3
   

Is freewill biblical or something we invented ?

 
 
davidsheep88
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 29 Jan, 2023 11:25 am
@davidsheep88,
You can't blame life Frank, you have to live a little the answer of the meaning the life is just around the corner. Don't worry Frank in the end all asnwers come to you and you will find yours here ! In this thread !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rO2_65yuLsw&list=PLMB4t9LDJC52XgwHv8Wll4PKFr7DlqS3n&index=11

Live a little ;D.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jan, 2023 01:03 pm
@davidsheep88,
Yeah, Rodney and I could probably have some good conversations, but he's only echoing what Solomon's advice was:

“I can recommend no better thing for a man to do, than to Eat, drink, and enjoy the fruits of his labors.”

What often goes unnoticed is that sage advice applies only after a life of raw effort, of one kind or another.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Jan, 2023 06:27 am
@davidsheep88,
davidsheep88 wrote:

You can't blame life Frank, you have to live a little the answer of the meaning the life is just around the corner. Don't worry Frank in the end all asnwers come to you and you will find yours here ! In this thread !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rO2_65yuLsw&list=PLMB4t9LDJC52XgwHv8Wll4PKFr7DlqS3n&index=11

Live a little ;D.


I don't want to live a little, David...I want live a LOT...and I do.

I am a very happy, content individual...with lots of interests and avenues for enjoying life. At 86, I probably do more than many people in their 40's and 50's.
davidsheep88
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 30 Jan, 2023 01:12 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Going to talk in a different way and lets hope you guys see the example it not my way but still understand of the law

I am going to use a real world example to get my point across about the difference of our two approaches. I am going to use the example of the war on drugs. Because I am going to use that example.

I was watching a series about the war on drugs the other day narrated by Samuel L. Jackson. It made the point about how people don't take drugs out of some moral failure. They take drugs in order to try to get, or replace, something they need. They didn't necessarily get too far into that, but I say it is the love that I have been trying to tell you about. They made a specific example of cannabis, saying it was better at imitating the natural chemicals present in the brain, when people feel loved enough that their brains are orchestrated accordingly, than other substances, like alcohol.



Well, in country after country drugs are illegal. People go to jail. People have their lives messed up with compliance sentencing. People get addicted. The program went into the extreme lack of success in dealing with this sort of thing that programs like AA have had. They only help a small percentage. They make you confess you are a sinner every time you stand up in a meeting. They are your people. They come with lots of promises, but are not really any help.


This only gets worse as whole economic regions succumb to poverty, or strictures implemented by people like you. That's when people are really oppressed in their souls and need more help. That's when they need love more. That's when you judge them more!


Seems like there is an answer. Portugal had a terrible problem with drugs, until they decided to legalize all drugs. I mean all drugs. Guess what, the country did not descend into a drug induced coma. They found they had trouble with the same small group of people that you might expect, about 5 percent of the population, but that trouble with the rest of the people went away. You see, they got what they needed, without having to go to some illegal source for it. It didn't mushroom into the fantasy that the right wing imagined in their need to judge others. It did not indulge the right wing's panic. It' just get worse and worse each day. People decided that not us.



I have been telling you that the root problem we are dealing with has to do with the knowledge of good and evil. We are not judged by God for indulging in it, we are judged by ourselves. God put the tree in the garden so that we could learn not to use the knowledge of good and evil. It was not as you say, that it was a test that we failed. We are not polluted by sin. We are polluted by our need for love, if you will. We will commit all sorts of atrocities to get it. We will abuse. We will hurt and kill. It happens every day. It isn't that we need to end our need for love. It is that we need to find out how to actually get it. Many of us think we have it, but we are deluding ourselves because what we do to others to gain that confidence can be appalling.



Don't you realize what you are saying when you say these things about judgment? You know, that we have to satisfy some arcane arrangement before God before He will love us. Before He will save us. That just tells us how unloved we are. What you are really talking about, and should be happy about, is what it is like to spend time with God rather than without Him. That's admirable, but the wall you put up toward others isn't. Stop puttin wals that are against God put walls for humans but not for God.


The concept of right of way is the answer. It does not indulge in the knowledge of good and evil. It respects all persons equally. I have talked about this before. It's too much to get into now, on the end of such a post as this, but it is capable of distributing resources as people act to need them without limiting others who may want the same. It is the opposite of the legal approach that all of mankind is currently taking. Because there is no such thing as good and evil, not as you and your ilk profess. As I said in a previous post, He does want to stop us from how we seek the wrong ways of getting love, that distort and misshape us. He does not want that contorted reality for us, the one of conforming to legality. Good and evil is giving to us but we can do good isntead of evil and that is what he wants we are not Gods, only God is God. And only God judges God !

Humans have fallacy that is not true and grows and grows because we do not like to admit our errors but say God is wrong for giving our life. Really he asked us ebfore he sent us here for a mission you ahven't found what God sent you for this an example only.
davidsheep88
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 30 Jan, 2023 01:16 pm
@davidsheep88,
My point has always been that those who are spiritually dead are actually asleep and can be woken up. But that is all of us.

