hawkeye10
 
  0  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 07:02 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
oooh oooh oooh - and who grew the U. S. federal civil service enormously?

I see bonus points for the Democrats on this one.


the majority of civil servants are not federal, they are state and local, so your idea of a partisan advantage to this problem are by and large ill founded. Besides, how many democrats have you heard sounding the alarm about unaffordable entitlements due current and past employees?
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  0  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 07:03 pm
TOTAL JOBS SOMETIMES DECREASE WITH GROWING POPULATION
Quote:

ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/suppl/empsit.cpseea1.txt
Year................USA Civil Population......USA Total Civil Employed
1981...................... 170,130,000………….....100,397,000
1982..................... 172,271,000.................99,526,000
1983..................... 174,215,000...............100,834,000
...
1990..................... 189,164,000...............118,793,000
1991..................... 190,925,000...............117,718,000
1992..................... 192,805,000…….….......118,492,000
...
2001..................... 215,092,000………………136,933,000
2002...................... 217,570,000...............136,485,000
2003..................... 221,168,000...............137,730,006
...
2007..................... 231,867,000...............146,047,000
2008..................... 233,788,000...............145,362,000
2009..................... 235,810,000...............139,959,000


2008:

October....................... 234,612,000…….....144,650,007
November................... 234,828,000..........144,144,000
December.................... 235,035,000.........143,338,000

2009:

January...................... 234,739,000...........142,099,000
February.................... 234,913,000...........141,748,000
March........................ 235,086,000……......140,887,000
April.......................... 235,271,000............141,007,000
May........................... 235,452,000...........140,570,000
June........................... 235,655,000...........140,196,000
July............................ 235,870,000...........140,041,000
August....................... 236,087,000...........139,649,000
September................. 236,322,000..........138,864,000
October..................... 236,550,000...........138,275,000
November ................ 236, 775,000…….……138,381,000
December ................. 237,005,000….…...…137,792,000

0 Replies
 
okie
 
  -1  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 09:47 pm
@maporsche,
maporsche wrote:

georgeob1 wrote:

In my view the most ominous issue ahead for Democrats is going to be public resentment for the growing cadre of better paid public employees (nearly all members of various gov't employee unions) and the increasing taxation from states and counties required to support them during economic hard times. This has the potential to become an issue that underlies all others, and reduces the public appetite for government programs of all kinds.


Here, here, George!!!!

I, for one am upset about this, and of all the private sector people I know who are fighting for their jobs and their benefits every day, there is growing discontent.

maporsche, I posted this in response to George's observation. I think this is a huge point, that is being ignored in this country. I will repaste the pertinent part, which is an article in the WSJ by a Daniel Henninger.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704320104575015010515688120.html

"The central battle in our time is over political primacy. It is a competition between the public sector and the private sector over who defines the work and the institutions that make a nation thrive and grow.
In 1962, President John F. Kennedy planted the seeds that grew the modern Democratic Party. That year, JFK signed executive order 10988 allowing the unionization of the federal work force. This changed everything in the American political system. Kennedy's order swung open the door for the inexorable rise of a unionized public work force in many states and cities.

This in turn led to the fantastic growth in membership of the public employee unions"The American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME), the Service Employees International Union (SEIU) and the teachers' National Education Association.

They broke the public's bank. More than that, they entrenched a system of taking money from members' dues and spending it on political campaigns. Over time, this transformed the Democratic Party into a public-sector dependency."
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 10:52 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

Do you think your hero was effective in his avowed purpose of persuading them to cooperate??

Isn't it odd that with the largest majorities in both houses of Congress enjoyed by any president or Administration (of either party) in many decades, that our debater-in-chief has been so uniquely ineffective in pursuing his legislative agenda?

It can't be his fault or that of the legislative leaders of his party. it must be the opposition, ... or perhaps the public. Maybe he needs a new opposition or a new public.


It is not O's fault that the Reps march in a mindless lockstep, the country be damned. The Dems have a good majority in congress, but just miss the required super majority. I still have to wonder how you and the other Reps sleep at night knowing that 40-50,000 die every year due to lack of health coverage.

I have to admit that the Reps did a great job in misleading the public. Just look at the poor deluded tea partyites who parrot the lies and distortions fed them by their Rep leaders, such as Dick Armey.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 11:04 pm
@hawkeye10,
So, you have no problem with deferred income?
georgeob1
 
  1  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 11:08 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:


It is not O's fault that the Reps march in a mindless lockstep, the country be damned. The Dems have a good majority in congress, but just miss the required super majority. I still have to wonder how you and the other Reps sleep at night knowing that 40-50,000 die every year due to lack of health coverage.

I have to admit that the Reps did a great job in misleading the public. Just look at the poor deluded tea partyites who parrot the lies and distortions fed them by their Rep leaders, such as Dick Armey.


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

Poor Dems, being led around by the nose by that nasty minority of 40 Reps in the Senate. Worse for them, even with the worlds greatest orator at their helm, they find their public image confounded by those even more nasty deluded and primitive teabaggers ! The public is so stupid as to be dissuaded from the revealed (if terminally vague) wisdom of their sainted leader by this small band of primitive Rep thugs.

Clearly the Dems need and deserve a new and better public. The present one has failed them badly. It even elected a Rep Senator in the (heretofore) sacred territory of Massachusetts, and to fill the seat so long heated by Teddy Kennedy's fat (but holy) ass! The present public no longer deserves the benefit of being told what is good for it by these always wise Dems.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 11:25 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:
So, you have no problem with deferred income?


