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Wed 11 Jan, 2006 01:59 pm
I belong to a club that is made up of scientists. (No cracks about what the hell am I doing there, please! 
)
Anyhow, a physicist was the speaker last evening. He spoke about the impact that efficient hybrid cars would make on the US economy. He has a Toyota Prius. He claims, that on the road, he has been known to get 52 mpg.
He had worked up some figures that illustrated that if the efficient hybrids (he claims that not all hybrids are that efficient) were to be used more extensively, the US would be sending a lot less money to countries that could prove ultimately hostile to us. He was speaking from both a political and ecological viewpoint.
What do you think about hybrid cars? Would you consider buying one?
Do you know anyone who has one, and what is their opinion in terms of drivability, economy, and comfort in relation to a car with only a gasoline engine?
I think there's a good chance they'll be the norm at some point. The Accord V6 has 10 more horsepower than the standard gas-only engine.
However they're still too expensive. The Accord is priced at a premium. That article says a $20K tag on a Prius is attractive? I think for that money, it's too much of an econobox with too little power.
Slappy- But doesn't it stand to reason, as these cars become acceptable, and more are sold, the price will go down? Or, if the price does not go down, the manufacturer may increase the power, and the features?
I certainly considered buying one. But my present car returns 45 mpg + (uh oh are they them short change 'merican gals?) anyway was a bit disappointed witht eh actual prius mpg.
Phoenix32890 wrote:Slappy- But doesn't it stand to reason, as these cars become acceptable, and more are sold, the price will go down? Or, if the price does not go down, the manufacturer may increase the power, and the features?
If the numbers sold grows the prices will certianly come down. At the same time though, the demand for a standard gasoline only car would also probably drop which will result in their prices dropping too.
The only real issue I have with the hybrids is that the inital cost is higher and I suspect the cost when they reach their failure point will be higher. Between the two of those it pretty much negates any economic incentive to buy them. We won't know about the long term cost for a few more years when we start seeing the failure rates on the current crop that is being sold.
We've yet to figure out what the environmental impact of disposing of the hybrids is too. It's something that is seldom discussed but we could be trading one evil for another here.
I don't understand why they're not pushing diesels. They get great mileage, are more reliable than gasoline engines, and still have comparable performance. BMW, Audi, Mercedes, even the high-end brands do well with them.
I think that Governments around the world should be pumping all sorts of aid and subsidy into this type of research and development.
The sooner we can remove the reliance on oil, the better. The USA government will have a fight on their hands though, as its very powerful oil producers will be doing everything in their power to get alternative fuels off the agenda.
Whatever happened to the hydrogen car? Water as a by product sounds good to me. Maybe it is being discounted, on safety grounds?
Get a bike...
3 billion Chinese can't be wrong.
Actually, the biggest problem with the hydrogen car is lack of infrastructure to refuel. I have seen reports that hydrogen fuel tanks are no more dangerous than gasoline. Second biggest problem with hydrogen is the energy required to make the hydrogen. Renewable electric sources may help to solve that one.
Hybrids cars don't have much chance. Way too many initial and ongoing costs, maintenance considerations and complexity issues. It won't be long before internal combustion engines are much lighter and considerably more efficient negating much of the claimed advantages of the hybrid car For example even now a Toyota Echo/Yaris is really not far behind the Toyota Prius, and it costs a lot less to buy and maintain long term.
parados wrote:Get a bike...
3 billion Chinese can't be wrong.
Actually, the biggest problem with the hydrogen car is lack of infrastructure to refuel. I have seen reports that hydrogen fuel tanks are no more dangerous than gasoline. Second biggest problem with hydrogen is the energy required to make the hydrogen. Renewable electric sources may help to solve that one.
One of the only sane long term sources of renewable electrical energy would be from solar powered satellites (SPS) beaming microwaves to earthbound collectors, but that's not happening.
I doubt wind, wave, geothermal, hydro, or ground based solar will ever be enough to really tip the scales away from fossil fuels, Nuclear could, but the public is against due to ignorance and fear.
http://members.nova.org/~sol/station/sps.htm
http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/technology/space_solar_000908.html
Lord Ellpus wrote:
Whatever happened to the hydrogen car?
Indeed. In fact whatever happened to all the hydrogen?
I own a Prius, and while it doesn't get anywhere near the mileage cited by the EPA, it does well enough. If the gov't had a consistent tax policy to make up for the extra expense of buying them, they would be a viable option financially.
The hybrid doesn't have to be the only alternative, but it's a good one...
I thought about getting a Prius, but, for the amount of driving I do, it would take me something like 6 years to make up the difference between the cost of that and a corolla.
In addition, my corolla gets really good mileage.
You don't hear much about advocating drivers slow down a little to save gas. What's wrong with that?
We've all had the experience of having Mario Andreti zooming by us on the highway, only to coast up to him 5 miles up the road, since we got off at the same exit, and are now waiting for the same light.
Phoenix, do you mind if I add that to the mix?
Why don't people slow down to save gas since it doesn't really make THAT much of a difference in time.
So, an average 20 minute drive is reduced to a 16 minute drive.
A car doing 70 will cover 18.6 miles in 16 minutes
A car doing 55 will cover 18.3 miles in 20 minutes.
Wow, 4 whole minutes.
I wonder how much gas the slower car saves?
Does anyone know?
From Edmunds.com
We Test the Tips
What Really Saves Gas? And How Much?
By Philip Reed and Mike Hudson
Email
Date Posted 11-22-2005
With gas prices so high, the media is awash with lists of gas-saving tips. Well how's this for a tip? If you listen to us, you can see hybrid-type savings without having to buy a new car.
Chai Tea wrote:I thought about getting a Prius, but, for the amount of driving I do, it would take me something like 6 years to make up the difference between the cost of that and a corolla.
In addition, my corolla gets really good mileage.
You don't hear much about advocating drivers slow down a little to save gas. What's wrong with that?
We've all had the experience of having Mario Andreti zooming by us on the highway, only to coast up to him 5 miles up the road, since we got off at the same exit, and are now waiting for the same light.
Phoenix, do you mind if I add that to the mix?
Why don't people slow down to save gas since it doesn't really make THAT much of a difference in time.
So, an average 20 minute drive is reduced to a 16 minute drive.
A car doing 70 will cover 18.6 miles in 16 minutes
A car doing 55 will cover 18.3 miles in 20 minutes.
Wow, 4 whole minutes.
I wonder how much gas the slower car saves?
Does anyone know?
Surprised to see you so animated about such technicalities ms chaiteavous
Why dear?
I'm a big advocate of being kind to our planet, I don't want to have to move from it if it gets trashed.
Technicalities? Oh my, they appeal to my obsessive compulsive tendancies.
I stop myself before I grab the calculator and start playing with "what would happen if I slowed down 2.86 mph for the first 17.89878 miles of the trip, considering a gas price of......"
HA! I don't know if you get Monk over there on the "telly" as you Brits call it.
"What are you doing?"
"I don't know! But for the love of God, Stop Me!"
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