Obama '08?

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Damn, you guys are a bunch of petty morons. The fact that Obama had lead-in remarks to his comments on the shooting is immaterial.

Is it possible for you to find something less material than this to complain about? I doubt it. Sad what the right-wing punditry has been reduced to.

Cycloptichorn

The fact is that if this was a fanatical guy carrying around a Bible, or somebody that ranted about Islam, or ranted about abortion, or something along those lines, I have a good idea about what we would be reading in the news today. It would be something along the lines of the fanaticism of the right, of Christianity, and maybe they would even connect it to people like Glenn Beck or Limbaugh, and then be proposing ideas about why and how they should be silenced for the good of the country. Clinton made noises about that after the Oklahoma City bombing. We also know that if it had been something like that, Christians and conservatives would roundly be condemning that person for being nuts as he is, but strangely all we hear today from the left side of the aisle and from the world of Islam is that we should not rush to judgment, and comments about what might have driven this man to do what he did.

We condemn this cowardly attack in the strongest terms possible and ask that the perpetrators be punished to the full extent of the law. No political or religious ideology could ever justify or excuse such wanton and indiscriminate violence. The attack was particularly heinous in that it targeted the all-volunteer army that protects our nation. American Muslims stand with our fellow citizens in offering both prayers for the victims and sincere condolences to the families of those killed or injured.

MPAC and the Muslim American community unequivocally condemn this heinous incident. We share the sentiment of our President, who called the Fort Hood attack "a horrific outburst of violence." We are in contact with law enforcement and U.S. federal government officials to gain more facts from this tragic incident and work together in dealing its aftermath.

"Our entire organization extends its heartfelt condolences to the families of those killed as well as to those wounded and their loved ones," said Executive Director Salam Al-Marayati. "We stand in solidarity with law enforcement and the US military to maintain the safety and security of all Americans."

MPAC reaffirms its call to all members of American Muslim communities to be in contact with local law enforcement for the safety and security of their communities, their institutions, and their country.

There will be a concerted effort to find some justification for what he did. Oddly, we even heard that about Osama Bin Laden and the 9/11 perpetrators, fact is Obama's own religious and political mentor, Jeremiah Wright said "the chickens have come home to roost." Who knows, he may think the same thing about this guy as well? It would fit his mindset, and those who think like he does.

The chickens DID come home to roost on 9/11. That is an entirely accurate statement, for US meddling in the Middle East is part of the reason 9/11 happened. This isn't even debatable.

But guys who have a giant hard-on for America and defend it no matter what we do wrong, like yourself, don't want to hear that our actions actually have consequences. It's much easier to demonize people than it is to examine the truth of their statements.

Cycloptichorn

Cycloptichorn wrote:

The chickens DID come home to roost on 9/11. That is an entirely accurate statement, for US meddling in the Middle East is part of the reason 9/11 happened. This isn't even debatable.

But guys who have a giant hard-on for America and defend it no matter what we do wrong, like yourself, don't want to hear that our actions actually have consequences. It's much easier to demonize people than it is to examine the truth of their statements.

Cycloptichorn

Okay, interesting opinion, confirming what I said, and are you now going to go ahead and make the same argument for the guy responsible for the massacre at Fort Hood?

We do not know all the details, but I suspect there may be parallels. For example, I think we may find the guy may be connected with terrorist connections, also he opposed the wars because America was an aggressor against the peoples of the Middle East and against Islam, perhaps, I am guessing here but I think I might be close. And it is entirely possible and maybe probable that they guy did it for Allah and he did it because of the perceived past wrongs of the United States, which are in fact the similar reasons given for the actions of the guys that flew the airplanes on 9/11.

If I turn out to be totally wrong, I will acknowledge it, but only somebody in denial would fail to see the possible parallels right now, cyclops. Of course we will need to find out more, but my guesses are pretty good ones I think. You can say the guy just went nuts, thats all, but I can also point out the guys on 9/11 just went nuts too, but that misses the larger point about what might be going on here, including the possible and probably parallels involved.

I would stay away from guesses like this, if I were you. You have no data to back any of your guesses up, so what it really reflects is your prejudices. That's not flattering.

Cycloptichorn

Cycloptichorn wrote:

I would stay away from guesses like this, if I were you. You have no data to back any of your guesses up, so what it really reflects is your prejudices. That's not flattering.

Cycloptichorn

Fascinating comment, cyclops. So I'll bite, what are my prejudices that are so unflattering? Since you seem to know that I have them and what they are, I am intrested in what you think they are and how you seem to think you know?

I'd say that the biggest difference, is that Obama is a smart guy who is dealing with a Congress which resists his plans

The most notorious example of money for hire is Montana's own Max Baucus, who took in $1.17 million from the healthcare industry during the 2008 election cycle.
Blanche Lincoln has already taken in $353k from the healthcare lobby this cycle.
Money from the defense industry flows in for Rep. Ike Skelton.
The financial sector is already throwing big money at three Democratic challengers, Ginnoulias (IL), White (TX) and Fisher (IL), ensuring another wave of corporate Democrats.
John Dingell, the House Chair of the Energy Committee until Waxman iced him this year, took in $493k last election cycle despite cruising to re-election.

Well, I'd start with 'because the guy is Muslim, he probably did this in concert with terrorists or because he Hates America.' That prejudice.

Cycloptichorn

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Well, I'd start with 'because the guy is Muslim, he probably did this in concert with terrorists or because he Hates America.' That prejudice.

Cycloptichorn

I think you need to look up the word, prejudice, and re-examine what you wrote.

A prejudice is a preconceived belief, opinion, or judgment toward a group of people characterized by their race, social class, gender, ethnicity, sexual orientation, age, disability or religion. It also means a priori beliefs (without knowledge of the facts) and includes "any unreasonable attitude that is unusually resistant to rational influence."[1] Although positive and negative prejudice both exist, when used negatively, "prejudice" implies fear and antipathy toward such a group.

also he opposed the wars because America was an aggressor against the peoples of the Middle East and against Islam,

okie wrote:

also he opposed the wars because America was an aggressor against the peoples of the Middle East and against Islam,

Hell, I opposed the war in Iraq because we were the aggressor. Are you saying that makes me a terrorist?