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George Galloway fans check in here :The Squawk in Noo York.

 
 
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 05:35 am
Or the Grapple in the Apple.

Either way it is fair comment to say George Galloway (yes him of Senate Blasting fame) and Christopher Hitchens (brother of Peter Hitchens) no longer get on.

And the motion set forward at Baruch College NYC

"The war in Iraq was necessary and just"

Galloway to Saddam Hussein (not that Saddam was there of course, he couldnt get away)

"I salute your courage, your strength, your indefatigability. And I want you to know that we are with you until victory, until victory, until Jerusalem"

.....the planes that slammed into the twin towers...did not come out of a clear blue sky....they emerged out of a swamp of hatred created by us...its because of the total complete unending and bottomless support for sharons crimes against the Palestinian people

Mr Hitchens thought this displayed bias.

"Mr Galloway, you picked the wrong city to say that"

Galloway to Hitchens

"You start off being the liberal mouthpiece for one of the most reactionary governments this country has every known and you end up a mouth piece and apologist for these miserable malevolent incompetents who cannot even pick up the bodies of their own citizens in New Orleans"

H to G

"The mans search for a tyrannical fatherland never ends! The Soviet Union's let him down, Albania's gone, the red army is out of Afghanistan.....

G to H

"Mr Hitchens policy has succeeded in making 10,000 new Bin Ladens"

"What Mr Hitchens has done is unique in natural history the first ever metamorphosis from a butterfly into a slug. The one thing a slug does leave behind is a trail of slime"

"People like Mr Hitchens are ready to fight to the last drop of other people's blood, and its utterly and completely contemptible"

H to G

"You have fallen out of the gutter and into the sewer"

......................................................

But its not always been like this.

Once upon a time when politics meant something, and Stalin was hardly cold, George and Christopher were buddies.

George called Chris the "finest polemicist of his generation"

but no longer

Christopher deplores George's ad hominen attacks, going on to say (in Vanity Fair)

"Those of us who revere the vagina are committed to defend it against the very idea that it is a mouth or has teeth. Study the photographs of Galloway from Syrian state televeision however, and you will see how unwise and incautious it is for such a hideous person to resort to personal remarks. Unkind nature which could have made a perfectly good butt out of his face, has spoiled the whole effect by taking an a$$hole and studding it with ill-brushed fangs".

And George has not held back either

"Hitchens: that drink sodden former Trotskyist popinjay"

...................................................

So a jolly good time was had by all. Next round, Albert Hall London

"The Brawl in the Hall"

or Middlesbrough Riverside Stadium

"Slaughter by the Water"

I must say I'm proud of these two Brits who are showing the Americans what political debate is all about.........oh nearly forgot. Was the war necessary and justified? Who cares, this is much better.

(with apologies to Mathew Norman and David Usborne of the Indy)
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McTag
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 05:43 am
Oona King in The Guardian G2 today thought Galloway won the debate, but stretched quite a few truths making his points.
But not all of course.
The debate is over an international war crime, let's not forget- I refer to the invasion of Iraq.

article
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1571361,00.html

cartoon
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/stevebell/archive/0,14955,1284265,00.html
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Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 06:03 am
I just voted for Oona King...she's away at present.

I agree McT the war is a serious matter. So serious in fact that I can no longer take it seriously.

I was going to say something about those Algerians lifted and to be deported for embarrassing the British Government...the Ricin Terror Gang. (Used as justification for the war by Blair and Colin Powell at the UN....). This was another triumph for democracy. Only snag, there never was any ricin. But why let evidence get in the way of a good story eh? ...back to the Chris and George show...
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 09:21 am
Ms. Strassel has a different view, McT.

Quote:
'Sinister Piffle'
Christopher Hitchens "debates" a demagogue.


BY KIMBERLEY A. STRASSEL
Friday, September 16, 2005 12:01 a.m. EDT

If I had to choose two words to sum up the overwhelming impression left by this week's raucous "debate" over the Iraq war between polemicist Christopher Hitchens and British MP George Galloway, I'd have to choose the ones that came straight from Mr. Hitchens's mouth: "sinister piffle." Mr. Hitchens was of course referring to everything Mr. Galloway had said up to that point, a verbal burble that unfortunately defined too much of the evening.

The activist crowds had been salivating over this event for weeks. Two Brits, both famed for their oratorical skills, meeting in New York for a death match over bombs and dictators. One, Mr. Hitchens, a former Trotskyist and staunch supporter of the war, in part on the grounds that it rid the region of a demonic autocrat. The other, Mr. Galloway, a thuggish Scotsman who in May had won media plaudits for berating the U.S. Senate for the Iraq invasion. And just to make it that much juicier, two men who openly despise each other, frequently hurling personal insults ("popinjay," "drink-sodden," "vulgar") both in person and in print.

What a letdown. Mr. Hitchens, it should be said, gave it his best shot. Famous for his erudition, the writer came armed with facts, figures and inescapable logic. He kept to the formal debate style--"we on this side of the House hold . . ."--and gently waved down those of his supporters who would heckle Mr. Galloway. He picked apart his opponent's positions and did it with wit and humor. If this had been a true "debate," any Plato, Disraeli or Webster would have handed Mr. Hitchens the win on a plate.

