that Obama is a prominent Chicago politician, but we all know that has no impact on such loans in Chicago, don't we?

http://patriotroom.com/?p=493

And how about Chris Dodd getting special treatment, but apparently nobody cares?

By the way, congratulations to MM, and I wish you happiness until death do you part.
Yeah Okie... I'm sure the rest of your application was, and negotiation skills are, nearly identical to Obama's and/or Dodd's. Laughing

My negotiation skills do not include being able to tell the bankers that I am a "COMMUNITY ORGANIZER" and that my name is Barack Obama, does it Bill? By the way, what is a community organizer? I have been pondering over that for a while. I grew up in Oklahoma, and never heard of a community organizer. About the only things we organized were our farms and going to work every day. As far as we could tell, our community was pretty organized as it existed, and the main things we organized were our families, our farms, and our own business.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 09:18 am
okie wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
okie wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
okie wrote:
Keep a sharp eye on this story. Discounted home loan speculation for Obama's 1.65 million dollar home.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/07/02/obamas-received-discounted-home-loan/
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2039886/posts

This may take a while to unravel.


Already debunked. You gotta work a little faster with the smears, Okie.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/7/2/15120/21794/654/545493

Seriously sad.

Cycloptichorn

I am not sure, cyclops. I read your kos article, which provided little information to debunk the claim, and of course we know that Dailoy KOS is unbiased don't we? How come he apparently paid no points or fees? I have just gone through this process, my credit is as high as it can be, and I wasn't told the same thing about a loan, fact is the up front fees seem to be standard procedure if you get a home loan, not a line of credit loan. But I am a nobody out here, but we know that Obama is a prominent Chicago politician, but we all know that has no impact on such loans in Chicago, don't we?

http://patriotroom.com/?p=493

And how about Chris Dodd getting special treatment, but apparently nobody cares?

By the way, congratulations to MM, and I wish you happiness until death do you part.
Yeah Okie... I'm sure the rest of your application was, and negotiation skills are, nearly identical to Obama's and/or Dodd's. Laughing

My negotiation skills do not include being able to tell the bankers that I am a "COMMUNITY ORGANIZER" and that my name is Barack Obama, does it Bill? By the way, what is a community organizer? I have been pondering over that for a while. I grew up in Oklahoma, and never heard of a community organizer. About the only things we organized were our farms and going to work every day. As far as we could tell, our community was pretty organized as it existed, and the main things we organized were our families, our farms, and our own business.


I'm still waiting for the media to get even a little bit curious about ACORN through which Obama did his community organizing. Their lack of curiosity about that is very peculiar. Or perhaps it isn't.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 09:24 am
Yes, good old ACORN, the outfit that had people indicted for illegal registrations of voters.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 09:39 am
okie wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
okie wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
okie wrote:
Keep a sharp eye on this story. Discounted home loan speculation for Obama's 1.65 million dollar home.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/07/02/obamas-received-discounted-home-loan/
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2039886/posts

This may take a while to unravel.


Already debunked. You gotta work a little faster with the smears, Okie.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/7/2/15120/21794/654/545493

Seriously sad.

Cycloptichorn

I am not sure, cyclops. I read your kos article, which provided little information to debunk the claim, and of course we know that Dailoy KOS is unbiased don't we? How come he apparently paid no points or fees? I have just gone through this process, my credit is as high as it can be, and I wasn't told the same thing about a loan, fact is the up front fees seem to be standard procedure if you get a home loan, not a line of credit loan. But I am a nobody out here, but we know that Obama is a prominent Chicago politician, but we all know that has no impact on such loans in Chicago, don't we?

http://patriotroom.com/?p=493

And how about Chris Dodd getting special treatment, but apparently nobody cares?

