Obama '08?

Cyclopuppy ain't ready for prime time.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Republicans love war; they got us involved in Iraq, because of WMDs and regime change. (Don't mention oil.) Now, they want us engaged in Iran - for what purpose? To have our soldiers killed, and to kill innocent Iranians?
And that doesn't even include the true cost of the war in billions for what?

Conservatives have nothing better to do than to complain about things we have no business getting involved in. The Iranians did not ask for our help, and the Arab countries are already angry at us for our wars in Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan - which they view as US occupation.

And, they don't want to tax the rich to pay for anything! Let our kids and grandkids pay for all of our misdeeds.

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@Cycloptichorn,

I don't buy that cycobabble, cyclops. Thats akin to saying I won't take sides against the bully in the street beating up a poor kid, so that the bully cannot blame his defeat later on you. Thats nonsense in my opinion, but it fits the liberal mindset that there is no right or wrong, just shades of gray. If there is something that seems to be clearly wrong, stand up and condemn it. That doesn't mean we send troops to Iran, I don't advocate that, but some moral support to those that want a fair election against a dictator, that seems to be entirely reasonable and right in my opinion.

I know what Reagan would have done. He would stand up with a more clear message. Was it meddling when he said "tear down this wall." The point is, Obama has no backbone and no moral compass for right and wrong, at least that is my impression. He seems to sympathize with dictators, thats my read of his mindset.

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@okie,

Liberals just see "shades of grey?" You are an ignorant bastard!

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@okie,

okie wrote:

I don't buy that cycobabble, cyclops. Thats akin to saying I won't take sides against the bully in the street beating up a poor kid, so that the bully cannot blame his defeat later on you. Thats nonsense in my opinion, but it fits the liberal mindset that there is no right or wrong, just shades of gray.

That opinion was written by a Conservative, not a Liberal. It isn't reflective of the Liberal mindset. It's reflective of a mindset which recommends thought before action, that's not a partisan thing.

Quote:

If there is something that seems to be clearly wrong, stand up and condemn it. That doesn't mean we send troops to Iran, I don't advocate that, but some moral support to those that want a fair election against a dictator, that seems to be entirely reasonable and right in my opinion.

Oh, so you think they are just sitting around over there, waiting for some guy in the US to give them moral support? Once again, extremely shallow analysis on your part. The Iranian people don't give two shits if the US government gives them 'moral support.' Ridiculous.

Quote:

I know what Reagan would have done. He would stand up with a more clear message. Was it meddling when he said "tear down this wall."

Right, right. I forgot about Saint Reagan, the man who lucked into being in the right place when Russia collapsed, and is now hailed by you bunch as a genius of some type.

Cycloptichorn

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@cicerone imposter,

Thank god that a lib was president during the Cuban missile crisis. Had a Rep been in office, we probably would have had a nuclear exchange with the USSR, leaving about 90 M in the USA dead.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

okie wrote:
I know what Reagan would have done. He would stand up with a more clear message. Was it meddling when he said "tear down this wall."

Right, right. I forgot about Saint Reagan, the man who lucked into being in the right place when Russia collapsed, and is now hailed by you bunch as a genius of some type.

Cycloptichorn

Exactly. And Okie has forgotten history. Gee. What led to the collapse of the USSR? It inevitably followed on the heels of 10 years of war in Afghanistan--a war that the USSR could not "win" despite an entire decade of effort, an enormous loss of life, and a fortune in wealth spent to the point of bankrupting a nation--and leaving Osama Bin Laden laughing and bragging about bringing down a super power.... Shocked

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@Advocate,

Advocate wrote:

Thank god that a lib was president during the Cuban missile crisis. Had a Rep been in office, we probably would have had a nuclear exchange with the USSR, leaving about 90 M in the USA dead.

Actually, if you wish to compare wars with Republicans vs Democrats in charge, this is kind of interesting, with Democrats involving us in more war deaths, and if you take out the Civil War, it would become extremely one sided in favor of the Democrats. I think the Civil War should be disqualified because although Lincoln was a Republican, without southern Democrats being involved, it would never have happened.

http://www.mapsofwar.com/ind/american-wars.html

Point being, Advocate, you have no way of knowing what would have happened. Fact is, Kennedy is the guy that got us more involved in Vietnam, and LBJ got us all the way into Vietnam.

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@Debra Law,

Quote:

and leaving Osama Bin Laden laughing and bragging about bringing down a super power....

funded by none other than the good ole US of A. Boy, talk about somethin' turning around and biting ya in the ass.

