snood
 
  2  
Sun 28 Dec, 2008 02:53 pm
@InfraBlue,
Spot on, Infrablue.

I first became familiar with the term during the time that the movie The Green Mile was in theatres for the first time. Some folks around me didn't understand my chagrin at the John Coffey character - the 'magic Negro' thing explained it for me.

I doubt that Rove et al have the sensibility or inclination to grasp such things.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  4  
Sun 28 Dec, 2008 09:59 pm
@snood,
The Green Mile was a perfect medium in which to first meet the phrase, because Steven King has been writing stories that feature Magic Negroes for years.

(King hates Bush by the way)

The Shining
The Stand
Green Mile

And more, have all had Magic Negroes as integral characters.

As much as I like his work, I have always thought it ridiculous that he seems to always return to such a trite literary stock character.

I'm not sure how it is racist, but I can certainly accept that it might be offensive to African-Americans.

Obama is hardly the Magic Negro.

The Magic Negro could never be elected to the presidency.

The Magic Negro exists to advance and enhance the narratives of White Men.

The Magic Negro is a facinating literary device. Is it insulting or complimentary?

I would suggest, ultimately, the former, because the Magic Negro is never the main character, and could never be. Even in stories where the Magic Negro may be the character of obvious focus, he or she is never the narrator or the primary subject.

Magic Negroes very often find themselves the subjects of first person narratives: "I met Bagger Vance in the sumer of 1931..."

But then again there are Magic Indians, Magic Asians and Magic Eastern Europeans galore in the literary world. It's not so much an offense against blacks as it is against all minorities.

And it is certainly not a deliberate offense.

Writers fond of the use of the Magic characters are very rarely overtly bigoted, but they are excellent examples of how one can be a patronizing elitist without knowing it or, obviously, admitting it.

Sort of like Liberals.



0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 04:36 am
Yeah, both are bad...
The unwitting insult that results from the patronizing elitism of bleeding heart liberals, and the sniffing condescension of pseudo-superior rightwingnuts.

My momma told me that its always hard to communicate with someone who thinks they're just better than you. I say **** 'em individually and severally.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 07:22 am
Have any of you actually heard the song?
I heard it yesterday, and it is actually pretty funny.

And as much as some of you are trying to be offended about it, because you think it is taking shots at Barack, it actually isnt.
Its more taking shots at people like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, the guys that have always acted like they were owed something because of their race, and because they "fought the fight" regarding civil rights and Obama didnt.
He just is the result of their fight.

So, before you criticize, actually listen to the song.
revel
 
  1  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 07:57 am
@mysteryman,
I think I'll let snood take that lest I be accused of being an elitist bleeding heart liberal. Sometimes during these kinds of discussions you can't win for loosing.

Nevertheless I think infra blue addressed the issue rather well. I didn't know where the term come from nor did I realize the significance in the green mile movie, just enjoyed the movie.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 08:04 am
@revel,
I didnt realize the significance of the term either.
BUT, the song, like anything else, is only insulting if you choose to be insulted by it.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 08:21 am
"a thing is not offensive unless someone chooses to take offense by it."

what can one say to this kind of wisdom?
okie
 
  0  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 11:21 am
@snood,
Definition found on Wikipedia:

"Negro is a term referring to people of Black African ancestry. Prior to the shift in the lexicon of American and worldwide classification of race and ethnicity in the late 1960s, the appellation was accepted as a normal neutral formal term both by those of Black African descent as well as non-African blacks. Now it is often considered an ethnic slur[1][2][3] although the term is considered archaic and is not common as a racist slur. The term is still used in some contexts for historical reasons such as in the name of the United Negro College Fund[4][5]. "Negro" means "black" in Spanish, Portuguese, and ancient Italian[6] - all of which derive from the Latin niger (i.e. "black")."

I think mm is correct, snood. In fact, I learned something by looking up the word, it literally means "black" in other languages, and right now, the term, "black," appears to be the politically correct term. As a person growing up in the 40s through the 60's, it seemed like the preferred terms for various races of peoples kept changing, for whatever reasons I do not fully understand, but I think one of the reasons is the fact that some people had to find reasons to be offended, and the terms was one that they kept finding.

I will be very honest with you, I never grew up around black people, my parents never taught prejudice, but in college I had occasion to meet some black folks, and later in the military, alot more. I found out what anyone would find out, black people are as different from each other and from everybody else as white people are from each other and everybody else, and some had good character, others not as good, just like everybody else. Some were pleasant and highly dependable, others not. In fact, to this day, I will tell people the best drill sargeant, easily, was a black man, he was the best at his craft, and the worst I had was also a black man, with a close second by some white guys. I also found out, not to generalize, but in general, black guys from northern big cities more often had chips on their shoulder, while rural guys, usually from the south, were great guys. Of course there are always many exceptions to stereotypes, such as not all New Yorkers are snobs, and not all okies are hicks.