By the way, congratulations to MM, and I wish you happiness until death do you part.
Yeah Okie... I'm sure the rest of your application was, and negotiation skills are, nearly identical to Obama's and/or Dodd's. Laughing

My negotiation skills do not include being able to tell the bankers that I am a "COMMUNITY ORGANIZER" and that my name is Barack Obama, does it Bill? By the way, what is a community organizer? I have been pondering over that for a while. I grew up in Oklahoma, and never heard of a community organizer. About the only things we organized were our farms and going to work every day. As far as we could tell, our community was pretty organized as it existed, and the main things we organized were our families, our farms, and our own business.


You segued here away from actually answering Bill's statement, to an Ad Hominem attack on Obama. But you still haven't shown that he did anything wrong whatsoever. And it's still a pathetic tack that you are taking. For a guy who supposedly used his 'influence' to get a deal, he sure as hell didn't get much off of the average.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 09:55 am
Cycloptichorn wrote:

You segued here away from actually answering Bill's statement, to an Ad Hominem attack on Obama. But you still haven't shown that he did anything wrong whatsoever. And it's still a pathetic tack that you are taking. For a guy who supposedly used his 'influence' to get a deal, he sure as hell didn't get much off of the average.

Cycloptichorn

I have not yet asserted he committed a crime. I have merely asked some questions and expressed my suspicions, and said this needs to be watched or looked into. Also, from an initial reading, I have a question more about the waiving of up front costs, not the actual rate, but both should be looked into.

I know it would be very very difficult for you to believe Obama is not pure as the wind driven snow, but I don't have the same kinds of illusions that you may have about Chicago politicians and "community organizers." I have not seen much to tell me he is much different than a typical politician from there. I know he has worked hard to polish an image otherwise, but the jury is still very much out, and it would be wise for us to be intellectually honest about this guy that has been trumped up as the saviour of not only your party, but the country. His track record and past associations are not impressive at all to me. There isn't much there, and what is there only raises more questions than answers.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 09:56 am
okie wrote:
Yes, good old ACORN, the outfit that had people indicted for illegal registrations of voters.


Yes, wasn't it good of them to notify the Justice Department about those fraudulent applications -- all 6 of them? Good thing they ACORN was on the lookout for voter fraud.

I am glad that your community is organized, okie. Now can you try, really hard, to imagine that other communities just might not look like yours?
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:00 am
Free Duck, I guess I have never lived where it was run by community organizers. I guess I thought that was what government was for. All light hearted reference aside, I guess I don't see why community organizers are needed, or what they actually do. I am more used to having families organize the lives of the members of it, and for individuals to make decisions about their own lives. I thought that was what freedom was about?

Look, people can organize their communities all they want, but it seems to me that most communities are already organized, or should be, by the government entities running it, and by the entities located within the community. Bottom line, to tell me somebody is a community organizer doesn't tell me much. I would like to know what that person actually did, if anything.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:09 am
okie wrote:
Yes, good old ACORN, the outfit that had people indicted for illegal registrations of voters.


Those indictment in themselves do not implicate Obama nor are they by themselves damning of the organization itself. But if this group was less shadowy, less under the radar which it and Obama no doubt prefer, and perhaps a bit less....ummm....emphatic(?) in its focus and goals, I think it would have made the front pages as part of the resume. The fact that it has not suggests to me that a closer look would not be flattering to Obama nor help his cause with any other than the far Left.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:09 am
Community organizers don't run anything, Okie. They get people to band together, when those who ARE running things aren't doing a good job of it. Or when the community members are neglecting a shared resource, or when crime needs to be fought in other ways then just waiting for the police.

Read up

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_organizing

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:10 am
What a post of contradictions! Community organizing is what the government is for yet you believe that freedom means organizing our own lives? Which is it?