But this was no debate. A debate, by definition, requires two people to defend their convictions. Mr. Galloway has no obvious convictions, or at least none that are defensible. This is a man who is antiwar, yet supports those who fight war against us. He accuses America of supporting dictators, yet in July traveled to Syria to praise its tyrant, Bashar al-Assad. He claims to have known that Saddam massacred his own people in 1988, yet went to Baghdad six years later to "salute" the monster for his "courage" and "strength."

Nor is Mr. Galloway in any way a debater. His talent--if that's what you'd call it--is in whipping mindless crowds into furious hysteria over perceived bogeymen. There are historical precedents here, and let's just say that as the waves of Galloway outrage and anger ripped across the auditorium I half-expected his acolytes to break into a "Heil!" or two.

To take but one example. Mr. Hitchens asked Mr. Galloway and the crowd how it was possible for a man who in Syria had praised the Iraqi terrorists to come to New York and evoke Cindy Sheehan, whose son was murdered by said terrorists?

Good question.

Mr. Galloway's response was typical. He began by railing that "neo-con rot" had seeped into people's souls. He lamented that he had to put up with this "hypocrite Hitchens." He ranted that Mr. Hitchens was friends with people who owned "Tomahawk" missiles, thus allowing him to segue into a tirade about America's treatment of its Indians (I'm not making this up). And as if to show that there were no depths to which he would not proudly sink, Mr. Galloway finished his "answer" to Mr. Hitchens's question by announcing that the planes that brought down the World Trade Center were the direct result of "hatred created by the U.S." and by appealing to anti-Semites with a few risible remarks about Israel.

It says something about those in attendance that these Sept. 11 remarks--uttered in New York, just a scream away from Ground Zero--earned Mr. Galloway wild applause. Another crowd highlight was the response to Mr. Hitchens's opening request for a moment of silence to remember the 160 Iraqis who'd been brutally murdered in Baghdad earlier that day. One man immediately shouted "No!" as comrades began jeering and booing the journalist. America, meet your "antiwar" activists.

All of which gets back to Mr. Hitchens's incredibly insightful phrase, "sinister piffle." It'd be nice, and easy, to write off Mr. Galloway. After all, he wields no power in British politics and is widely viewed by serious people as ridiculous.

But there are always those who aren't serious. Mr. Galloway's speechifying contained no merit, ergo piffle. Yet to the extent that it demagogued Israel or President Bush or Halliburton, or that it legitimized terrorists and mass murders--all in the name of stirring up anger and hatred and giving the masses targets on which to unload their fury--it was sinister.

There isn't much for it, of course. Mr. Galloway is more fortunate than the Syrians who live under his buddy Mr. Assad and is free to speak his mind. But my advice, should Mr. Hitchens ever be asked for a repeat performance? Don't waste your time.

Ms. Strassel is a senior editorial page writer at The Wall Street Journal.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 11:56 am
MP3 audio clips can be found ... HERE.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 02:20 pm
thnks tico

strassel is obviously desperate

even oona king said galloway won
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jpinMilwaukee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 02:27 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
MP3 audio clips can be found ... HERE.


Stop the War Productions. That first half hour sounds like a comedy variety hour.
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FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 02:30 pm
Sounds like an excellent debate. I'm off to go try to find a transcript.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 02:31 pm
no sound card on my machine, can you hand sign?
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 02:55 pm
i see

grab it like that and

what up and down

er

not in the essence of the game surely
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 02:59 pm
Steve (as 41oo) wrote:
thnks tico

strassel is obviously desperate

even oona king said galloway won


Don't know oona king, but I know others who say Galloway lost. I'm sure there's a split of opinion.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 03:05 pm
well maybe he did

couldnt give a flying **** myself

but the verbiage was magnificient imo Smile
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 03:06 pm
I enjoyed it.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Nov, 2005 05:08 am
Galloway coming unstuck

"Oh, what a tangled web..."

http://news.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=2192382005
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Nov, 2005 06:10 am
looks like galloway was hardly alone. however, i can confirm that i personally never received a penny in oil back handers frn saddam hussein and i'm really pissed off about that.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Nov, 2005 07:57 am
So his spokesman received money, that's a ways from Galloway actually receiving money. Unless I misinterpreted the article.
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McTag
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Jan, 2006 04:11 am
The long arm of the law is reaching for Gorgeous George's neck.

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/otherparties/story/0,,1694270,00.html

Shame, that these words he said, which needed saying, came from such a source. Shame, that no-one else had the guts to say them.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Jan, 2006 09:54 am
DT just lost their appeal

"In addition to the SFO's moves, the high court will hear the result of an appeal this morning by the Daily Telegraph against Mr Galloway's £150,000 libel award against the newspaper."

Another round for the buffoon in the box. Did you see that picture of him on the front page of the Guardian McTag?

What a shame all the foolery detracts from his serious political points. And the establishment must think with enemies like this, who needs allies?
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