If you have a chip on your shoulder, about race, I can't help you, snood. In regard to Obama, I do not think anyone should have voted for Obama, or against Obama, due to race. In regard to the Magic Negro business, I think it is pretty stupid, and very unwise to use that kind of parody, I would not personally do it because I see the pitfalls of doing it and we don't need to stir the pot. But to take offence at it, I would advise people to ignore it, it is more a case of people pointing out the folly of electing a president based solely upon race. Some of the people entertaining that might be racial, but far from all. The term, "negro," did not always denote a racist connotation, nor does it need to now. In fact, the term, "colored," is another term we are not supposed to use, but we still have the NAACP, so I think alot of these terms' meanings are in the head of the person hearing them, which are often different from the meanings in the heads of those that use them. So as mm points out, if you are looking for insults, you will find them. I cannot count the number of insults I have incurred here, alot because of the name I chose, "okie." My advice would be, I am proud of being from Oklahoma, and whatever race we are, we can all be proud of it, depending upon what kind of person we are, not because of the color of our skin.

My opinion, snood, you are a nice guy, and I have defended you at times, but I also detect at least a small chip on your shoulder. I have not lived your life, perhaps you have reasons, but just get over it if you can.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Mon 29 Dec, 2008 11:52 am
Your opinion is noted, okie.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  0  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 08:17 pm
Obama, in a written statement, sided with the Senate leadership, saying the governor's decision was "disappointing" and that he should resign so a "lawful and appropriate process of succession" can take place.

What isn't lawful about this appointment, Barack? And the man has not been convicted of anything, so get off his case. And your own internal report said nothing inappropriate was discussed between him and your people. And who else would it be if he did? If you can't name names, then you have no evidence whatsoever that Blago has done anything wrong.
parados
 
  2  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 08:24 pm
@okie,
lol.. You are pretty funny okie. You go off on how Obama could be guilty of lots of things then turn around and act like Blago hasn't been indicted.
okie
 
  1  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 08:31 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:

lol.. You are pretty funny okie. You go off on how Obama could be guilty of lots of things then turn around and act like Blago hasn't been indicted.

Every time I post in regard to this subject, up pops you and Rockhead to counter my posts, and you both use the same tactics, like, "pretty funny, etc." Have you both assigned yourselves to okie here on this forum? Is that your mission in life now?
Rockhead
 
  -1  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 08:34 pm
@okie,
I won't speak for anyone else, but I am just here mostly to entertain Dyslexia, (and meself just a bit)

Your tiresome parroting of Sir Limbaugh gets really old.

mebbe you and waterboy should tagteam a bit?

(yawn)
okie
 
  -3  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 08:59 pm
@Rockhead,
Then go talk to Dys and keep him company then, listen to your music, and smoke, or whatever you do, Rocky. Quit bothering serious politics with your cheap talk.
Rockhead
 
  -1  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 09:01 pm
@okie,
You assume a lot...

(you know about assume, yes?...)

Do you want to play, mindless parrot boy?. . .

(it is early yet, Gomer)

please let's not confuse okieisms with "serious" politics, yowza...
Rockhead
 
  -1  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 09:06 pm
OOOOps....

as a quick aside, let me quickly compliment you for associating me with music...

(proves ones head is not so firmly up ones ass as not to see at least SOME basic reality...)

good on you.
0 Replies
 
Rockhead
 
  -1  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 09:56 pm
@okie,
Hello ello llo lo ooo

Okie?

(saw you went to easier pickings, I'll still be 'round, waitin', watchin', and what not...)

Cool
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  3  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 10:22 pm
@Rockhead,
Rockhead wrote:
Do you want to play, mindless parrot boy?. . .

Is this your contribution to the politics forum, RH? Crass insults? It's hard to think of anything more mindless than stalking and sniping on these threads with nothing more than boorish personal insults, that serve no other purpose than to instigate and stir the ****, which is all you seem to be trying to do here.

At least try to be witty.
Rockhead
 
  -1  
Tue 30 Dec, 2008 10:53 pm
@Ticomaya,
Another Rush parrot, from the dessert?

(might choose which can to open, opie...)

please show your work counselor...

which comments are you mebbe referring to?

Shocked Rolling Eyes (and please watch the stalking references, the Deutch are abooot...)
Ticomaya
 
  3  
Wed 31 Dec, 2008 08:49 am
@Rockhead,
Rockhead wrote:
Another Rush parrot, from the dessert?

(might choose which can to open, opie...)

Why? Your false bravado aside, is there a particular reason one should not "mess with you"?

Rockhead wrote:
...
please show your work counselor...

which comments are you mebbe referring to?

Shocked Rolling Eyes (and please watch the stalking references, the Deutch are abooot...)

You're stalking Okie, that's what I'm referring to. And you evidently have no other projectiles in your quiver than cheap personal insults. I've not the time nor the inclination to point you to the various posts I'm referring to ... feel free to back browse your posts in this thread or the "Illinois Governor Arrested" thread if you still feel clueless about your own habits. And if you've forgotten, maybe you need to stop posting so late at night after you've been hitting the sauce all afternoon.

If you want to prove me wrong, then pipe up with some intelligent comment that partially regards the subject matter of the thread. Something that goes beyond merely stating Okie is a "hoot" or a "Parrot boy".

Unfortunately, I'm afraid that task is a huckleberry over your persimmon.
 

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