Communities often organize themselves -- neighborhood associations, churches, school councils, etc... Some communities need a little help with this. What's so difficult to understand about this? It's a very conservative value that I would think you would support -- people organizing themselves in order to better work with the government to get things done. It's not "run by" community organizers. Rather organizers help people come together to get what they want. If you want to know more about what exactly Obama did as an organizer, that's a fair question and I'm sure you could google an answer. But it seems to me that you are more interested in discounting the value of that service based on some preconceived notions about community stemming solely from your own not-very-representative experience.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:15 am
Foxfyre wrote:
okie wrote:
Yes, good old ACORN, the outfit that had people indicted for illegal registrations of voters.


Those indictment in themselves do not implicate Obama nor are they by themselves damning of the organization itself. But if this group was less shadowy, less under the radar which it and Obama no doubt prefer, and perhaps a bit less....ummm....emphatic(?) in its focus and goals, I think it would have made the front pages as part of the resume. The fact that it has not suggests to me that a closer look would not be flattering to Obama nor help his cause with any other than the far Left.


Can you explain what you mean by "shadowy", "under the radar", and "emphatic"?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:17 am
When people begin to question Obama's community organizations, they've hit the bottom of the barrel. They are "that" desperate to find negatives on Obama. Ignorance prevails!
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:22 am
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Community organizers don't run anything, Okie. They get people to band together, when those who ARE running things aren't doing a good job of it. Or when the community members are neglecting a shared resource, or when crime needs to be fought in other ways then just waiting for the police.

Read up

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_organizing

Cycloptichorn

This actually raises a whole can of worms here, another subject in and of itself.

I happen to think that if the government is failing to do its job, you change it, you reform it, you elect people that will get the job done, you do not organize some shadow organization that may usurp the responsibility of government. To a point. I have belonged to Neighborhood watch programs, for whatever worth they were, and often the police encouraged such things and communicated with the people. Agreed, that is one good example of community organization that may work. But I can also see the danger of community organizers browbeating everybody in a community to vote for certain people en masse, which I think is a dangerous way of doing things.

I have also seen citizens groups hold up companies from doing business in an area, or building something, when such citizens groups have no constitutional authority to do anything. Often, the government already has laws and regulations in place that govern the rights and ability of people and businesses to do things, and so what you end up with are citizens groups violating the constitutional rights of people, sometimes their private property rights. If people do not like the regulations in place, they should elect people to change them rather than violating the rights of fellow citizens with these community organizations that only represent a small portion of the citizenry, not all of the citizens as the government does.

So community organizations are okay as long as they do not usurp the authority of the legitimate government, or claim to speak for everyone in a community, or try to arm twist everyone in a community.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:28 am
FreeDuck wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
okie wrote:
Yes, good old ACORN, the outfit that had people indicted for illegal registrations of voters.


Those indictment in themselves do not implicate Obama nor are they by themselves damning of the organization itself. But if this group was less shadowy, less under the radar which it and Obama no doubt prefer, and perhaps a bit less....ummm....emphatic(?) in its focus and goals, I think it would have made the front pages as part of the resume. The fact that it has not suggests to me that a closer look would not be flattering to Obama nor help his cause with any other than the far Left.


Can you explain what you mean by "shadowy", "under the radar", and "emphatic"?


I mean you can't find anything other than very undetailed and generalized statements re Obama's community organizer experience on his website despite the fact that this is repeatedly emphasized as an important component of his resume. Wesley Clark specificially cited it as a credential qualifying Obama to be President while McCain's military experience was not a qualification for him to be President.

But you don't find the media doing much probing into what Obama's duties, involvement, and contacts actually were with Acorn or even mentioning that Acorn was in fact his community organizer experience.

Michelle Malkin cannot be said to be unbiased in much of any of her views nor would she claim to be, but this short piece does enumerate why Acorn should be part of the scrutiny of a candidate's background and credentials for POTUS.


More left-wing voter fraud allegations against ACORN
By Michelle Malkin
March 13, 2008 11:22 AM

Not again?

Yes, again.

