Obama '08?

@roger,

If he could, he would and who asked you ?

@H2O MAN,

H2O MAN wrote:

If he could, he would and who asked you ?

I misplaced my cheat sheet on how to go to some site and move the article over to a thread on A2K. I suggested you google "Americans without health insurance." Evidently that is too much trouble for you.
Perhaps someone else participating in this conversation (thank you, Roger, for the comment) could do the google search and link it for H2O. The entry I found most useful was the 3rd one down, which uses Census Bureau data to put the number at just under 50M uninsured.
Meanwhile, H2O, where did you hear the 8M number?

1 Reply

@realjohnboy,

Seek the truth and Ye shall find it.

1 Reply

@H2O MAN,

http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/2009/r090701.htm

Quote:

Nearly 44 Million in United States Without Health Insurance in 2008

An estimated 43.8 million Americans had no health insurance in 2008, approximately 2.8 million more than in 1997, according to new data from CDC’s National Center for Health Statistics.

The report, “Health Insurance Coverage: Early Release of Estimates from the National Health Interview Survey, 2008,” presents the latest insurance estimates for the United States.

Now, I did payroll for a company that offered health insurance, with the company paying 2/3 of the cost. About 1/3 of those eligible accepted the benefit. 2/3 declined, and it was really good insurance. I have no idea if this is a typical response nationwide, or limited to O&G Well Servicing Companies. Annual income of employees ranged from 40k to 100k.

1 Reply

@roger,

There used to be another interesting statistics on people who were offered some sort of matching for their 401k's but many refused to participate.

I also wonder what percentage of workers decline this very important benefit?

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@cicerone imposter,

You know, I suspect that about the same percentage declined the 401k option, with the company nominally doing a 3% match. Nominally, because that was the comittment. In fact, they kicked in 6% at the end of every year.

It's harder to come up with a percentage on the 401k participation. Health insurance eligibility came with 60 days employment. 401k involved something like at least one year's employment as of the last day of the year.

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@cicerone imposter,

I found the following under finance/yahoo.com:

Quote:

Shockingly, only 18 percent of workers under 24, and just 38 percent of workers under 35, contribute to employer-sponsored retirement accounts even when they are available.

Not surprising; I also ran into this kind of numbers when I worked in management over a decade ago, and we all know Americans failed to save for the past ten years until recently from fear of losing their jobs.

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@parados,

parados wrote:

Quote:
Now, go do the research and find out how many of your purported 50 million are not even citizens, how many are on medicaid or could be, and how many can afford insurance but do not.

That made me laugh okie..

Good, you need to laugh. Its healthy.

Quote:

As you argue against a public option for health care you use the fact that people are eligible for a public option for health care, called medicaid, as evidence we don't need a public option.

I have never argued against the idea of medicaid to help the truly poor people unable to pay for anything. If you would read my posts, you would know this. Since we already have this program, we don't need a program for everyone, that is my belief. I have seen information that indicates that people elgible for medicaid have not taken advantage of it. But medicaid is a much more controllable beast of government than what we will end up with universal health care at the end of this game.

1 Reply

@okie,

You arrive at conclusions without knowing what the health plan will even look like when they're finished with it. We do know several things for sure; it will not end up as a single-payer system as you conservatives like to parrot. All you do is parrot fear-mongering without providing anything constructive. Typical conservative meme; say "no" to everything.

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@parados,

parados wrote:

I find it funny how conservatives use the word "many" and "much" when they mean "a small percentage."

Most people get their insurance through work. It is only in the last few years that businesses have even had the option to do high deductible plans in conjunction with HSAs.

I've always had high deductibles in the last 25 years or more, so again, your statement is wrong. High deductibles obviously existed before HSA's, but HSA's serve as an incentive to get people to go to high deductibles, which I believe can deliver more efficient and less costly medical care as well as insurance.

As I have repeated, it makes no sense to insure your house for broken door latches or such things. Higher deductibles make sense. I have $500 on my auto comprehensive, for two reasons. I think I come out ahead on incidents, such as fixing broken windshields vs paying higher premiums, but also with a lower deductible, repeated claims tend to cause higher insurance rates. Similarly, it would be senseless to insure a car to pay for maintainence, such as oil changes. Things like physical exams once per year are more like maintainence. What I am discussing here also points out why the prescription drug plan instituted by Bush was a bad piece of legislation. It is leading to more prescriptions and higher costs, and the program is already exceeding projections for cost, and it will only go higher, as all government boondoggles do. Some government boondoggles only take a few years to see them spin out of control, others take decades. I think we are only seeing the beginning of how bad and burdensome social security and medicare will become.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

You arrive at conclusions without knowing what the health plan will even look like when they're finished with it.

Our elected politicians will draw conclusions and vote on Obamacare without knowing what the plan looks like.
These politicians - all off them, need to be replaced and strict, abreviated term limits must be imposed.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

You arrive at conclusions without knowing what the health plan will even look like when they're finished with it. We do know several things for sure; it will not end up as a single-payer system as you conservatives like to parrot. All you do is parrot fear-mongering without providing anything constructive. Typical conservative meme; say "no" to everything.

No to Obama will turn out to be the correct answer 99% of the time. So why waste time reading and studying all of his proposals. After all, why would you study brain surgery procedures written by a dog catcher? Same principle with Obama, as his only proven skill has been "organizing" Chicago, where the people still live in run down housing projects that are just as run down or moreso than before he did his work. He brings no proven skill to the White house, besides knowing how to talk. My brother commented today about how he watched him answer questions without him answering a single question. He talked, but never answered any questions. Slick Willie is being upstaged by Obama. Obama is pretty slick at talking, especially when he has a teleprompter. I actually think he is not as slick as people think, but he has alot of people fooled, but the numbers are dropping. There is actually HOPE out there, as his numbers drop.

1 Reply

@okie,

Your conclusions go beyond "reasonable" and common sense. It seems you have learned nothing from history; Obama has been in office for only six months. You are way out of your league, and your fear-mongering gibberish has no credibility beyond the small group of MACs and conservatives who believe as you do.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

Who are you trying to fool cice girl?
You know nothing about being "reasonable" and you have never been capable of utilizing common sense.

You are only fooling yourself.

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@H2O MAN,

Did you find a source yet for your claim that there are only 8 million uninsured Americans? Or would you rather forget about that absurdity?

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@realjohnboy,

Are you accustom to having others do your research and homework for you?

The correct number is between 6 million and 8 million, not the hyped 46 to 50 million used by advocates for Obamacare.

Between 6 million and 8 million Americans are chronically uninsured and need help when it comes to
paying their medical bills, not the 45.7 million that advocates of socialized medicine are fond of citing.

1 Reply

@H2O MAN,

Um, not meaning to beat a dead horse, but Roger and Me referenced a much higher number. You say it is much lower, but you refuse to give us a source.
"Do your own homework," you say. I did my homework for 47M. Did your dog eat your homework for 8M? Or are you making that up?
I might say that "Pigs can fly." Is it up to me to provide evidence of that, or is it up to you to prove that wrong? It seems to me that I have to source the original allegation.

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@realjohnboy,

Michael Moore and Google are how you do your homework?
This countries youth is far worse off than we thought...

1 Reply

@realjohnboy,

RJB, I can't believe you continue to attempt rational dialogue with waterboy.

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@H2O MAN,

The "Roger and Me" quip was an attempt at humor. I suspect that you were the only one to miss it. Google? You really ought to try it sometime. Much better than Rush Limbaugh. Youth? I missed the point there. I am 63.
So did you find a source for there being only 8M uninsured? Or are you going to admit that that could be low.

1 Reply

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