That when they are woken up, they have the option of going back to sleep. And disobey what God gives ya and go back to sin even though he got you out to notice your own situation.

What this means to me is that when Christ draws us to Him it is not the exact same thing as regeneration.

Regeneration would be when the person wholly wakes up and begins to walk around and live a new life in Christ.

When a person is drawn to Christ, they have the option of wholly waking up; they also have the option of going back to sleep. Don't go back to sleep remember that you can decide your future if you stop been in conflict God's will with yours you get to solve your situation. You have to do it and no matter what epople say they are wrong ;D !
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 Jan, 2023 01:46 pm
@davidsheep88,
davidsheep88 wrote:

Going to talk in a different way and lets hope you guys see the example it not my way but still understand of the law

I am going to use a real world example to get my point across about the difference of our two approaches. I am going to use the example of the war on drugs. Because I am going to use that example.

I was watching a series about the war on drugs the other day narrated by Samuel L. Jackson. It made the point about how people don't take drugs out of some moral failure. They take drugs in order to try to get, or replace, something they need. They didn't necessarily get too far into that, but I say it is the love that I have been trying to tell you about. They made a specific example of cannabis, saying it was better at imitating the natural chemicals present in the brain, when people feel loved enough that their brains are orchestrated accordingly, than other substances, like alcohol.



Well, in country after country drugs are illegal. People go to jail. People have their lives messed up with compliance sentencing. People get addicted. The program went into the extreme lack of success in dealing with this sort of thing that programs like AA have had. They only help a small percentage. They make you confess you are a sinner every time you stand up in a meeting. They are your people. They come with lots of promises, but are not really any help.


This only gets worse as whole economic regions succumb to poverty, or strictures implemented by people like you. That's when people are really oppressed in their souls and need more help. That's when they need love more. That's when you judge them more!


Seems like there is an answer. Portugal had a terrible problem with drugs, until they decided to legalize all drugs. I mean all drugs. Guess what, the country did not descend into a drug induced coma. They found they had trouble with the same small group of people that you might expect, about 5 percent of the population, but that trouble with the rest of the people went away. You see, they got what they needed, without having to go to some illegal source for it. It didn't mushroom into the fantasy that the right wing imagined in their need to judge others. It did not indulge the right wing's panic. It' just get worse and worse each day. People decided that not us.



I have been telling you that the root problem we are dealing with has to do with the knowledge of good and evil. We are not judged by God for indulging in it, we are judged by ourselves. God put the tree in the garden so that we could learn not to use the knowledge of good and evil. It was not as you say, that it was a test that we failed. We are not polluted by sin. We are polluted by our need for love, if you will. We will commit all sorts of atrocities to get it. We will abuse. We will hurt and kill. It happens every day. It isn't that we need to end our need for love. It is that we need to find out how to actually get it. Many of us think we have it, but we are deluding ourselves because what we do to others to gain that confidence can be appalling.



Don't you realize what you are saying when you say these things about judgment? You know, that we have to satisfy some arcane arrangement before God before He will love us. Before He will save us. That just tells us how unloved we are. What you are really talking about, and should be happy about, is what it is like to spend time with God rather than without Him. That's admirable, but the wall you put up toward others isn't. Stop puttin wals that are against God put walls for humans but not for God.


The concept of right of way is the answer. It does not indulge in the knowledge of good and evil. It respects all persons equally. I have talked about this before. It's too much to get into now, on the end of such a post as this, but it is capable of distributing resources as people act to need them without limiting others who may want the same. It is the opposite of the legal approach that all of mankind is currently taking. Because there is no such thing as good and evil, not as you and your ilk profess. As I said in a previous post, He does want to stop us from how we seek the wrong ways of getting love, that distort and misshape us. He does not want that contorted reality for us, the one of conforming to legality. Good and evil is giving to us but we can do good isntead of evil and that is what he wants we are not Gods, only God is God. And only God judges God !

Humans have fallacy that is not true and grows and grows because we do not like to admit our errors but say God is wrong for giving our life. Really he asked us ebfore he sent us here for a mission you ahven't found what God sent you for this an example only.


My only reply to the drug part of your comments here, David, is that I have been fighting for de-criminalization of drugs since the 1980's...often putting myself at risk of being busted by local police. I was removed from my position as the Chairman of the Traffic Commission and Chairman of the Community television station by our Mayor, because I publicly disclosed that I did a bone every once in a while. (Actually, a lot more often than that.) I also had an op ed sized letter on the issue printed in the New York Times. You can read it here, although there may be a paywall.

https://www.nytimes.com/1989/03/04/opinion/l-drugs-are-absolutely-everybody-s-problem-a-new-medicine-001189.html

I mention all this only as back-up for me telling you that I do not need any lecture from you on this issue...and that you are fucked up thinking I am on the other side of it.