KYW in Philly reports that the left-wing, government-subsidized group ACORN once again faces allegations of voter fraud:

Philadelphia elections officials are accusing the nonprofit advocacy group "Acorn" of filing fraudulent voter registrations in advance of the April 22nd Pennsylvania primary.

Acorn, which advocates on behalf of low-income residents in the city, has mounted a voter registration drive in the past few months. But city election commissioners are complaining that many of the submitted registrations appear to be faulty, and they have forwarded the matter to the district attorney''s office for further investigation.

Krista Holub, Acorn''s political director in Pennsylvania, promised the elections officials that her group will cooperate:

"We''re very committed to helping low- to moderate-income people across the state get registered to vote. And we''re here to work closely with the board of elections to make sure that everyone we''re helping to apply gets on the rolls."

The city officials say many of the addresses listed on the registrations are invalid, but Acorn blames the post office for not adequately servicing low-income communities.

That''s rich. It''s all the post office''s fault!

Last October, three elections hoaxers who worked for the far Left group ACORN pleaded guilty in Seattle for their role in the biggest election fraud scheme in Washington state history. It''s the same ACORN tied to massive voter fraud in Missouri. And Ohio. And 12 other states.

The same ACORN that has received government grants and taxpayer subsidies while pushing a militant partisan agenda as offshoots of the AFL-CIO and Democrat Party.

You think anyone has the guts to pull them off the government teat?

Forget it.

As I noted twice in January, the Dems are pushing to pour more money into ACORN''s coffers under the guise of the economic stimulus expansion. In other words: more Washington investment in voter fraud.

If you subsidize it, you get more of it.

Election mischief: Your tax dollars at work!
LINK
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 10:50 am
Foxfyre wrote:

I mean you can't find anything other than very undetailed and generalized statements re Obama's community organizer experience on his website despite the fact that this is repeatedly emphasized as an important component of his resume.


But you said the group was "shadowy" and "under the radar", not that Obama's work there was not detailed enough on his website. I'm just wondering why you say that.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 11:05 am
FreeDuck wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:

I mean you can't find anything other than very undetailed and generalized statements re Obama's community organizer experience on his website despite the fact that this is repeatedly emphasized as an important component of his resume.


But you said the group was "shadowy" and "under the radar", not that Obama's work there was not detailed enough on his website. I'm just wondering why you say that.


It is 'under the radar' because what Acorn actually does is not mainstream and is generally off the front pages and you only hear about it when there are new allegations of fraud, etc. It is 'shadowy' because it IS missing from Obama's website and is not mentioned along with the highly flouted community organizer experience that is put out there as one of his major credentials. And I mention it because I think openly linking Obama to Acorn would likely not enhance Obama's prestige with anybody but the extreme Left, but I nevertheless think that a voter who honestly wished to be informed would want to know about it.

And finally, the mainstream media's dedicated lack of curiosity about all that is either curious or telling. I think it is probably both.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 11:32 am
I don't know what is so complicated about registering to vote? I don't want some "community organizer" twisting my arm to register, thank you, I am perfectly capable of doing it myself.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 11:52 am
Well, I know some people who have been grateful to folks who come to their door to register them or to help them change their address or affiliation. My mother, for example, has a hard time driving and would not have updated her registration if someone hadn't come to her door. Nobody "twisted her arm" (what a bunch of hyperbole) but they did help her to do something that she wanted to do but probably would not have done.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 7 Jul, 2008 11:58 am
With no aspersions of any kind cast upon Freeduck's mother, I want people to vote who have studied the issues and know what the candidates stand for and who have evaluated what those stances actually are. I want people who understand the importance of their vote and who make an intentional effort to find out where, when, and how to register, where their precinct votes, and make an effort to get there to vote.

I see nothing good coming from people who are handed a registration form, are told what party box to X, are driven to the polls, and are told who to vote for when those people have absolutely zero understanding of what their vote might mean. You might as well have the Party serving as proxy to vote for them.
0 Replies
 
 

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