Random Search of Bags on NYC Subways: Constitutional?

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The 4th amendment to the constitution states:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

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NEW YORK -- Police will begin conducting random searches of packages and backpacks carried by people entering city subways, Mayor Michael Bloomberg announced Thursday after a new series of bomb attacks in London.

Authorities said the system for the checks is still being developed, but the plan is for passengers carrying bags to be selected at random before they have passed through turnstiles.

Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly promised that officers would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers will be free to "turn around and leave" rather than consent to a search.

Officials wouldn't immediately say how frequently the checks would occur. The checks are scheduled to be in place by rush hour on Friday morning.

"We just live in a world where, sadly, these kinds of security measures are necessary," Bloomberg said. "Are they intrusive? Yes, a little bit. But we are trying to find that right balance."

Authorities said there is also a possibility that checks will be conducted of some bus and train passengers.

http://www.wnbc.com/news/4753242/detail.html

I am just wondering...is this constitutional? How?

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I think it is. If you were on a subway and someone had a bomb, the random check may save your life.

If you have nothing to hide, you shouldn't be pissed. I think that the "one bad apple spoils the bushel" rule applies here. One bad (or 2 whatever) does something artocious and now we all have to pay for it.

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What is the difference with checking bags on the subway, train or bus than an airplane?

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It's probably constitutional so long as the searches are truly random and not race- or gender-based or otherwise discriminatory. Look for a rights group of some sort suing if the searches are confined to particular subway lines, particularly if the lines are in not so racially diverse areas or only in poor areas.

The Constitution states that the people are to be kept free of unreasonable searches so the police will hang their hats on the reasonableness angle. Do they need a warrant? Is consent to search implicit in buying a subway token or pass? Stay tuned and pop some popcorn, this is about to get interesting.

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I think that since you are paying to utilize a service, then you can be required to comply with the security measures. You have the choice to use the subway and be searched, or the choice to use a differentt method of transportation.

If you were on a public area, such as a park, then the searches would not be legal.

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<doh!-bul post>

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Such items in the constitution as the 4th amendment have been declared null and void by the patriot act. The terrorists have won. Only liberals who hate america would cling to such nonsense as the 4th amendment.

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What jespah said ... not what dys said.

Probably constitutional if truly random. This is the same approach to DUI checkpoints.

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Also depends on your interpretation of "unreasonable." Lots of wiggle-room there.

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Consent to search seems implicit in buying an airline ticket. I guess it's going to pass the test.

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Most of the Big City Dope Peddlers come to the Poconos by bus from the Big Apple. Local judges have thrown out several busts on grounds that the searches were random and unreasonable.

Evidently NYC detectives have greater latitude to search suspicious looking travelers.

Since the busts were disallowed, the local police ask for permission to search from all kinds of people.

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You haven't been able to get in to see a movie in downtown Tranna without getting your stuff searched for years. Actually - decades. You wanna be on their premises, you have to go with their rules.

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You can legally search either everyone, or random people on a set criteria (e.g., every 20 people). You can't do discretionary searches (e.g., young arab males).

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It seems to me that it could be a condition of entry onto the premises and use of the service offered (in the contract a passenger enters into when they buy their ticket) that they consent to have their bags searched. If you don't want your bag searched then walk.

But if something subject to seizure (dope for example) was found in the bag would that be admissible on the basis that it was a consensual search?

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If you go to the motorcycle races at Shannonville Raceway, they do not allow glass bottles on the premises. Part of the deal to enter with your ticket is that any bags be searched. Anything that is posted as non-admissible is confiscated. I would think the same would apply.

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Was it Jack Bailey, or Art Linkletter, who used to, on his quiz show, go into the audience, and empty a woman's purse? I don't use a pocketbook now, but at the time, I remember thinking that if I were the one whose bag were searched, I would have been embarrassed to death.

Seriously though, because of what has been going on in London, I think that random searches will be somewhat of a deterrent for terrorists. I am a little unsure of the "politically correct" wisdom of not profiling. Statistically, what were the profiles of the people who have committed acts of terrorism in the last decade or so? I think that it would be reasonable to use that percentage as a measure of which people need to be searched. Anything beyond the profile, could be random.

It may be unfair to a lot of good people, but spending time searching 80 year old grandmothers is a waste of time and law enforcement funds.

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Phoenix32890 wrote:

Quote:

It may be unfair to a lot of good people, but spending time searching 80 year old grandmothers is a waste of time and law enforcement funds.

Does Ma Barker ring a bell? Not to suggest that she was a terrorist, only that age and sex does not matter. Terrorism knows no bounds so age is not a factor. Sad but true.

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Intrepid wrote:

the motorcycle races at Shannonville Raceway

Have we met?

~~~~~~~~~

and yup to no free passes on the searches to lil ole ladies.

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ehBeth wrote:

Intrepid wrote:
the motorcycle races at Shannonville Raceway

Quote:
Have we met?

My son used to race 600 750 Superbike. I used to spend a lot of time at Shannonville. He gave it up a few years ago to raise a family.

It is a sad commentary on today's society, but searches are inevitable.

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Constitutional or not it would be criminal if everything possible was not done to thwart a terrorist attack. Up to and including profiling.

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Random Search of Bags on NYC Subways: Constitutional?

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