Obama '08?

My condolences for what's happened to your thread, Soz.

It's important to consider the economic status of the majority of Blacks who live in Chicago and of course, live in Cook County.

In this respect, Oparah is unique, as there are few other Blacks with her wealth.Many of the residents of Chicago's South and West sides are impoverished and because of this, it would appear, that their vote can be easily bought. I personally don't blame the poor who are paid ( one way of the other ) to vote. If their vote leads to a good job in Post Office, or one with the CTA, or political
appointment in the Board of Education, or a position with the fire Deparment or police department, all I can say is more power to them.

However, I find it very hard, if not impossible to believe that poor Blacks in Chicago can relate to Obama. Why should they?

If you don't know that the material below is a direct reponse to the sozobe who began the thread, you need help, Snnod!
Note that I quoted her directly. Do you have difficulty reading more than a couple of paragraphs, Snood? Some people do. I had a friend from the inner city of Chicago that could comprehend a paragraph only with difficulty.
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BernardR
Seasoned Member



Joined: 02 May 2006
Posts: 2434

Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 2:08 pm Post: 2208626 -

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At the beginning of this thread, Sozobe wrote about Obama


Things I've always liked about him:

Public speaking skills: This guy is GOOD.

Bipartisan appeal: He did amazing work in connecting to Republicans in Illinois, and has gotten a good reaction among many Republicans I know.

Savvy: He's made a lot of good decisions, politically.

Charisma: He's got it.

Idealism: This goes back to what I said re: inexperienced -- I think it's something that people really like to see, and can be especially good when paired with young.

Humor: Slightly different than charisma, and what made me start this thread. Read Maureen Dowd's column about his performance at a press dinner on Saturday (?), and it sounds like he did an amazing job.

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I would strongly urge Sozobe to check the records of African-Americans who have run in venues where there were not HUGE numbers of African-American voters.

Obama's Public Speaking Skills are as good as many politicians. He is, however, fond of generalizations and worn out nostrums.

Bi Partisan Appeal- You really must be kidding , Sozobe! Do you really think that Obama would win any votes in the South and the Southwest which are not African-American?

I think the Republicans are salivating at the prospect that the Democrats would be dumb enough to run him!

You do know, Sozobe, that around 90% of African-Americans voted for Kerry, do you not?

How many additional African-American votes would Obama gather? Another 6%?

How many Hispanics votes would he get, Sozobe?

If you know the politics in the large American cities, Sozobe,you know that Hispanic Americans do NOT trust African-American politicians of any stripe. You also may be aware that because of growth of Hispanic populations in large American cities, there is a fierce rivalry between the new aspirants to political office in those cities-Hispanics--and African-Americans.

How many votes would he get from Whites all over the country, Sozobe?

If you think that his presence on a national ticket would help the Democratic Party, I must say that you need a refresher course on how the political system works in the USA.

You do know who Representative Ford from Tennessee is, don't you, sozobe?

A very well spoken African-American with lots of legislative experience in the House of Representatives and a well honed organization. HE WILL BE STEAMROLLERED IN TENNESSEE RUNNING FOR SENATOR. Running in his district, which is 66% African-American, Ford can do well but he will be murdered in the general election.

Savvy- Savvy? He is so savvy that he uses a Hispanic Nanny in a city that is 40% African American and he is so savvy that he has cut off relations with PUSH--Jesse Jackson's group--Now, of course, Jesse would have to hold his nose and go along with him but to say he is savvy about Chicago politics is not to know Chicago Politics.

Charisma? He is a skinny wimp with a bad complexion!!! Where is the Charisma there? He was, of course, labelled as an inefficient leader and a temporizer by one of the most intelligent audiences he could ever have--his colleagues at the Harvard Law Review!!

Idealism? What Idealism? What Idealism did he display when he was President of the Harvard Law Review? What Idealism does he have stemming from his horrendous childhood when his father, a Kenyan, abandoned his white mother in Hawaii? What Idealism does he have after his cocaine use? Will he be quick to absolve everyone else for minor "quirks"? What Idealism did he pick up when he attended Muslim school for two years during his elementary school years.

Humor? The only thing humorous about Obama is that he thinks he won a great victory being elected Senator. ANYONE who knows Illinois poiltics knows he would have been soundly thrashed by Senator Fitzgerald had he not resigned. Of course, Obama would have received almost every African-American vote in Illinois, but that would have not been enough!

That may be so, but luckily there are few who are quite as mad as he is.

You may remember this post, Bernard: currently, 68% of whites and 82% of hispanics in Illinois think Obama is doing a good job.

Even if you deduct, say, 10 percentage points for the "racial slippage" you have expounded on, you still have a majority of whites, and over two-thirds of Hispanics.

You have the patience of Job, nimh.

He really does.

