Cycloptichorn
 
  3  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 01:33 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

MontereyJack wrote:

If Republicans understand job creation, why do ALL Republican presidents since Herbert Hoover rank below ANY Democratic president in job creation?


A fantastic claim in that it includes the current presidency and that of Jimmy Carter. Perhaps you would like to provide some credible data to back it up.


Well according to Bizjournals, who reviewed the annual employment-growth rates for all 11 postwar presidents, the data reveals :

Job Growth
1. Lyndon Johnson (1963-69), 3.74%
2. Jimmy Carter (1977-81), 3.11%
3. Bill Clinton (1993-2001), 2.42%
4. Harry Truman (1945-53), 2.38%
5. Richard Nixon (1969-74), 2.30%
6. John Kennedy (1961-63), 2.28%
7. Ronald Reagan (1981-89), 2.04%
8. Gerald Ford (1974-77), 0.95%
9. Dwight Eisenhower (1953-61), 0.87%
10. George H.W. Bush (1989-93), 0.59%
11. George W. Bush (2001-09), 0.28%

Bizjournals also looked at five subsets of job growth, with the younger President Bush finishing last in four of those categories – private-sector, manufacturing, retail-trade and government employment. The exception was construction employment, where Bush ranked ninth with an annual growth rate of 0.08 percent. The nation suffered losses of construction jobs under two presidents: Gerald Ford (down 3.75 percent per year between 1974 and 1977) and George H.W. Bush (down 3.22 percent per year).

Jimmy Carter's job rate makes GWB look like a joke.

Cycloptichorn
MontereyJack
 
  3  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 01:38 pm
ican, thank you for providing another statistic that shows that Obamanomics is in fact working and is turning around the economy that conservative economics came so close to letting self-destruct. Very nice of you to show that employment, widely known to be a trailing indicator, the last to bottom out in a recession and the last to rise again, has in fact been rising since last December, which confirms all the other indicators which show that the economy is recovering under President Obama.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  2  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 01:42 pm
Georgeob, Obama has had a year (and you will notice employment is going up, as the statitstics ican so thoughtfully provided, show). The job creation statistic is over the course of their time in office, so check back in seven years, and it's pretty clear Obama will fall in with all the other Democratic presidents' achievements, and Republican presidents' lack thereof.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 01:45 pm
So once Obama creates all of those jobs in government, who is going to support the whole mess? Wasn't everyone working for the government in the Soviet Union as well, while the whole thing eventually collapsed? And wasn't everyone working for the North Korean government while millions were starving? And is everyone working in Cuba as well, while everyone is living in "opulence?"
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  2  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 01:49 pm
Someone, okie, actually I think it was you, recently showed a graph of the growth of jobs in government since 1960. The feds essentially didn't grow at all. State governments (the darling of conservatives, right? states' rights and all that?) about tripled in that time. If you want to blame someone, blame you local governor, not Obama.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 01:55 pm
@MontereyJack,
Quote:
The feds essentially didn't grow at all.
that is deceptive, because the federal government has grown a great deal, in both size and mission, but ever since Reagan the growth has been handled by outsourcing. For instance a huge chunk of the defense department is now contracted out.
ican711nm
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:01 pm
Quote:
Obama’s Immigration Chief Orders Release of ALL Violent Criminal Illegal Aliens; ICE Agents: “We’ve Lost America”
By Debbie Schlussel

Recently, you may have read reports that Barack Obama’s Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) chief, John “Moron” Morton, said he may not accept illegal aliens detained under Arizona’s immigration law. But it gets worse. Far, far worse. Moron ordered ICE agents to FREE violent criminal illegal aliens until they are convicted at trial . . . a trial to which they will never show up (because they were set free to disappear). To that end, he’s dropped all reference to the word “detention” in an ICE reorganization.


... Obama Immigration Chief John Morton Says
Set Violent Criminal Illegal Aliens Free on the Streets

Many agents within ICE tell me they are extremely demoralized because, until recently, Morton has instructed them not to detain and lock up illegal aliens unless they have a criminal record. But, now, Morton told agents that even illegal aliens who are accused of serious crimes, like rape and murder, must be set free . . . until they are convicted. Think these illegal aliens charged with serious crimes will show up for trial, once they’ve been set free? Think again. This policy is clearly by design, and it comes straight from the Obama White House, the agents tell me.


Moreover, many ICE agents sent me a memo (posted later on in this entry) which Morton sent out, reorganizing ICE and changing the name of ICE’s Detention and Removal Operation to “Enforcement and Removal Operations.” In other words, no more detention. Almost all references to the word “detention” are gone. Just more catch and release of illegal aliens. So, what’s the point of having the I in ICE? I’m not sure, and frustrated agents aren’t either.


In May, ... Morton made a visit to the Chicago ICE office. His statements and behavior dismayed ICE agents to the point that several of them told me “we have lost this country.”

Here is one account] which mirrors what I’ve heard from so many other agents within the floundering agency:

Morton showed up with his posse to visit our sanctuary city. They appeared at the Chicago DRO [Detention and Removal Operations] Office inquiring about the Secure Community initiative. One ass-kissing ICE lawyer who was part of Moron’s entourage told the agents they were “NOT” to lodge ICE detainers on [arrest and detain] illegal aliens despite the crime UNTIL they were actually convicted.

