Obama '08?

@plainoldme,

Did you thumbs down my graph on who pays most of the taxes, pom? I seriously would like to know, because it would tell us even more about you.

1 Reply

@plainoldme,

plainoldme wrote:

Sugar, the issue here is LEGALITY.

And, anyone who denies the presence of the right in the big time drug trade is naive.

I have to ask you again, are you sane?

And LBJ was a big government liberal Democrat, pom. You claim to be an expert on politics and history, but some of your statements are not only wrong, but downright bizarre.

1 Reply

@okie,

Hey, okie, what year does that graph represent? 1935? Do you understand what's happened to the middle class since 2008? Or were you not part of this world?

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@okie,

I stayed away from threads on which you post for a week. As it happened, I had little time because of personal and professional matters. When I returned, I noticed that several of your posts were at -4.

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@okie,

You prove time and time and time and time again that you can not follow a thread.

I wrote that the issue here is LEGALITY to ican who told me that he wants to see me have one self-supporting job that is LEGAL.

Now, do you understand what you are responding to in your usual skewed way?

The equivalent to your response here would be this scenario:

I am walking with a friend after seeing a movie. We are on our way to dinner and are considering the restaurants on the street. We weigh the contemporary American place against the Pan-Asian place against the classic Italian place against the brew pub. You fall in step with us as we discuss our four leading choices and you say, "Pink."

That is how much of a tangent this response of yours is:

Quote:

plainoldme wrote:

Sugar, the issue here is LEGALITY.

And, anyone who denies the presence of the right in the big time drug trade is naive.

I have to ask you again, are you sane?

And LBJ was a big government liberal Democrat, pom. You claim to be an expert on politics and history, but some of your statements are not only wrong, but downright bizarre.

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@ican711nm,

plainoldme" wrote:

Quote:

I guess you would seek to deprive me of my lousy $22,000 a year for which I work two jobs, always six, sometimes seven, days a week.

ican711nm wrote:

Quote:

Yes I would like to deprive you of your lousy jobs for $22,000 a year ! I'd prefer to see you lawfully earn at least triple that for one job, 5 days and 40 hours a week.

Prerequisite step 1: give up your leftist fantasies, and think rationally.

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@ican711nm,

Was there some need to repeat that?

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@plainoldme,

Or in small time drug dealing. Think of all those folks cooking crystal meth. They are not educated, not elite and not leftists.

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@ican711nm,

Quote:

Let me tell you straight off and shoulder to shoulder, ican. To give up my left wing weltanschauung would mean to become a whore.

To me, being on the left is a higher state. Being on the left is ethical. Being on the left is what people should be evolving toward. Not creeping back into the right wing dung heap.

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@plainoldme,

So are you saying that nobody on the left sells drugs, makes illegal drugs, or uses illegal drugs?

And since you seem to be saying that those people that make meth are uneducated, I suggest you back that up with some facts.

You like to make that sort of claim, so lets see you back it up.

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Does the name Abramoff mean nothing to you ican?

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@okie,

okie wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:
To repeat: you have no evidence whatsoever to support your positions, whereas I most certainly do to support mine. The numbers do not lie.

Cycloptichorn

Then where is your evidence? It takes more than your statements, which frankly are not credible to my mind, at least not without data. I think the higher earners are paying more and more of the tax revenues now than ever. You said that was wrong

No, I didn't! Read my post more closely. I said that the wealthy now own a larger percentage of the overall wealth in America then in the past, and this leads them to pay more taxes - even though their rates of taxation are lower than they used to be.

For example:

If you and I both earn 100 dollars, and there is a 10% tax on our earnings, we both pay 10 dollars in taxes for a total of $20.

If over time, my wages increase by triple and yours remain flat, I might move into a higher tax bracket and pay 20% on my earnings. So I am now paying $60 in taxes on my $300 in earnings, and you are still paying $10 on your $100 in earnings. By your estimation, this means that I am getting punished and you are being rewarded with low taxes - even though my share of the overall wealth is growing while yours is not.

High earners are paying more of the overall tax burden, because their earnings have gone up and up and up over time whereas the middle and lower classes have remained flat. The point you are making supports MY position, that the rich have profited far more than the middle class under Reaganite policies - not that they are somehow being punished.

