Are You Part of the Problem or Part of the Solution?

I am one of the nicest people, but when I drive I swear and call people names. I could probably stop myself from doing it, but it's so much fun and it seems to help.

Okay, but what part of the law says you can't do that? Are you calling them names to their faces or are you doing it in the privacy of your own vehicle? Does the law need to be amended? If so, how would you amend it?

Our first problem? If so, do you have a solution?

I don't swear to their faces, but if they can read lips like I can, they know what I'm saying. And, then, there are the occasional hand gestures.

Solutions..... hmmm..... More stringent testing before issuing licenses? More emphasis on medatative survival skills?

You mean TM to cut down on anger?

1. You can never kill another human being unless in self-defense of yourself or your family.
Dos this mean that if Gus comes onto my property with intentions of having sexual relations with my favority platypus duck I can't shoot the fargin bastich on the spot?
2. You must always consider the feelings of others and respect them, refraining from calling them names or belittling them.
Even retards that wake me up on sat morning to offer me a copy of The Watch Tower?
3. Principles before personalities always applies in any situation. The decisions are made on what is good for the whole of this nation.
Again with this mob rule mentality! The greatest good for the greastest number is sinking to the lowest common denominator. A vulgar concept at its best.
In order to be a citizen of the United People's Nation, you must take an oath that you will uphold these laws.I'm an anarchist!

Okay, remember, we have ONLY THREE LAWS. So, your "problem" appears to be with the first law. So, this is my question to you. Would you consider learning to handle that particular situation in a different manner in order to not break the law. Remember what you will be giving up if you do break the law. You have everything you need without doing anything. All your extras in the UPN you earn yourself. But, we all are equally taken care of. Would you give that up instead of learning another way to handle your anger at the other drivers? Also remember, it's principles before personalities. The law before our own egos and needs. (Not pointing out I think you have an ego here.) We all do. Just trying to make my point.

Dyslexia,

Now, we are REALLY getting somewhere.

Law Number One simply states: You can never kill another human being unless.... So, this presents another problem for the UPN (i.e., someone wanting to do the nasty with your platypus duck.) And, doesn't this person who wants to do your duck seem to be breaking law Number Two? He/she is not considering your feelings and is not showing respect for you. So, how would you be part of this solution? Do we amend the law? How?

Okay on your comment about being woke up. You didn't exactly follow the law here. The law states ...refraining from calling them names... However, you are not a citizen of the UPN. So, if you are in the UPN, whether visiting, etc., does that not mean you should obey the laws? So, how would you be part of this solution?

And we are trying to avoid the mob rule mentality. I believe the mob rule mentality has a very negative connotation to it. It is not mob rule. It is what is good for the UPN as a whole, finding compromises that will satisfy all those involved. You can be an anarchist if you want. But, my question to you is still, would you be willing to modify your behavior and follow the law in order to keep what you have? If not, how would you have the law amended?

And remember, it's YOUR CHOICE. You decide whether to be a part of the UPN or not.

And please remember, this is all in the spirit of exchanging ideas and information and trying to find solutions to many of the problems we face. I am a strong believer, very strong believer, in not lowering the standards of morals to accommodate those that do not or will not follow the basic rules in life. I speak not of abortion laws, etc. I speak of man being kind to fellow man, being an encouragement instead of discouragement, helping one another, etc. I am very curious as to why it seems mankind on a whole is lowering their standards.

I posed this scenario because though it is simple, it still brings up the problems we face. Already we have had those admit they break one of the laws and then was asked a question concerning that.

Then we have you, someone who "seems" to find fault with the laws, as many of us do in today's society. So, in order to find a solution to a problem, the problem must first be identified, and you have identified your problem with the laws. Now, what is your solution?

Hummmm....so if you encounter someone like Adolph Hitler or Saddam Hussein or Idi Amin or Caligula or Joseph Stalin...

...you've got to respect them?

Are you suggesting that we should also "respect" their "beliefs?"

"Oh, excuse me, Mr. Hitler....but with all the respect in the world, I just think that gassing all those people and then throwing their bodies into ovens is really a bit over the top. I wonder if I could, also with as much respect as possible and without calling you any names or belittling you or your "beliefs" in any way...prevail on you to cease this activity?"

None of us, MA...except people who are insane....agree with and show respect for all other ideas, notions, and "beliefs."

All of us draw the line.

You seem to want to be the one who draws the line....and you would have the rest of us toe that line.

