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The meaning of getting to Mars? Your view?

 
 
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 05:03 am
Is getting to Mars anything more than getting a male contest on who can piss on the most distant tree? What is, not the Reason or the reasons, but the proto reason to go?
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Type: Question • Score: 17 • Views: 6,597 • Replies: 365

 
View best answer, chosen by Fil Albuquerque
farmerman
 
  3  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:07 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
dont you feel that, as we evolve as a species, we need to get deeper and deeper into more an more impossible discovery?

I dont think it warrants a why, its an inevitability thats deep within our wiring.

hightor
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:21 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:
Is getting to Mars anything more than getting a male contest on who can piss on the most distant tree?

Probably not.
Quote:
What is, not the Reason or the reasons, but the proto reason to go?

To get there before anyone else does.

It's certainly not connected with researching the origins of the solar system, observing the processes at work in our galaxy, or anything to do with understanding the forces which propel the universe because unmanned exploration could do these things much more cheaply.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:27 am
@farmerman,
I agree partially but I also believe there is a top threshold on which "discovery" makes us no longer humans, that although wired in our evolutionary process makes us blind to our own demise. Discovery without bounds ultimately swaps us out into something "Alien". Something that would drive a normal Homo Sapiens mad.

Now let me ask you something personal.
Do you fancy a brain implant to augment your intellectual capacity for the sake of "discovery" running the risk of becoming alienated to your own previous identity? Moreover, do you want to run the risk of being hacked directly instead of traditionally through classical marketing tactics?

I believe we all have a limit on what we allow ourselves to learn whether we are fully aware of it or not.
How far is too far for you?
I spend all my life praising Science and Technology and pushing the limits on all directions and I am still very much engaged with it every day for a great deal of the day itself, but that all said and granted, I am a Bio and I will die a Bio.

Mars has low gravity, no useful magnetosphere, and almost no atmo. Adapting to Mars is possible and a challenge, but is it necessary?

At the present day, in my current state of mind, I believe the Stars will not be for "Bios"...something else will carry the torch after us and with far less need for logistics. Bios are fragile and need a ton of care. A machine needs a power cell and its good to go.

Yes, I also agree that having more than one planet would be great for mankind, but my problem is to know what mankind will be very very soon down the line.

Thank you for dropping by Farma.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:33 am
@hightor,
I think, deep within the recesses of our thingies, we are beginning to wak up to the realities of solar system life cycles and we are beginning the stirrings of "what can e do about it"?

In order to make anything work, we really have to begin acting like a species and not a bunch of balkanized "breeds"

Look what the Vikings started.
Im sure we will go through a looong age of unmanned istant exploration, but that too, has a motive beneath it>

hightor
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:41 am
@farmerman,
Quote:
Im sure we will go through a looong age of unmanned istant exploration, but that too, has a motive beneath it>

I hope to see our quest for knowledge extended into space; I just don't think manned exploration is the most effective method of pursuing this end and I think it is largely driven by nationalism and the desire for resource exploitation.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:42 am
@hightor,
...these days "getting there", wherever there is, leaves me wondering at my own instinct in aw of what "there" is to mean for my ego. I can't even get "there" inside my own brain clockwork nor do I get to get "there" so close in my own body to my own microbiome. Where is "there" to get to? And why should I go?
Is it to forget that I am mortal, that my species is mortal, or to achieve my own alienating immortality?
To transcend or not transcend...
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 06:58 am
What? Piss on the most distant tree? They ain't no trees on Mars.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 07:01 am
@Setanta,
...but there will be, right? You can also piss on an alien rock for achievement bonus points to our species...
...fracking repeating fractals everywhere...we are no better than a microbe.
Bigger smaller, closer or far away, are all the same shizz.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 07:22 am
My 14K Star Citizen space fleet...how fracked up is that when I come up with a thread like this?

https://i.imgur.com/fZbJa5I.jpg
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 07:24 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
0 Replies
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 07:34 am
Back down to Earth and setting aside my ranting existential bullshit, here the quick dumb down layman summary:

0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:09 am
@hightor,
well, even if it is driven by those things you speak about, all space exploration will have a long term application in extending the human species for a few billion years longer.
Space exploration by robots nd electronic gizmos will have a long term use as I think i said earlier. Its main use will be collection of data and discoveries to report back to the mother ship eventually.
I like those data assessors that were tiny chips and sensors attached to these huge energy "sails". They could , conceivably reach 0.33 (c) speeding up our "far filed" data collection and sensing by many times over.