Can you imagine this? An illegal alien commits a rape, and instead of placing an ICE hold on this alien, while commencing the deportation process, this illegal alien is allowed out and released on bond posted. Do you think he’ll ever come back and show for his appearance? Ha! He will NEVER be seen again.

The agents were shocked. They–ICE chief Morton’s people–stated this is coming directly from Obama. Do you think they showed up in Chicago for nothing…his home town? The agents were all too shocked and scared of reprisal. So no one said a thing. There were many people present who witnessed the whole thing. They–the agents–felt intimidated [by Morton] and his staff and were worried for their careers if they asked questions. But they were “instructed’ not to detain/lodge ICE detainers on illegal aliens, regardless of the violent and serious nature of the crime until they are convicted. This is ridiculous.

Debbie, I have [been] playing this illegal game now for many years–decades. It is IMPOSSIBLE to track aliens and monitor them for criminal convictions, once we release them out into the public. My case load is HUNDREDS of illegal aliens. HUNDREDS. How in the world can I wait for a conviction, when it is so much easier (not to mention they are tracked in detention) to lodge an immediate detainer upon arrest of the illegal aline.

This is being done by Obama so this country is brought down and America is turned into a Third World country, saturated with illegals. America will be Mexico #2 soon, if we do not reverse the flood of illegals. There is no question that Barack Obama wants to bring this country down.

We have lost America, Debbie.

Here are the appropriate parts of the memo:
From: ICE-Broadcast
Sent: Wed Jun 09 15:00:20 2010
Subject: A Message from Assistant Secretary Morton to all ICE employees
June 9, 2010
Internal Realignment of ICE Offices

When I arrived last year as the Assistant Secretary, one of my priorities was to improve the management structure of ICE and to give the agency a clearer sense of identity and focus. Of particular concern to me was that the agency’s core operational and management functions were divided among many different offices without a clear reporting structure.

After thoroughly reviewing our agency’s leadership and reporting structure, I have determined that ICE will be able to better fulfill its mission if its offices are aligned around its two core operational responsibilities–criminal investigation and civil immigration enforcement supported by a robust management program. Therefore, I am pleased to announce that ICE will now operate through three new directorates—Homeland Security Investigations (HSI), Enforcement and Removal Operations (ERO), and Management and Administration. A revised organizational chart is attached. . . .

Enforcement and Removal Operations (ERO): ERO will align the existing offices in ICE that are primarily devoted to civil immigration enforcement, namely the Office of Detention and Removal Operations and the Secure Communities program. This directorate will ensure a coherent and consistent approach to civil immigration enforcement in a manner that prioritizes convicted criminals, fugitives and illegal re-entrants, and recent border violators. The directorate will also oversee the agency’s detention system, removal flight operations, and efforts to locate aliens subject to criminal prosecution for illegal re-entry. James Chaparro will serve as ERO Executive Associate Director.



Um, how can you have “secure communities” or any “coherent and consistent approach” if you don’t detain illegal aliens–especially VIOLENT CRIMINAL illegal aliens–when you catch them and merely release them to roam free in the great American abyss? Helloooo . . . .?

I was extremely critical of ICE under incompetent Bush appointee Julie L. Myers a/k/a “The ICE Princess.” But while things were incredibly bad under her, um, “leadership,” they’re even worse now under Obama’s Morton, who spends much of his time taking advantage of government paid chauffeurs and bodyguards and spending your tax money feting open anti-Semites. Not only did he keep the most incompetent and unworthy Republican/Bush/Myers people on, but he added many more incompetents who are even worse.
Say good-bye to America as we know it. The inmates–the illegal aliens–are running the asylum. And their leader is John Morton, brought to you by Barack Obama.

Attention, Illegal Aliens: this is your time to invade America and roam free. Your time to wreak havoc on our nation.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:01 pm
@hawkeye10,
Right on, hawkeye, I have recently seen examples of the Forest Service being too lazy to manage their own campgrounds. They sit in an office, push paper, and look important, while they hire people to manage the campgrounds, pick up the trash, and all of that.

And nobody is going to convince me that Obamacare for example, is not going to increase federal involvement and costs, exponentially.
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:21 pm
FLASH! Senator Robert Byrd (D-West Virginia) is in critical condition at an undisclosed hospital. His staff describes his condition as grave.
Byrd, 92, has served in the Senate longer than anyone in our history.
His incapacitation - or death - could affect the Democrat agenda since they control the Senate by only a slim margin.
Byrd was reelected in 2006 so has 2 years left in his term. I believe that the current governor of WVA is a Dem. I may be wrong about that. He would, I think, get to appoint someone to fill the seat.
Back to the regularly scheduled hurling of insults.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  -1  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:23 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:
11. George W. Bush (2001-09), 0.28%

Your post, Cycloptichorn, is FALSE!