Mr. Nimh- You take a poll of 600( six hundred) people from Illinois and think that it can mirror the TRUE feelings of the voters of Illinois. It doesn't and I don't think you know very much about Illinois politics.

You obviously did not know that African-American Ministers, almost to a man, agreed with Alan Keyes that homosexuality is an abomination.

If you don't know that about African-American religious leaders, you don't know very much, Mr. Nimh.

But, now on to Obama in real life when he is in the Senate..

Note, that Senator McCain ripped his butt off---

February 2, 2006
The Honorable John McCain
United States Senate
241 Russell Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510

Dear John:

Thank you for inviting me to participate in the meeting yesterday to discuss lobbying and ethics reform proposals currently before the Senate. I appreciate your willingness to reach out to me and several other Senate Democrats to discuss what should be done to restore public confidence in the way that Congress conducts its business. The discussion clearly underscored the difficult challenge facing Congress.
You and many in the Democratic Caucus have played a major role in reform efforts in the Senate. In fact, the Indian Affairs Committee hearings you led were instrumental in promoting public awareness of the culture of corruption that has permeated the nation's capital.
As you know, Senator Harry Reid and others in the Democratic Caucus have taken an important step by introducing S. 2180, the Honest Leadership Act, which imposes many of the same disclosure requirements for lobbyists that you have proposed, while also strengthening enforcement, eliminating "pay to play" schemes, and imposing more restrictive rules on meals, gifts, and travel that Members and their staff can receive from special interests that advocate before Congress. This bill, which now has the support of 40 members of the Democratic Caucus, represents a significant step in addressing many of the worst aspects of corruption that have come to light as a result of the Justice Department investigation of Jack Abramoff.
I know you have expressed an interest in creating a task force to further study and discuss these matters, but I and others in the Democratic Caucus believe the more effective and timely course is to allow the committees of jurisdiction to roll up their sleeves and get to work on writing ethics and lobbying reform legislation that a majority of the Senate can support. Committee consideration of these matters through the normal course will ensure that these issues are discussed in a public forum and that those within Congress, as well as those on the outside, can express their views, ensuring a thorough review of this matter.
Given the state of affairs in Washington, we have a historic opportunity to make fundamental changes in the way our government operates so that the actions we take as public officials are responsive and transparent to the American people. Thank you again for your interest in this important matter.

Sincerely,

Barack Obama
United States Senator

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February 6, 2006
The Honorable Barack Obama
United States Senate
SH-713
Washington, DC 20510

Dear Senator Obama:

I would like to apologize to you for assuming that your private assurances to me regarding your desire to cooperate in our efforts to negotiate bipartisan lobbying reform legislation were sincere. When you approached me and insisted that despite your leadership's preference to use the issue to gain a political advantage in the 2006 elections, you were personally committed to achieving a result that would reflect credit on the entire Senate and offer the country a better example of political leadership, I concluded your professed concern for the institution and the public interest was genuine and admirable. Thank you for disabusing me of such notions with your letter to me dated February 2, 2006, which explained your decision to withdraw from our bipartisan discussions. I'm embarrassed to admit that after all these years in politics I failed to interpret your previous assurances as typical rhetorical gloss routinely used in politics to make self-interested partisan posturing appear more noble. Again, sorry for the confusion, but please be assured I won't make the same mistake again.
As you know, the Majority Leader has asked Chairman Collins to hold hearings and mark up a bill for floor consideration in early March. I fully support such timely action and I am confident that, together with Senator Lieberman, the Committee on Governmental Affairs will report out a meaningful, bipartisan bill.
You commented in your letter about my "interest in creating a task force to further study" this issue, as if to suggest I support delaying the consideration of much-needed reforms rather than allowing the committees of jurisdiction to hold hearings on the matter. Nothing could be further from the truth. The timely findings of a bipartisan working group could be very helpful to the committee in formulating legislation that will be reported to the full Senate. Since you are new to the Senate, you may not be aware of the fact that I have always supported fully the regular committee and legislative process in the Senate, and routinely urge Committee Chairmen to hold hearings on important issues. In fact, I urged Senator Collins to schedule a hearing upon the Senate's return in January.
Furthermore, I have consistently maintained that any lobbying reform proposal be bipartisan. The bill Senators Joe Lieberman and Bill Nelson and I have introduced is evidence of that commitment as is my insistence that members of both parties be included in meetings to develop the legislation that will ultimately be considered on the Senate floor. As I explained in a recent letter to Senator Reid, and have publicly said many times, the American people do not see this as just a Republican problem or just a Democratic problem. They see it as yet another run-of-the-mill Washington scandal, and they expect it will generate just another round of partisan gamesmanship and posturing. Senator Lieberman and I, and many other members of this body, hope to exceed the public's low expectations. We view this as an opportunity to bring transparency and accountability to the Congress, and, most importantly, to show the public that both parties will work together to address our failings.
As I noted, I initially believed you shared that goal. But I understand how important the opportunity to lead your party's effort to exploit this issue must seem to a freshman Senator, and I hold no hard feelings over your earlier disingenuousness. Again, I have been around long enough to appreciate that in politics the public interest isn't always a priority for every one of us. Good luck to you, Senator.

