joefromchicago
 
  6  
Tue 4 May, 2010 08:02 am
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:
I thought that Obama and the dems said they would cooperate, and that they wouldnt try to hide things.

After all, they demonized Bush when he refused to cooperate with Congress.
Now it seems that they are doing the same thing.

So much for "change" in DC.


mysteryman wrote:
But the same people that are now saying its ok are the same ones that slammed Bush for doing the exact same thing.

I just find it interesting that its ok for the dems to do it but not the repubs.

This has recently been your MO, MM -- saying "the dems always said that they would do X, but now they're doing Y" -- and frankly it's getting a little tiresome. Now, if you had any actual proof that "the dems always said that they would do X," that would be different. But you never do. You never provide any links, you never back up your claims. So instead of identifying Democratic hypocrisy, you're merely setting up Democratic strawmen. Unlike other conservatives on this site, you're actually capable of rational thought. You can do better than this.
0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  4  
Tue 4 May, 2010 08:14 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:



It is not wrong to distrust government. It is not wrong to fear government. In certain cases it is not even wrong to despise government when it assaults liberty. Government is force. Government is the ONLY entity in our society that can use force to accomplish its goals. Whenever in your life you encounter a person or an entity that is legally empowered to use force to accomplish virtually any goal it sets for itself .. be afraid, and resolve to defend yourself when necessary.


Unless you are a liberal/Democrat questioning and defending yourself against a conservative/Republican empowered flavor of the government. Then, you must love it or leave it and be labeled an unpatriotic, deviant, traitor, etc.

Surely you remember the mantra of President Bush that you, yourself frequently parroted here on these boards:

H2O MAN
 
  -2  
Tue 4 May, 2010 10:21 am
@Butrflynet,
Do you honestly think Bush was directing his comment at liberal democrats?

The Us he is uniting against Muslim extremists and radical jihadists is ALL of Us Americans and our allies.
ican711nm
 
  -1  
Tue 4 May, 2010 10:39 am
Here is more evidence that the Odem (i.e., Obamademocrats) are lying thieving gangsters working to reduce our Liberty, our Constitutional Government, and our Capitalist Economy. We shall lawfully remove the Odem from our federal government.
Quote:

Despite all the limited government rhetoric you're hearing from the Republican Party these days, it appears that Senate Republican leaders, including Richard Shelby, are more than ready and willing to work with Chris Dodd to empower the Fed, add more layers of federal bureaucracy to our economy, and set the stage for future crises.

According to Talking Points Memo, Shelby has stated, "We're very close to a deal and there will be a substantial number of Republicans that go along with it."

The White House is doing everything it can in the media to cram yet another powergrab down the American people's throats. A vote could come at any time, so it's crucial that liberty activists make their voices heard immediately.

...

Chris Dodd's legislation, which should be called the "Fed Empowerment Act," ignores the true cause of the recent financial downturn: interference in our economy and manipulation of our currency by Congress, the Treasury, and the Federal Reserve.

For all the talk of "change" in D.C., our elected officials are following the same tired old script: if the federal government created the problem, the only solution must be to give it even more power.

Now Senate leaders want to create a new Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, which will be housed in and funded by the Fed.

And the Dodd bill would create a "Financial Stability Oversight Council" that would have the ability to require nonbank financial companies to be under the Federal Reserve's supervision based not on their current status, but on what effect they may potentially have on the economy!

Who knows how many businesses will soon be targeted and broken up, under the guise of "reform," solely for standing up to the federal government.

Recently, Washington Examiner journalist Tim Carney has done some terrific work exposing the corporatism behind the White House's rhetoric.

To see how Obama's "reform" plan will actually benefit the big banks and Wall Street firms, especially Goldman Sachs, at the expense of smaller companies and the rest of us, click here to read his piece entitled "Goldman rallies for Obama in Wall Street 'reform'."

Don't let Chris Dodd strengthen the federal government and further entangle the Federal Reserve in our economy without a fight.

Remind your elected officials that any serious effort at true financial reform should start with thoroughly auditing the Federal Reserve.

...

The American people have already suffered too much because of Washington's previous interference in our economy.

Together, let's take a stand for freedom and true reform by opposing the Dodd Fed Empowerment Act and pushing for a long overdue standalone vote on Audit the Fed.

In Liberty,

John Tate
President, Campaign for Liberty
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Tue 4 May, 2010 10:43 am
@ican711nm,
Quote:

Chris Dodd's legislation, which should be called the "Fed Empowerment Act," ignores the true cause of the recent financial downturn: interference in our economy and manipulation of our currency by Congress, the Treasury, and the Federal Reserve.


This is not the true cause of our financial downturn. The true cause was bad bets made by private individuals in the name of greed and profits, and a failure to regulate those bets by the Bush WH.

Your correspondent, like you, knows little to nothing about what lead to the financial downturn.

Cycloptichorn
mysteryman
 
  0  
Tue 4 May, 2010 10:48 am
@Cycloptichorn,
It was more then just the Bush WH that screwed up.
You cannot lay the blame solely on Bush alone, the problem existed before he took office.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Tue 4 May, 2010 10:53 am
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

It was more then just the Bush WH that screwed up.


I know it was. It was them, and also the other group I listed:

Quote:
bad bets made by private individuals in the name of greed and profits


... a point which I never see any right-winger admit, ever. That private industry, the Free Market and Greed are what lead to the collapse.

Quote:
You cannot lay the blame solely on Bush alone, the problem existed before he took office.