Quote:

and so it is up to you to prove it, with numbers. Look, we know that approaching 50% of the population pay absolutely no income tax at all, so it is readily apparent that the producers and people with money are paying everyone else's way, and only an idiot or a liar will try to deny it. Which one are you?

You have this backward. 50% of our society has so little wealth that they pay next to nothing at all, in large part because the last 30 years have seen little to no wage growth for them at all.

Quote:

Cyclops, I am a little sorry for getting a bit abrupt and abrasive, using the words liar and idiot, but frankly my patience is running short with folks that insist upon demagoging the productive and responsible people of this country.

This black and white, Randian view of 'producers and parasites' as the divisions of the people of America is childish in it's simplicity. It does not accurately reflect our nation at all. Let me ask, do you believe that these 50% of people don't contribute to society, don't work? Don't do their part as much as you do?

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@okie,

I find that funny okie.

Last year income taxes made up only 43% of the Federal revenues.

So.. the top 1% makes 19% of the income but only paid
15.9% of the total taxes in income tax.

Your chart certainly is misleading if not outright dishonest in it's argument.

1 Reply

Quote:

Obama Biography:
Birthplace: Location remains questionable.
Proof of United States Citizenship hasn't been provided.
Education: Columbia University , Harvard Law School. Records never produced, attendance remains questionable.
Military Career: None
Business Career: None
Political Career: Community organizer, Chicago, 1983-86; civil rights attorney, Chicago, 1991-96;
University of Chicago, lecturer, early 1990s-2004; Illinois State Senator, 1996-2005; U.S. Senator, 2005-2008; President 2008-.

1 Reply

@ican711nm,

Bush .alcoholic.... military career, refused to serve in Vietnam. Education , none existent. proof of citizenship, his ignorance...political career, his daddies piggy..back..

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@mysteryman,

Don't ever think of misquoting me and don't ever write to me with a pseudo-sophisticated leading sentence like that.

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

mysteryman wrote:

You like to make that sort of claim, so lets see you back it up.

Don't hold your breath for pom to ever back up anything that she claims. I have yet to see her support any of her arguments toward me in any credible fashion whatsoever.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

I said that the wealthy now own a larger percentage of the overall wealth in America then in the past, and this leads them to pay more taxes - even though their rates of taxation are lower than they used to be.Cycloptichorn

So you finally admit your claims were dead wrong. And do you have enough honesty then to also admit that if the rich are paying more and more of the taxes, then it would therefore be impossible that paying taxes has everything to do with causing a supposed larger gap between the rich and the poor? In other words, if your argument is that the rich are not paying enough taxes, but the reality of it is that they are paying more of the taxes already without it fixing the perceived problem, it is therefore illogical to conclude that paying yet more of the taxes would narrow the gap between the rich and the poor. It is totally logical that something else is going on to cause the effect that you think is going on. I think it is more likely the case of things like manufacturing being driven offshore, and therefore we must examine the policies that have caused that. I have posted before, and I would post again if you cared, what policies those are, which are mostly grounded in liberalism and Democratic Party policies. But then again I doubt you are interested in the truth, cyclops?

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@okie,

Quote:

Don't hold your breath for pom to ever back up anything that she claims. I have yet to see her support any of her arguments toward me in any credible fashion whatsoever.

Come on, okie, the only back up you would accept from me would be for me to lie! If I were to become a whore for the right, you would believe me. As long as I am true to myself and my ethics, as long as I use the education I spent many years acquiring and the information gained from books, journals, NPR and PBS, you will accuse me of not backing up what I say.

You dismiss history, economics, political philosophy, the English language, statistics, sociology and logic.

What you accept is your own version of the world.

You never talk about a books, film, music, theatre. You only post on political threads where most people tell you that factually you are wrong.

1 Reply

@okie,

Please, get some tutoring in reading.

How can you isolate and cut and paste a piece of writing from another . . . so that the referred writing accompanies your own response . . .then say the quoted individual says the opposite of what he actually wrote???!!! Rolling Eyes

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