Sincerely,

John McCain
United States Senate

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We shall see, Mr. Nimh, exactly what happens to African-American politicians who do NOT run in venues where the majority is not African-American.

Err, ok. So does that mean we wont be seeing you posting any polls anymore then?

Because you know, of course, Mr. Bernard R., that most nationwide polls are of about 1,000 people. 1,000 people to represent the entire diversity of the US population. If that was ever good enough for you, I dont see why 600 people from just Illinois would be a problem for you.

The thing with those 600, of course, is that they were not randomly selected; they were selected and then weighted to reflect representative numbers of people from Cook County, the suburbs and downstate; of whites, blacks and Hispanics, men and women, etc. As has already been noted before.


That may be so but is wholly irrelevant to the point I made: that Keyes is outrageous and quite mad - unlike most African-Americans.

I'm plopping this one in here as it relates to some earlier discussion.

EJ Dionne is becoming one of the most astute and dependable journalists in the print media. The point made in the second paragraph ought to gain our focus...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/14/AR2006081401162.html

82 % of Hispanic are for Obama? And how many of these Hispanics are legal?

Do you realize that in the State of Illinois there are at least 500,000 illegals. How much do you suppose they get paid to vote once, twice or even three times?

Ironically, they get paid, per vote, precisely what you pay as yearly dues for membership in Stormfront.

I find balance aesthetically pleasing. You?

Population of Illinois:
(2000 census)

Hispanic: 1,530,262
Black: 1,876,875

Note that Obama settled the dispute and showed a great deal of political skill in doing so:



(Photo taken in March 2006, after Obama engineered a reconciliaton.)

Hispanics in Chicago= 1.5 million
Blacks in Chicago= 1.2 million

Basically, what this means is that most of the Hispanics inIllinois
live in Chicago ( Cook County ), while 64% of the Blacks of the State live in Chicago ( Cook County) with the remainder of Blacks dispersed throughout the State.

Miller- Mr. Nihm lives in Europe. He knows very little about how politics really operates in the USA.

You are aware of certain truths. Mr. Nimh apparently is not--

Truth No. 1--VERY FEW AFRICAN-AMERICAN WILL WIN AN ELECTION IN THE USA IF THEY DO NOT HAVE A VOTING BASE THAT IS MAINLY AFRICAN-AMERICAN

Truth No.2 -I already proved to Mr. Nimh that the election of Doulgas Wilder in Virginia as governor CLEARLY SHOWED that even if a POLL gave an AFRICAN-AMERICAN CANDIDATE AN 11 point lead before the election, Wilder won by few than one percent.

Wilder WON IN A SQUEAKER> He is the O N L Y African-American ever to be elected as governor in the USA.

Truth No. 3- At this time, there are only about 35 or 40 Members of the House who are African-American. Since there are only 35 or 40, the percentage who are African-American as compared to the 435 membership of the House is about 9 %--less than African-American numbers nation wide( about 12 -13% at this time)

Truth No. 4- When African-Americans have won in the past and have been elected to top posts such as Senator, it has been in a situation where they could have closed their eyes and won the race.

You do know, Miller, that the do-nothing lazy unaccomplished scandal ridden Carol Moseley Braun- AN AFRICAN- AMERICAN become Senator in 1992 to be IGNOMINIOUSLY DEFEATED JUST FOUR YEARS LATER!1

Why was she elected, Miller? You know why!

She ran in the Primary against Alan Dixon(D) incumbent, and a SPOILER-Al Hofeld--a wannabe

She got 38% of the vote

DIxon got 35 % of the vote

and Hofeld got 27% of the vote

Everybody in Illinois knows that Braun would never have won that seat if it had not been for Hofeld.

Truth # 5-- Obama won in 2004 because he ran against an African-American. ILLINOIS VOTERS WOULD NEVER EVER VOTE FOR AN AFRICAN-AMERICAN IF HE HAD NOT RUN AGAINST ANOTHER AFRICAN-AMERICAN WHO WAS A LAST MINUTE ENTRY AND A CARPETBAGGER AT THAT....


Now, Miller, the only way I think Mr.Nimh can be made to see the light is after the election on Nov.7th.. I am confident that I will be able to show that every African-American who is running in a race in which the MAJORITY OF HIS POTENTIAL VOTERS ARE NOT AFRICAN-AMERICAN WILL LOSE!!!

We shall see!!!!

Ehmm, yes... and?

Nimh doesn't know anything about Chicago ( Cook County )
politics . In Chicago, money talks....and talks.... and talks....