Obama '08?

@okie,

okie wrote:

Also, if this has not been posted, it is stupid, stupid, stupid, to release details of our methods of extracting information from terrorists that saved many lives. That is akin to giving the blueprint of our battle plans to the terrorist cells around the world. How stupid is that? Very. But then again, nothing surprises me with this bunch in the Whitehouse.

Okie; these are not our methods any longer. They are what used to be done. There's no danger in telling people what you did years ago and are no longer doing. It's like giving them blueprints to a B-2 bomber; great, let them have them.

It's disgusting but unsurprising that you are more concerned with people finding out about the bad things we've done, than you are over the fact that we routinely tortured people and your political leaders, who you defended for years, knew all about it and authorized it.

Cycloptichorn

2 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

Legal opinions said it wasn't torture, cyclops, you ignore that. If it clearly was, Holder would prosecute, but he knows it is not, so you are simply making this up, as libs have for the last 8 years. So the methods should not be publicized, they serve no reasonable purpose, except Obama's political purposes, and I am not convinced Obama or the rest of us won't need this information, to be used. Also, your analogy of the bomber, there are aspects of that bomber that are placed into other bombers, same principle here, it is stupid to give it away. Again, stupid, stupid, stupid.

3 Replies

@okie,

okie wrote:

Legal opinions said it wasn't torture, cyclops, you ignore that.

I might be wrong about that, but it seems to me that as long as it isn't tested in court, a legal opinion is really just that: an opinion.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

our methods:

Ted Kennedy originated water boarding, but it ended badly by drowning a young lady.
Modern water boarding is safe and effective. It's disgusting but unsurprising that liberals want to weaken this country.

0 Replies

@okie,

OE is correct; a 'legal opinion' has no actual weight in front of the law. It would not defend people who were hauled up in court.

Imagine if you had committed a crime, and tried to explain to the judge that your lawyer told you it was okay. You might get a tiny bit of sympathy, but nobody would let you off of your responsibility.

The ones who should be prosecuted are the ones who ordered this torture, who knew it was wrong, and who instructed the lawyers to come up with an argument justifying it.

I don't think you're qualified to call things 'stupid, stupid, stupid.' It isn't as if the terrorists don't know how to torture people themselves. What was revealed that was so secret? What uber-useful technique did the memos reveal? None. Instead, we're just being open with the world about the fact that we torture folks when we want to.

You need to suck it up and realize that you, Okie, are a torture supporter. You agree with it and want it to be done. But I bet you wouldn't have the ******* sac to be the one doing it.

Cycloptichorn

3 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

I bet Cyclotroll has the ******* sac to be the one doing the torturing...

And I'm sure Cyclotroll celebrates every time an Islamic extremest tortures, murders and mutilates an American.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Again, you think it rises to torture, other people do not, including the best legal opinions in the previous administration. I have not studied all of the methods, and I am not a legal expert, however some of the things labeled and talked about as torture, I don't know everthing that was used, but of some of them, such as playing loud music and imperfectly regulated temperatures in cells, I do not consider torture, otherwise I would say I am tortured every day.

Some of the arguments used by liberals these past 8 years strike me as totally assinine.

2 Replies

@okie,

okie wrote:

Some of the arguments used by liberals these past 8 years strike me as totally assinine.

+1

0 Replies

@okie,

okie wrote:

Again, you think it rises to torture, other people do not

Well, supporters of torture such as yourself do not, because you don't like to admit that you support torturing people for information. But you do.

Quote:

including the best legal opinions in the previous administration.

Listen to you defend lawyers! These guys were told to produce a piece of paper, so that those who wanted to torture could cover their asses. And they did so. But they don't determine what is or isn't the law, the courts do.

Quote:

I have not studied all of the methods, and I am not a legal expert, however some of the things labeled and talked about as torture, I don't know everthing that was used, but of some of them, such as playing loud music and imperfectly regulated temperatures in cells, I do not consider torture, otherwise I would say I am tortured every day.

