New US textbook aims to teach Bible as knowledge

I too think an understanding of the Bible is important for non-Christians. I do not think it should be required reading as scripture, but I do think it is invaluable in understanding the literary, artistic, and cultural history of the Western world.

Quote:

"An intelligent understanding of the Bible is indispensable toanybody in the Western world who wishes to think wisely about religion. By no possibility can any one of us be independent of the Bible's influence. Our intellectual heritage is full of its words and phrases, ideas and formulass. Ignorance of it constitutes a hopeless handicap in the endeavor to understand any great Western literature"
(Henry Emerson Fosdick, The Modern Use of The Bible, 1925)

Quote:

"Progressive people simply cede their power to opponents when they leave interpretation of our religious heritage, or the meaning of our nation, or authentic Family Values, to the reactionaries, the chauvinists, and the bigots."
(John A. Buehrens, Understanding the Bible, an Introduction for Skeptics, Seekers, and Religious Liberals, 2003)

Many people today have little, if any, understanding of the Bible. Unless we teach our children about the stories and history of Judiasm and Christianity the interpretations of the Pat Robertsons of the world become Truth. I think its a wonderful idea to offer an elective course in the literature and culture of the ancient times. Just so long as no one tries to interpret "Truth".

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The bible and religious teachings should stay where they belong in religious houses of worship and the home. Not taught in the public schools. IMO it will only as religion always is an instrument of divisiveness. It is just another attempt by the holy rollers to infect the US with religion. It also make a mockery of the separation and church and state statutes.
Religion the divisive fifth column which if allowed will destroy this nation.

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Christianity is a part of our history and our culture.

Imagine learning about European history without talking about Popes, the council of Trent or the Spanish Inquisition.

There are many things from the Bible that every educated person knows. Concepts like "The Good Samaritan" or using abortion as a Shibboleth.

I teach my kids about the words of Jesus precisely because what Jesus said and did is so different from the so-called Christians who are causing such problems in our life today.

In the Bible, Jesus says "Love your Enemies", "Turn the Other Cheek" and "Forgive as you have been forgiven". If people understood and accepted this, there would be no Republicans.

But as a matter of principle, I think teaching the Bible as literature and an undeniable part of European history and culture is an important part of education.

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I think that J_B and Bella Dea have a very good grasp on what this course is intending. It is not being used as a 100% truth that must be taught to everyone.

If it is elective then wouldn't the person thinking about taking the course have the responsibility of finding out exactly what is going to be taught? Then, shouldn't they decide on whether they wanted to take the course or not?

It seems, even when given what they supposedly ask for, some still aren't going to agree with any kind of religious text in schools. Isn't compromise supposed to be about what everyone can accept? Rarely, in a true compromise, does anyone get 100% of what they want.

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Ebrown_p
I high school I had a course called if I remember correctly ancient and medieval history. It was taught from a historical prospective and not a biblical one. Sure most of the history during medieval times included that of the church and was part of the course. However, the biblical myths were not included. This is just another attempt to have intelligent design included in the curriculum.

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au1929,

Perhaps you are missing something about this?

J_B, explained in this statement how they are doing this:

Quote:

I too think an understanding of the Bible is important for non-Christians. I do not think it should be required reading as scripture, but I do think it is invaluable in understanding the literary, artistic, and cultural history of the Western world.

It is not being taught as a religious text to promote anything. Again, if it is elective, it is on the person choosing to take the course to understand how it is being taught. If they don't agree with it, they don't have to take it. Do you have a problem with them having that choice?

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Momma

Quote:

I too think an understanding of the Bible is important for non-Christians.

I am sure you noticed this statement. It is quite telling, it's to teach the Christian bible to us non Christians. The bible and beliefs of others are irrelevant. If I want to study fairy tales I choose Grimms.
Religion with all it's failings should be kept out of public education.

There is nothing devised by men that is more divisive that religion in any form.

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From the Article at the start of this thread:

Quote:

Now, a new textbook for high school students aims to fill a gap by teaching the Bible, both the Old and New Testaments, in a nonsectarian, nonreligious way as a central document of Western civilization with a vast influence on its literature, art, culture and politics.

"It's not about belief. It's about crucial knowledge and knowledge belongs in our schools," said Chuck Stetson, a New York investment banker who is the driving force behind and co-author of "The Bible and Its Influence" -- a glossy, 387-page book recently released and now being tested in a small number of schools mainly on the West Coast.