As for the rest of your comments...well, I mean this sincerely:

I commend you for putting so much effort into sharing your blind guesses about these issues, but most of your efforts are barely above Alice in Wonderland thinking. If you want to blindly guess a god exists...and that some benefit accrues to those who kiss that god's ass...fine with me. I will not make that guess.

Keep at it, though, David. Never give up. That is my motto...and one I live by.
davidsheep88
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 30 Jan, 2023 02:55 pm
@Frank Apisa,
No way did I say you were on the otherside -_- but thanks. Know I would loved been your friend in real life ;D. But happy been friends in the interent know your not the only one but I have feeling you meet God you see all your worries were not real. He is real good guy ;D.
davidsheep88
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 2 Feb, 2023 12:56 pm
@davidsheep88,
Destiny can be changed and it's based on choice God gave it so use it wisely.
Rate this post positively


The Apostle Paul said:

Gal 1:11, But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
Gal 1:12, For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Gal 1:13, For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:
Gal 1:14, And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.
Gal 1:15, But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,
Gal 1:16, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
Gal 1:17, Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.

freewill does exist even do in light and dark is use it is God who decides.

We have freewill until we discover that God already has knowledge of all our thoughts and prayers and already acted on them.

So man has "freewill thinking" but God has complete knowledge of how that turns out.We have freewill God lets us decide to do good or bad and our purpose in life is when we make that decision. it’s easy to not know that purpose because we are different.

But freewill God gives it but he also gives us the law and the law is not wrong and niether is freewill just soceity itself is wrong and we have forgotten what is the normal back in those days. Society mistakes and thinks G-d is against freewill but gave freewill the right to choose and they have invented freewill is voting, paying taxes, and civics duties.

davidsheep88
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 2 Feb, 2023 01:01 pm
@davidsheep88,
Sometimes even though we are not supposed to do evil in a sinful anture doing evil can do good and when we do his plan we encounter some promblems that ask us to do evil but condition on our freewill and know balance not to overstep it. Even with those reasons, we can still choose between good and evil.

I may have a reason to do evil; and yet may still perform good.

And I may have a reason to do good; and yet may still perform evil.

Does God give us reasons to do evil?

Man has been plagued in good vs evil since it's dawn from the fall but we can do good. Sometimes we must do what the kings of the time of David did and the times of the prophets did like ezekiel. Even though it shouldn't of happen Elijah killed for the lord and abigail lied to do what was needed to save Israel.

Some say good people used the wrong approach to do good and protect the law from desecration like pharisees who ahrdened thier hearts protecting tradition before Jesus even though it was God there. ;D.

God directs their evil steps, but not artificially. He does it naturally.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2023 07:24 am
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
Keep at it, though, David. Never give up. That is my motto...and one I live by.

Good advice, I hope he takes it.

Forgive the change of subject but i want to ask if you had ever had any thoughts or guesses as to what the 'mark of the beast' in 'Revelation' could possibly be. You are literally the only one I could think of to ask. It has long puzzled me and I had the first hint of what it could possibly be this morning.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2023 07:43 am
@Leadfoot,
Leadfoot wrote:

Quote:
Keep at it, though, David. Never give up. That is my motto...and one I live by.

Good advice, I hope he takes it.

Forgive the change of subject but i want to ask if you had ever had any thoughts or guesses as to what the 'mark of the beast' in 'Revelation' could possibly be. You are literally the only one I could think of to ask. It has long puzzled me and I had the first hint of what it could possibly be this morning.


Honestly have not a clue, Leadfoot.

It may be nothing more than just another way to talk about "salvation" and "damnation."

In any case, I see the stories in the Bible in a way that probably is not helpful to those of you who see them as you do. To me they are symbolic of the mores of the people who wrote them...attempting to say what they had to say in a way that pleased them.

Sorta like what we all do here on the Internet.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2023 10:22 am
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
Honestly have not a clue, Leadfoot.

It may be nothing more than just another way to talk about "salvation" and "damnation."

In any case, I see the stories in the Bible in a way that probably is not helpful to those of you who see them as you do. To me they are symbolic of the mores of the people who wrote them...attempting to say what they had to say in a way that pleased them.

Sorta like what we all do here on the Internet.

Had hoped you made some attempt to finding some perspective from which the whole story made sense, including that bit.
I reason that If there was a God and he was the one in the Bible, there would be such a perspective. And the chances of that matching up with a random group of ancient mens' mores of the times? Unbelievable.

The theological choices are usually looked at as 'binary', but if ever there was a third way, you definitely qualify. Lame joke but said seriously. And consistent with my morning's 'revelation'. Maybe the last piece to fall in place.

Cheers
davidsheep88
 
  0  
Reply Thu 9 Feb, 2023 02:12 pm
@Leadfoot,
That si why LEadfoot Frank doesn't know what is freewill God gave you the choice to choose between good and evil. You can choose your path always.
0 Replies
 
 

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