You think I have no right, for instance, to suppose that religion and beliefs....any any other superstitions of that ilk...are absolutely polluting our planet and should be attacked with as much gusto as absolutely possible...and with as little concern as possible for whether or not anyone is offended in doing so.

I think you are wrong.

How do you suggest we resolve that?

geeez chill Apisa and read the thread properly

I see, the UPN's first Resident King Kong. Ok, a problem.

You are taking issue with Law Number Two. If you find someone breaking the law of the UPN, is it not your duty as a citizen to report this lawbreaker? If you break the law because he is breaking the law, how does that become a solution?

I propose the solution would be to turn the lawbreaker into the proper authorities and go through the system and be tried by a jury and if found guilty, then punished.

You do not have to agree with their actions, their beliefs, etc. You are held to the laws of the UPN as they are. So, if you break a law, how does that help find a solution?

We are not speaking of religions in this scenario. We are speaking of a made up land with three laws and how we would deal with that scenario.

And as for your ....any other superstitions of that ilk....comment. We are discussing ways in this thread to address the problems and find solutions for them that serves the whole of mankind. Law Number Three is principles over personalities.

And you have every right to think that I am wrong. There is no law in the UPN to forbid you to do that.

I am asking you, Frank, please, understand this is just a discussion of a made up scenario and the problems that result from the given laws and ways to find solutions.

Looks like Kiwichic wants to be part of the solution.

If you have something to point out to me, Kiwi...point it out.

I read the thread...and I've read it properly.

My comments and questions hold.

I understand that.

But my concerns with #2 are valid...and I would like to see them addressed.

By the way...don't think that my concerns with #2...which have been presented in many guises over the years both here and over in Abuzz....are new.

I have discussed this point at great length with many people....and none of them have ever given a satisfactory response to my concerns.

We do NOT respect all people...nor do we respect all "beliefs." At least...none of the sane people among us do.

So who gets to draw the line?

In this scenerio, you would get the mandatory life sentence because you cannot see beyond your own little world as it is today. In the make believe world being proposed, your concerns about rule #2 would be covered by rule #3. Momma seems to be talking about starting over with choices to be made knowing the rules in advance. Based on your last post, I must be insane. I DO respect all people..even you. I don't have to agree with their beliefs, but they have a right to have them. Who am I to make judgement on them? If you want to make judgements, that is up to you and I respect your right to do so..I just don't agree with it.

So you respect someone like Hitler for his "right" to have his "beliefs."

If so...you probably are insane....or just too in love with your "beliefs" to acknowledge that some "beliefs"...and some conduct is not worthy of respect.

In fact...the notion that all "beliefs" and all people are worthy of respect...is, in my opinion, not worth any respect at all.



That is the problem with these kinds of things. They sound good...but mostly, they are just words being used in furtherance of an agenda.

This is all related to something MA and I discussed elsewhere.

MA wants to assert that she is open-minded on various questions about the nature of REALITY.

She is not. She is completely close-minded on those issues....and in fact, brags about being completely close-minded on them. Often, although it seems incredible...within sentences of each other.

This is not to say she is a bad person for this. Just that she is not thinking deeply enough on the issue.

She also claims to be willing to learn.

Well...here is her chance.

Let's see how it goes.

By the way, Intrepid....your comment:

...

...is as absurd as it is incorrect.

would you care to expand on that?

Yes, Intrepid, that is what I am talking about. Starting over from scratch. This is all to help me (and hopefully, others) pin some things down.

I started this out with only three rules because I realize that others will want to make changes in the rules as our UPN scenario grows. So, actually, we don't even have any Hitlers yet in the UPN.

And if you are insane, then so am I. I too believe everyone has the right to their beliefs, to be respected, if for nothing else than that they are a person, and to not be ridiculed.

But, I also realize there will be those that will try to break, bend, twist, and distort the laws and justify their actions in doing it. Herein comes the problems of the society. From there, is where we start finding solutions.

So, Frank, you don't have to respect the person's beliefs, ideas, or actions. But, just simply respect the human being as a human being period. If you feel they are breaking the law, as I have asked you before, would you then break the law also? Would you break Law Number 2 or would you just turn them into the authorities and let them handle it?

I promise Frank, once we really get this thing going, you are going to be very instrumental in this discussion. So, I hope I answered your question at least a little bit. Just for the early stages of the UPN here, pretend we don't have any Hitlers, etc. It's like the United States in the fifties didn't have rampage killings and such (if they did they didn't have them to the extent they do today - just trying to head you off on that one! )

Sitting here... still watching!! :-)