So, it doesn't matter that it is being done in a nonsectarian and nonreligious way? It doesn't matter that it is a completely elective course? So, you should get what you want and those that would like to have this are just out of luck? Does that sound fair to you? It's called a compromise. You can take the course if you want to. If you don't want to then don't. It's not being taught as a religious doctrine in this case. What is wrong with that?

Quote:

"This is the first student textbook we've had that is both constitutional and age appropriate," said Charles Hayes of the Freedom Forum's First Amendment Center, a nonpartisan foundation that monitors free speech.

Guess the fact that it is being declared both constitutional and age appropriate also does not matter?

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I have to side with au on this. It is just an insidious way to get the Bible in school. Anybody wishing to know about the Bible has ample opportunities already. If anybody is paying attention, the atheists and agnostics on a2k know as much about it as the believers. Whay is that? Because it is already a pervasive part of the culture to the extent that one almost breaths Bibles from infancy on.

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So, it does not matter that someone from the Freedom Forum's First Amendment Center that monitors free speech calls this constitutional?

I thought that was the big argument here. I thought it was all because it would be considered unconstitutional? I wish someone would explain.

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The Constitution is a man made document, not some infallible divine work, and is open to mistakes and bad interpretations. Even if it said specifically that the Bible should be allowed, it still would not be so as far as I am concerned.

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All this time I am being told that the constitution advocates separation of church and state and now I get the constitution is infallible?

So, then perhaps the advocation of separation of church and state is in error afterall?

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I said not infallible. But it still is being used to push separation of church and state, and I will strive to keep it like that. Your words are sneaky, Momma.

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Momma wrote

Quote:

So, it doesn't matter that it is being done in a nonsectarian and nonreligious way?

That is a pipe dream if the basic text is the bible with all it's BS. History should be taught from history books without the biblical distortions to get the truth about the Christianity of medieval Europe. As I said I had that course in high school.

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How many books did you read in English class that were just stories? What about the DaVinci Code? There are some that believe the DaVinci Code is real. Others don't. Now, you obviously don't believe the Bible is truth.

So, what is it that you are so against? Afraid people can't make up their own minds? There are many that read the Bible that don't believe it is the Word of God. Many posters on these threads can quote the Bible quite well. Yet, they don't believe it to be true. The fact that they read it certainly hasn't changed their opinion of whether it is truth to them or not.

So, you would take the choice away from those that might view the book as just that, a book? Why?

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Momma wrote

Quote:

All this time I am being told that the constitution advocates separation of church and state and now I get the constitution is infallible?

So, then perhaps the advocating of separation of church and state is in error after all

?
As it is in Iran and some of the other Moslem nations. This nation was founded with the promise of freedom of and freedom from religion. That is one of it's strengths and it's greatness. The present occupant of the white house and the evangelicals would like nothing better than turning it into a Christian theocracy.

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So now we are changing the subject? And I thought it was freedom of religion? I have been the one asking if it was freedom from religion that was really desired and was assured it was freedom of religion. Hmmmm.

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It's not like you won't learn the Bible anyway. It is force fed to society every moment of the day. Why do Christians want to force it on the schools like that, when they know it isn't wanted by a significant number of people?

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It is not that often that I agree with Momma and disagree with Edgar... but this is one case.

The Bible and Christian beliefs are an important part of our history and culture. You can not understand US history or culture without an understanding of Biblical themes.

Some examples...

Dr. King stood at the Lincoln Memorial and said "I have been to the mountaintop". These words were powerful because everyone understood he was invoking Moses who lead the Biblical Israelites out of slavery.

How many David and Goliath stories are there? The idea of the weak standing against the Goliath is a key theme in our cuture.

And the Christ figure which is so much a part of our literature from Hemingway to "The Matrix".

Every culture has its literature and its mythology. There is no denying that the Jewish and Christian scriptures are as much a part of our culture as anything.

You can teach the bible as part of our culture without teaching religion. Doing this is not a violation of church-state separation.

We should teach it-- I would go as far as saying that biblical knowledge is part of being an educated American. I would also repeat that biblical knowledge is the best protection against fundamentalism.

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Momma- I think that the problem is not with the Bible, which I consider one of the most important books to come out of western civilization.

I believe that the problem is that there is a perception, on the part of many people, that fundamentalist Christians are attempting to change the tenor of the U.S. to become more consonant with their own parochial beliefs.

There is a backlash, amongst not only non-believers and non-Christians, but even mainstream Christians. One of the glories of this republic, is the concept of the separation of church and state. At this time, insinuating the Bible into publicly funded schools, seems to many simply another way to bring religious beliefs into the public sphere.

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New US textbook aims to teach Bible as knowledge

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