You will note that I did not blame him alone. However, it is fair to say that the crisis could have easily been avoided, even with the housing market run-up, if the Bush WH and SEC had decided to regulate the Credit Default Swap market. They consciously chose not to, and the result was a massive collapse.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  -2  
Tue 4 May, 2010 12:44 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
You again demonstrate that you know nothing about what lead to the financial down turn. CRA, Fannie & Freddie were together the first cause of the financial downturn. Bush was unsuccessful in his many attempts to get the 2006-to-present Democrat majorities to fix them. Obama does not have that excuse for not trying to get his 2006-to-present Democrat majorities to fix them. What is Obama's excuse? Answer! Obama has no excuse other than a desire for the financial downturn to continue and/or his stupidity.

Quote:

2006
...
*11/07"Democrats win majorities in both houses of Congress. The U.S. economy is growing at about 3 percent, unemployment is at 4.5 percent, and inflation under 2 percent.

2007
*06/23"Two Bear Sterns hedge fund groups collapse due to their mortgage investments.
*08/09" President Bush requests Congress pass a reform package for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
*12/06" President Bush warns Congress of need to pass legislation reforming GSEs (i.e., Government Sponsored Enterprises) .

2008
*03/14"J.P. Morgan and the Federal Reserve recognize extent of Bear’s toxic assets, including sub-prime mortgages, and credit default swaps, and interconnection with other banks.
*03/14"At Economic Club of New York, President Bush requests Congress take action and reform Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
*04/14"President Bush issues a plea to Congress to pass legislation reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
*05/03"President Bush issues a plea to Congress to pass legislation reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
*05/19"President Bush issues a plea to Congress to pass legislation reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
*05/31"President Bush issues a plea to Congress to pass legislation reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
*06/06"President Bush issues a plea to Congress to pass legislation reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
...
2009
*02/10"Treasury Secretary Tim Geitner unveils the Administration’s $2 trillion TARP II plan, and the Dow drops 382 points, or 4.6 percent
*02/17"President Obama signs a $787 billion bailout bill.
*02/18" President Obama reveals his mortgage bailout plan.
*02/19"Rick Santelli says in an impromptu speech on the floor of the Chicago Mercantile Exchange: "The government is promoting bad behavior … How many of you people want to pay for your neighbor’s mortgage? President Obama are you listening?" Santelli calls for a "Chicago Tea Party."
*02/20"The market falls as Chris Dodd, chairman of the Senate Banking Committee floats the idea of nationalizing the nation’s banks. The White House issues a denial, and the Dow ends down 100 points. The Dow is down now more than 800 points"nearly 10 percent"from the day before President Obama’s inauguration.
*02/21"Soros says, "The financial crisis marks end of a free-market model."
Cycloptichorn
 
  3  
Tue 4 May, 2010 12:46 pm
@ican711nm,
Quote:
CRA, Fannie & Freddie were together the first cause of the financial downturn


No, no, no, no, no. A million times no. You are 100% wrong, and you don't even know how to adequately explain your own logical holes.

You referring to Obama as stupid is one of the funniest things I've ever seen. The man makes you look like a child, Ican. You show no sophisticated understanding of any issue here on A2K, which is the exact opposite of him. This is why he's been kicking your party's ass for the last year and a half.

Cycloptichorn
plainoldme
 
  0  
Tue 4 May, 2010 12:47 pm
@H2O MAN,
He is clear, logical, possesses style. Diest is the voice of reason. Reason in one of the things I admire most, along with self-control and intellect.
0 Replies
 
plainoldme
 
  0  
Tue 4 May, 2010 12:49 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
No needs to make ican look like a child.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  3  
Tue 4 May, 2010 12:49 pm
Do we really need to point out to you, ican, that Obamanomics worked. The economy is growing, the Dow is surging, the major financial institutions did not fail and are growing again, credit is not frozen. A second depresssion did not happen. Even the Great Recession was halted in its tracks. Even Business Week admits it. Obama was right. You lot were completely wrong. The economy proves it.
Advocate
 
  2  
Tue 4 May, 2010 01:09 pm
@H2O MAN,
It is interesting that Bush turned out to be much more dangerous and effective, in a negative sense, than any Muslim. Bush destroyed our economy and nearly ruined the country. I am not sure we will ever recover from him.
Advocate
 
  1  
Tue 4 May, 2010 01:11 pm
@ican711nm,
Why do you keep lying? The Dems won only the House in 11/07, and lost the Senate.
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  -2  
Tue 4 May, 2010 01:11 pm
@MontereyJack,
Obamanomics is not working and it will never work.

For the most part liberal democrats are responsible for the lousy economy and terrible job market.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  0  
Tue 4 May, 2010 02:14 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:

It is interesting that Bush turned out to be much more dangerous and effective, in a negative sense, than any Muslim. Bush destroyed our economy and nearly ruined the country. I am not sure we will ever recover from him.

Total garbage, and I think people would love to have Bush back right now, and before this term is over, people would be dancing in the streets if they could have Bush back.
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Tue 4 May, 2010 02:19 pm
@okie,
http://billstclair.com/blog/images/george-bush-miss-me-yet.jpg
Diest TKO
 
  4  
Tue 4 May, 2010 02:21 pm
@okie,
Dancing... in... the... streets..?

You're weird.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
Gargamel
 
  4  
Tue 4 May, 2010 02:37 pm
@H2O MAN,
As fond as our nation is of instant nostalgia, NOBODY misses that retard. Nobody. In spite of the week-long spell of revisionist sentimentality that followed Nixon's death, we still remember him as Greatest American Fascist Bitch. George is the only threat to his throne. Sorry.

Just because you find a graphic you think is clever doesn't make the message therein true. In fact, it makes it complete bullshit. 100% of the time. No outliers.
okie
 
  -3  
Tue 4 May, 2010 03:15 pm
Ultra leftist hatred on display here, folks. The Left is motivated by emotion, including hatred of what is moral and right.
 

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