BUT, as Im certain, the death of the solar system will approach with some nasty initial symptoms which will probably result in our great X10^10000 grandchildren to more quickly plan for serious Sol-based expatriation.

Im a firm believer in distant generational planning . It will come. I dont see our species just giving up and saying "see you in the next big bang"
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:11 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
youre overthinking all this. Consider "survival of the species" as a given.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:20 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:
Do you fancy a brain implant to augment your intellectual capacity for the sake of "discovery" running the risk of becoming alienated to your own previous identity? Moreover, do you want to run the risk of being hacked directly instead of traditionally through classical marketing tactics?
I have no answer for this. Im not sure that a brain implant isnt just some sci fi solution.
Must verybody be involved in the quest for knowledge?? I dont think Id lik to be part of a BORG -like civilization, just because its a more efficient way to respond to a changing environment.

Remember, geniuses are capable of the hugest fuckups as well as the greatest discoveries.
I think our neural net evolution will serve us fairly well. I think we are approaching a nodal point now . Sorta like the "Big Seaparation" of the Oligocene, where species "jumped" (almost like saltation" into another linneage of daughter genera.

We think we are masters of evolution. I say Bullshit, thats jut feeble marketing by those who really dont understand life on earth. Its a amazing what a few million generations can produce with a little bit of pressure.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:24 am
@farmerman,
One of these days I had an idea on the best way possible to send "Bios" to long-distance space travel.
Don't send adult grown-up people and all the unsurmountable needed logistics, send embrios in cryostasis. If the Journey takes 400 or 4000 years then 20 years before arrival just raise them up with artificial uterus and AI tutoring.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:27 am
@farmerman,
In just 1 billion years ahead the Sun will be enough hotter to cook Earth to death. People use to think we still have 5 billion ahead...
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:33 am
@farmerman,
Elon Musk is building brain implants right now is no sci-fi. More, there is a whole industry predating around it lurking for selling the tech so the disabled can be able to walk again and other similar shizz. To the point, yes the implant Elon is building interacts with neurons and the next model wants to do more than just stimulating synapses. Sure as hell I won't buy one...
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:49 am
@farmerman,
Quote:
...all space exploration will have a long term application in extending the human species for a few billion years longer.

Why is this seen as necessary, let alone desirable? Why should a tribe of squabbling apes merit such a glorious outcome? It reeks of speciesism.
Quote:
I dont see our species just giving up and saying "see you in the next big bang"

No, because we'll succeed in making our home unlivable before we have the means to escape. Moving billions of people through space to terraform and colonize some distant rock orbiting another star seems extremely far-fetched.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Feb, 2020 10:52 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:

Mars has low gravity, no useful magnetosphere, and almost no atmo. Adapting to Mars is possible and a challenge, but is it necessary?


My guess is, Mars is signpost, a bus top not a destination. I think it will be a multigenerational "bus stop" as we ourselves learn the best ways to adapt and conquer the difficulties of better energy gen techniques in a vacuum. We will need several thousand generations just to adapt to interstellar toxic energy fields. Mars does have an atmosphere and oxygen, is a component of its CO2, Fe2O3, and SiO2.(Not to mention H2O). Even by our measly technology today , we know how to "mine O2" out of all those in a vacuum. Many small O2 reclaimers and generators for underwater aare available so Imagine where we will be in another , say, 100 years.
I dont believe much in the terrafoming stuff for Mars because we already know of earth like plants that have molten cores and , therefore, mag shields
 

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