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@okie,

Quote:

I think I am beginning to agree with ican

Then there's no hope for your sanity.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

Okie wrote: ... he can't even stand up for the people of Iran.

I think you missed this part, Okie.

Quote:

The USA has a long and despicable history of meddling in that country's affairs, which is well known to the people.

The US's idea of standing up for people is to let the dictator du jour torture and murder them while the US steals the country's wealth.

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@okie,

I don't know where you get your information. E. g., Eisenhower was the cause of our war in Nam. Bush involved us in wars in Afghan. & Iraq. We were attacked in WWII by Japan, and Germany declared war. Does that make it a Dem war? A Rep started the Civil War.

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@Advocate,

Where do you get your information? Eisenhower was most definitely not the cause of the Vietnam war. Have you heard of the Gulf of Tonkin incident? LBJ expanded the situation into a full blown war. Check your history. I have argued with libs before that want to blame Eisenhower, or Nixon, but its all a pretty empty argument, the primary guy that started the war was LBJ, and next in line would be JFK.

In regard to WWII or any other war, I simply looked at the presidents in charge, not justifications, as that is debatable for every war. I did make a distinction about the Civil War because it is unique among wars in that we fought ourselves, a Republican led Union against a Democratic led Confederacy, so I think the responsibility should be shared in that case.

Remember, I am not judging fault, I am only noting which party was in power when wars occurred. I believe the Civil War was justified, as I do World War II, as well as other wars, but there are people that do not believe they were justified. My link takes all fault out of the equation, and simply enumerates all the wars since our founding by which party held the presidency. It clearly shows that Republicans are no more in favor of war than Democrats, historically, and in fact the evidence may indicate just the opposite, which clearly debunks your baseless speculation about the Cuban missile crisis.

I kind of like the link I posted already. Here it is again. For anyone, click the link and then start the video that shows all the wars with the numbers by Democrat and Republican.

http://www.mapsofwar.com/ind/american-wars.html

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Looks like a few more Obama donors got some nice jobs for their money:

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090612/D98OTD380.html

"Obama taps more big donors for ambassadorships

Jun 12, 12:16 AM (ET)

By MATTHEW LEE

WASHINGTON (AP) - President Barack Obama on Thursday tapped four big Democratic Party donors for plum ambassadorships in Europe and Latin America while naming six career diplomats to posts in Africa, the Mideast and the Pacific.

Washington lawyer Howard Gutman, who raised more than $500,000 for Obama's campaign and personally contributed the maximum $4,600 to it, was nominated to be the next U.S. envoy to Belgium, the White House said in a statement.

Gutman also contributed $2,300 to now Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton's presidential campaign, according to the Center for Responsive Politics, a nonpartisan group that tracks money in politics.

Obama named former Virginia Lt. Gov. Donald Beyer to be ambassador to Switzerland and Luxembourg. Beyer, who made his money as a car dealer, raised more than $500,000 for Obama and also contributed $4,600 to his campaign, according to the center.

Vinai Thummalapally, a Colorado business executive and Obama friend who raised between $100,000 and $200,000 for the campaign and donated $4,500 to it, was named the next U.S. ambassador to Belize. Thummalapally's wife, Barbara, contributed $2,800 to Obama, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

Obama also named Washington lawyer Mark Gitenstein, who donated more than $4,000 to now Vice President Joe Biden's presidential campaign and contributed $1,500 to Clinton's campaign to be ambassador to Romania.

Career diplomats were nominated on Thursday to be envoys to Burundi, Tunisia, the Marshall Islands, Oman and Suriname. Obama also chose retired Army Gen. Alfonso Lenhardt to be ambassador to Tanzania."

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Obama cuts budget of union corruption oversight: He is of course not real interested in cracking down on his union buddies involved in corruption.

http://spectator.org/blog/2009/05/07/obama-slashes-union-enforcemen

"Under the leadership of Elaine Chao during the Bush administration, the Labor Department's Office of Labor-Management Standards took its job of policing unions seriously. Its actions led to 929 convictions of corrupt union officials and to the recovery of more than $93 million on behalf of union members. Yet the Obama administration has proposed slashing its budget from $45 million in 2009 to $41 million in 2010, citing an insufficient "workload" for the office.