How about locking people in coffins for days? Throwing a bunch of insects in there with them? Slamming their head into the wall over and over? Keeping them without sleep for 10 days at a time?

How about killing them? Please don't forget that we tortured and beat several prisoners to death in Abu Ghraib and Bagram AFB. Does death not count as torture?

Quote:

Some of the arguments used by liberals these past 8 years strike me as totally assinine.

I'm sure they do, for they reveal the rotten thing you have in the middle of your heart, that wants to see pain inflicted on people so that you can be less afraid.

Cycloptichorn

3 Replies

@parados,

Not at all, I am reporting the facts.
Obama promised a tax cut for senior citizens, then didnt deliver (or at least he hasnt yet).

IMHO, its pretty low to lie to senior citizens regarding their money.

Please show me where I ever claimed to speak for senior citizens, or where I ever said that I did.

Or better yet, why dont you actually read the article I linked to, instead of going on the attack.

0 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

Imagine if you had committed a crime, and tried to explain to the judge that your lawyer told you it was okay. You might get a tiny bit of sympathy, but nobody would let you off of your responsibility.

So you are saying that those that actually did the supposed "torturing" should also be held responsible?
Apparently, the Justice dept doesnt agree with you, because they arent going to prosecute anyone.

Quote:

The ones who should be prosecuted are the ones who ordered this torture, who knew it was wrong, and who instructed the lawyers to come up with an argument justifying it.

And that would make the lawyers culpable also, wouldnt it?
After all, "I was only following orders" isnt supposed to be a defense, is it?

1 Reply

PrezBO is a man-caused disaster.

0 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

Bush: ‘We do not torture’ terror suspects
Response to question comes as exception is sought for CIA

U.S. President Bush and Panamanian President Martin Torrijos speak to reporters during a news conference in Panama City on Monday.
Charles Dharapak / AP

Bush on torture
Nov. 7: President Bush wrapped up his trip on Latin America trade, but questions about his policies in the war on terror took center stage Monday. NBC's Bob Kur reports.

updated 1:09 p.m. PT, Mon., Nov . 7, 2005

PANAMA CITY, Panama - President Bush on Monday defended U.S. interrogation practices and called the treatment of terrorism suspects lawful. “We do not torture,” Bush declared in response to reports of secret CIA prisons overseas.

Most legal scholars not connected to the Bush administration say it was torture, and broke both domestic and international laws.

1 Reply

@okie,

Quote:

So, what do we learn now, every legal opinion previously put forth can be "revoked" by the stroke of a pen.

They were put there by a stroke of a pen, they can be taken out the same way. We are not talking about courts much less the supreme court, but just the former administration legal cronies saying what is legal in interrogations all on their own. Obama's legal cronies can do the same in the opposite direction which would just make it like it was before those legal opinions were rendered by the Bush administration.

1 Reply

@revel,

It's not only that they say it wasn't illegal, but they can't see the simple truth that Bush lied on so many issues.

Their morals are bankrupt.

0 Replies

Quote:

Obama promised a tax cut for senior citizens, then didnt deliver (or at least he hasnt yet).

Give him time, right now we have been dealing with a pretty big inherited economic crises and it will take time to get to everything and some things promised in the campaign may not feasible with the circumstances we found ourselves in after the previous administration left. Apparently it is on the agenda to do at some point though.

2 Replies

@revel,

They want miracles from Obama during his first 100-days in office; that's the reason why they call him the messiah.

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

Quote:

And that would make the lawyers culpable also, wouldnt it?
After all, "I was only following orders" isnt supposed to be a defense, is it?

Oh, absolutely!

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

But those are only legal OPINIONS, and as Cyclo has already pointed out, OPINIONS carry no weight in court.

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

They want miracles from Obama during his first 100-days in office; that's the reason why they call him the messiah.

True, liberal extremist do call O boy their messiah and they would be satisfied if he would just tea bagged each and every one of them.

0 Replies

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