I have no problem with the concept of deferred income. I do have a problem with government keeping employees happy with ever increasing promises of deferred income in lew of current pay increases, but then never being honest with the citizens about how much the bill will be years down the line. The project has worked to keep the peace for now, the employees thinking that they will get a boatload of money eventually, the citizens not having a clue of the tab, and the government officials seemingly doing clinton style "compartmentalizing"...ie not dealing with the problem.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Fri 29 Jan, 2010 11:58 pm
@georgeob1,
Your irony is quite boring. I am afraid you lack the wit and smarts to pull off and good piece of irony.

georgeob1
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 12:19 am
@Advocate,
There was no intention of irony there.

You confuse rather blatant mockery with irony.
Advocate
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 10:16 am
@georgeob1,
It was mockery cast in the form of boring irony.
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  2  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 11:35 am
Good afternoon.
The Rasmussen Presidential approval poll came out this morning. It is potentially interesting, if you believe in polls.
28% Strongly Approve of Mr Obama's performance vs 40% who strongly disapprove. That yields an index of (28-40) -12. Friday the index was -17. That is quite a dramatic change.
Rasmussen uses a 3-day rolling average methodology. So there is still one day's worth of polling following the State of the Union speech that will show up in Sunday's Index.
The bounce is, according to Rasmussen, totally attributable to Dems. Repubs and Indies didn't move. The positive for Mr Obama is that Dems may be getting over the Mass Senate loss.

Overall, 49% approve of Mr Obama. 51% disapprove.
ican711nm
 
  -1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 12:45 pm
@georgeob1,
George, your "blatant mockery" was nice enough not to include that the Dems are crippled by the opinions of a small nose-led Republican minority.

Had you not been nice enough,that would have been "blatant mockery" and horrendous ridicule!

Advocate, count your blessings!
Advocate
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 02:12 pm
@ican711nm,
Hey, bring it on! The nonsensical stuff from the doesn't faze me. After all, you guys are led by the nose by the likes of Palin, Hannity, and Limbaugh.
ican711nm
 
  -1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 03:29 pm
@Advocate,
Yeah! And you're led by your nose by people who call themselves the Democrat majority, and you appear to believe people who call themselves the Republican minority are led by their noses and are leading the Democrat majority by their noses. That must make you feel real proud of your nose's ability to follow the forces concentrated on it while coping with f = ma, e = mc^2, c = d/t, and a = c/t!

John Kennedy: "Every dollar released from taxation that is spent or invested will help create a new job and a new salary."

Scott Brown: "That’s what we need now, across the board tax cuts. A payroll tax cut would have been better than any government stimulus. "

Ican: "Reducing the tax rate on the wealthy allows the wealthy to invest or spend more of their money. When the wealthy spend or invest more of their money, they make all of us who pay taxes more wealthy by providing us more opportunities to earn more, and provide the government more income (i.e., receipts)."

Reagan in 1982 cut Carter's maximum income tax rate from 70% to 50% and then to 38.5% and then to 33%, and the fed's receipts increased every year except 1983. Since Reagan, the maximum tax rate has remained below 40%. Since 1982, total jobs grew from less than annual average of 100 million to more than an annual average of 145 million in 2008. In 2009, jobs decreased to an annual average below 140 million because of excessive government borrowing from the private sector. Since 1987 to the present the maximum tax rate has remained below 40%, BUT federal tax receipts have increased annually since 1987 to the present"except for the years 2001 to 2004. Furthermore, GDP has increased annually up to and including 2008.

What does your nose lead you to believe happened to GDP in 2009? What does your nose lead you to believe will happen to GDP as long as Obama is in charge?
georgeob1
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 04:35 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:

Hey, bring it on! The nonsensical stuff from the doesn't faze me. After all, you guys are led by the nose by the likes of Palin, Hannity, and Limbaugh.


It is abundantly clear from his persistent, repeated defensive responses that Advocate is uterly unfazed and unaffected by all this!!! Laughing Laughing

With each response he stoops lower. And, in Advocate's case, it appears that there is no level to which he will not stoop.
okie
 
  -1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 04:45 pm
@realjohnboy,
rjb, that poll has been bouncing around between about -10 and -19 for the last few weeks, so it doesn't seem out of the ordinary, in fact the 40% strongly disapprove is not any better than almost the low point. I think the strongly approve has been as low as 23%, but sure his supporters are going to be temporarily encouraged a bit by his campaign like pep talk, while his detractors are not impressed at all, in fact they view it as more of the same ole same ole vintage Obama of uh er uh and on and on. What it will all come down to is whether the economy actually improves, and how much, and what happens in Afghanistan. Also, there is more and more opposition to his decisions, such as the decision to try the terrorist in New York, that idea went over like a lead balloon, and I think many of his ideas will continue to suffer with the test of time and results. That had to be one of the dumbest ideas ever, and I think everyone knows it.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  0  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 04:56 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:
in Advocate's case, it appears that there is no level to which he will not stoop.
Come on george, show Advocate some compassion. After all, his behavior is caused by his devotion to seductive, repeatedly failed ideas, and by George Bush, the Republican minority, and Obama who is out to lunch. If we had all that tugging on our noses, we too would be persistently, repeating defensive, stooping responses.

Well, on 2nd thought, probably we'd just blow our noses!
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 07:00 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
With each response he stoops lower. And, in Advocate's case, it appears that there is no level to which he will not stoop.
yeah, in case you haven't noticed georgeob, there's a number of posters, on both sides of the aisle here who do that.
georgeob1
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 10:52 pm
@dyslexia,
True enough. However Advocate whines more than they do.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Sat 30 Jan, 2010 11:48 pm
My vote for most audacious spin is that which asserts that Scott Brown was elected in Mass because the voters wanted to send a message to Washington that they should stop dicking around and get Obamacare passed.

Somehow this actually got on the latest Democratic talking points memo.
 

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