Instead of using the money to make sure unions play by the rules, the Obama administration proposes shifting resources to the department's Wage and Hour Division, Office of Federal Contract Compliance Programs, and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration -- all areas of the agency focused on regulating businesses. "

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More on Obama and ACORN:

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/matthew-vadum/2009/05/18/nyt-finally-admits-it-spiked-obama-acorn-corruption-story

"NYT Finally Admits It Spiked Obama/ACORN Corruption Story"

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I knew Obama liked basketball, but whats this firing over the investigation into Obama friend and supporter, Kevin Johnson? This is not lookin good for the crook, Obama, and his crook friend, Kevin Johnson. Will Chicago thug politics work in Washington D.C.? We shall see.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/blogs/beltway-confidential/Whats-behind-Obamas-sudden-firing-of-the-AmeriCorps-inspector-general-47877797.html

"The bottom line is that the AmeriCorps IG accused a prominent Obama supporter of misusing AmeriCorps grant money. After an investigation, the prominent Obama supporter had to pay back more than $400,000 of that grant money. And Obama fired the AmeriCorps IG."

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I know some of you guys claim to be not big on polls, but I thought you might like this one:

Polls find rising concern with Obama on key issues

Quote:

WASHINGTON (Reuters) " President Barack Obama faces growing concerns among voters over government spending, the auto industry bailout and other economic policies, according to two opinion polls released on Wednesday.

Obama, who took office in January, remains popular with Americans, although his overall job approval rating slipped to 56 percent, down 5 points from April, according to an NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll.

But 58 percent of respondents said Obama and Congress should focus on keeping the budget deficit down, even if takes longer for the economy to recover. The Congressional Budget Office estimates the federal deficit could top $1.8 trillion this fiscal year -- by far a record.

Nearly 70 percent said they had concerns about federal intervention in the economy, including Obama's decision to take an ownership stake in General Motors and the prospect of more government involvement in healthcare. Obama has made healthcare reform a top priority of his administration.

Just 37 percent of respondents said Obama was taking on too many issues and 60 percent said he had to focus on so many things because the United States was facing so many problems.

While Republican criticism of the Democratic president's policies may be scoring points with voters, the strategy does not appear to be benefiting the party.

A CBS News/New York Times poll also released on Wednesday found the Republican Party viewed favorably by only 28 percent of Americans, the lowest rating ever in the poll. In contrast, 57 percent had a favorable view of the Democratic Party.

The CBS/New York Times poll also found a distinct difference in Obama's overall standing and how Americans viewed his major initiatives.

Obama's job approval rating held steady at 63 percent from the previous poll last month, but fewer than half of respondents approved of how he was handling healthcare reform and efforts to save GM and Chrysler, according to the survey.

The poll also found that Americans were alarmed by the amount of money doled out to boost the economy and a majority thought the government should focus instead on reducing the federal deficit.

Both polls also found a majority of Americans opposing Obama's decision to close the U.S. military prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.

The NBC/Wall Street Journal survey of 1,008 adults, conducted Friday to Monday, had a margin of error of plus or minus 3.1 percentage points.

The CBS/New York Times telephone poll of 895 adults was conducted Friday through Tuesday and had a margin of error of plus or minus 3 points.

I think you guys focus on wrong things and that is why your party is not held very favorable right now, too negative on shallow things rather than real issues which face real Americans in our everyday lives. Of course that's just my opinion.

I also think the idea of a national health care system is scary because of the inevitable cost such a big project would be sure to be, but like that public schools sooner or later a necessary expense or else the cost of health care is just going to keep contributing to the overall ill health of the economy. If people got to keep paying so much for health care, they are not going to have money to spread around into the companies which the people who own them run.

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"Seven demonstrators were shot Monday by pro-regime militia in the first confirmed deaths during the unrest."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,527022,00.html

But Obama says we must not meddle in Iran politics by making a statement of support for one side or the other. How about supporting a fair election, Obama, you spineless individual?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/17/mccain-rips-obama-cautious-response-protests-irans-election/

"John McCain told FOX News that he didn't think President Obama was doing enough to show his support for fair elections in Iran and civil rights for Iranians after a presidential election there that "everybody knows" was corrupt."

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@okie,

okie wrote:

"Seven demonstrators were shot Monday by pro-regime militia in the first confirmed deaths during the unrest."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,527022,00.html

But Obama says we must not meddle in Iran politics by making a statement of support for one side or the other. How about supporting a fair election, Obama, you spineless individual?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/17/mccain-rips-obama-cautious-response-protests-irans-election/

"John McCain told FOX News that he didn't think President Obama was doing enough to show his support for fair elections in Iran and civil rights for Iranians after a presidential election there that "everybody knows" was corrupt."

I've already addressed how our interference can be seen as counter-productive. Are you going to keep posting this tripe without giving a meaningful response to that?

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

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