Quote:

ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/suppl/empsit.cpseea1.txt
2001………………..............136,933,000 [BUSH43 2001 TO 2009]

2007...........................146,047,000

2008:
August........................ 145,273,000
September.................... 145,029,000
October....................... 144,650,007
November................... 144,144,000
December.................... 143,338,000

2009:
January.................... 142,221 ,000


100% x ( (142,221,000 / 136,933,000 ) - 1) = 3.86%

NOT 0.28%

0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  2  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:32 pm
DO TRY TO READ A LITTLE MORE CAREFULLY ICAN, THE STATISTIC IS ANNUAL GROWTH RATE, WHICH EQUALIZES FOR LENGTH OF TIME IN OFFICE, AND BUSH'S RECORD SUCKS
ican711nm
 
  -1  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:41 pm
@MontereyJack,
GEORGE BUSH'S TIME IN OFFICE = 8 YEARS.

A 3.86% INCREASE IN JOBS OVER THOSE 8 YEARS AVERAGES AN

ANNUAL GROWTH RATE = 3.86% / 8 = 0.4825%;

NOT 0.28%!
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  3  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:52 pm
AND, I MIGHT ADD, ICAN, I WENT TO YOURSOURCE FOR NUMBERS, AND JAN, 2001, HAD 136,891 MILLION EMPLOYED, WHILE JAN. 2009, BUSH'S LAST MONTH HAD 139,877,000 , RATHER THAN THE INFLATED NUMBER YOU USE, WHICH DOESN'T SEEM TO MATCH ANYTHING IN THE DATA YOU USE, AND THE DATA ACTUALLY IN YOUR CITE WORK OUT TO, GUESS WHAT, 0.28% ANNUAL GROWTH FOR GEORGE BUSH
MontereyJack
 
  3  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 02:54 pm
And even if it were o.48% which it is not, that would STILL put him at the bottom of the heap.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 03:04 pm
@MontereyJack,
Quote:
Without a public debate or formal policy decision, contractors have become a virtual fourth branch of government. On the rise for decades, spending on federal contracts has soared during the Bush administration, to about $400 billion last year from $207 billion in 2000, fueled by the war in Iraq, domestic security and Hurricane Katrina, but also by a philosophy that encourages outsourcing almost everything government does.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/04/world/americas/04iht-web.0204contract.4460796.html?_r=1
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 03:13 pm
@MontereyJack,
RIGHT YOU ARE, MONTEREY JACK!

The current total job number stated for 2009 = 139,877,000 It is is a revision of the total job number I used for 2009 January = 142,221 ,000.

Yes, I should have checked first.

I apologize for my failure to check first.

ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/suppl/empsit.cpseea1.txt

The current total job number for 2010 May =139,420,000. That's close to to the total job number stated for 2009 = 139,877,000.
ican711nm
 
  0  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 03:36 pm
@ican711nm,
By the way, the current total job numbers Iquoted are total CIVILIAN job numbers--they do not include government jobs.
ican711nm
 
  -1  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 04:11 pm
@ican711nm,
ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/suppl/empsit.cpseea1.txt

Total Civilian Jobs under Bush peaked for 2007 at 146,047,000. By 2008 that total had decreased to 145,362,000. Then it decreased further in 2009 t0 139,877,000.

However, Bush was president in 2009 only in January. The bulk of the 2009 decrease actually occurred February 2009 to December 2009, while Obama has been president.

So it's fair to assume that Bush's decrease was from 146,047,000 in 2007 to 145,362,000 in 2008.

Therefore, total civilian jobs increased under Bush from 136,933,000 in 2001 to 145,362,000 in 2008. That's a total increase over that period of (145,362,000 - 136,933,000) = 8,429,000. BUT that constitutes a 100% x 8,429,000 / 136,933,000 = a 6.16% increase over 8 years. That is a 0.769% average annual increase.

We'll just have to wait and see how the total of civilian jobs changes over Obama's term of office. So far that total has decreased since the beginning of 2009.
parados
 
  2  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 05:10 pm
@ican711nm,
Leave it to ican to misuse numbers

Read the note on the numbers you are using ican.

Quote:
1 Not strictly comparable with prior years. For an explanation, see "Historical Comparability" under the Household Data section
of the Explanatory Notes and Estimates of Error at http://www.bls.gov/cps/eetech_methods.pdf.

ican711nm
 
  -1  
Sun 27 Jun, 2010 06:26 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:
Read the note on the numbers you are using ican.

Quote:
1 Not strictly comparable with prior years. For an explanation, see "Historical Comparability" under the Household Data section
of the Explanatory Notes and Estimates of Error at http://www.bls.gov/cps/eetech_methods.pdf.

The link you provided cannot be found.
http://www.bls.gov/cps/eetech_methods.pdf.

What is the nature of the incomparability (i.e., "Not strictly comparable") of the years 2001, 2007, 2008, 2009, and 2010, and how does that affect the validity of my conclusions?
Quote:

ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/suppl/empsit.cpseea1.txt
2000 (1).................... 136,891
2001........................ 136,933
2002........................ 136,485
2003 (1).................... 137,736
2004 (1).................... 139,252
2005 (1).................... 141,730
2006 (1).................... 144,427
2007 (1).................... 146,047
2008 (1).................... 145,362
2009 (1).................... 139,877

 

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