life is pain

Partial agreement.

Pain is a big part of it. But there is more too.

I've had moments where all thoughts of pain were gone. Brief moments.

Ironically, it is rather painful to remember those brief moments of a Lost Paradise.

Even a temporary paradise can be painful, because when it is taken away (and it inevitably is), it intensifies the pain.

What I'm wondering is:

Can we all Learn from the Pain that permeates existence?

Because if we're not learning something or making progress somehow from it all, what are we doing?

Re: life is pain


On the other hand:

Do you think Paris Hilton feels Pain throughout most of her days?

(only a bit tongue-in-cheek here--seriously)

I think I'm having some sort of episode, so I would like to assert that life is pure pain and nothing can be gained from it.

See I don't know about that angle.

Lets say I was having an episode where for some unknown reason a wonderfully kind loving beautiful woman was starting to fall in love with me. I would be having an episode.

Could I then say Life = Love?

I mean, I don't know that we can take one episode and make a blanket statement about life from that one episode.
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Pain is a bit different though. Luminaries like Buddha would say All Life is Suffering. So on that level, your "Pain" statement is right in there.

But on a bit of a different level: Life is a cornucopia of many varied magnificent things. Pain being one of those things.

Care to share about the episode? Perhaps some of the wise people here would have valuable insights?

Disagree.

Ther is pain in life, but life is not pain.

You could view your life as distressful, or your life as a chance for meaning.

The choice of perspective is up to you.

Agrote, are you referring to physical or psychical pain? As you know, the Buddha observed that life is suffering. But he was not thinking of physical pain. For physical pain we take analgesics; for suffering we need something else.

There are individuals, Candice Bergen for example, who claim that they've lead charmed lives, and that they have not suffered like the way some, or most, people have.

So, I think a life of suffering isn't as universal as it may seem.

A professor of my husband and friend of mine would have enjoyed a2k, until such time as he roiled into being banned - but mostly he would have liked it.

What he did like for sure was Candace Bergen stopping her car to meet his dog, Hogo (an akita shepherd). He simply adored her, and her stopping was a great highlight.

More in a minute.

Sir,

That is another thread called Charmed. As opposed to Ennui. Which are both just pain waiting to eventually happen.

Interesting to note also that she is heavy into helping The Humane Society. Helping to alleviate pain, as it were. She's got a pain connection:

"When Fund for Animals rainmaker Cleveland Amory joined the HSUS executive suite, he brought the support of celebrities like the late screen legend Henry Fonda, singer Andy Williams, and the late Grace Kelly, Princess of Monaco.

He also brought actress Gretchen Wyler, who would later found the Ark Trust in Hollywood, best known for dispensing the "Genesis Awards," a glitzy homage to media and movie stars who promote the animal-rights gospel. In 2002, HSUS announced it was taking over the Ark Trust and renaming it the HSUS Hollywood Office.

A growing contingent of Hollywood celebrities continue to publicly endorse HSUS programs today, lending their names and likenesses to the group's fundraising and advocacy programs. The list includes Jenna Elfman, Candace Bergen, Ed Asner, and "Golden Girls" Betty White, Rue McClanahan, and Bea Arthur. (The last three also flack for PETA.) "

Harvey got pain. His wife died of breast cancer. He had three children. One caught the house afire, literally - which is why I know about the Twin Dragon restaurant, as he ate there every night while the house was in retrofit.

Not to knock the children, they were all bright and had reasons for their troubles.

This is all a tangent to the thread except perhaps that Harvey once had a show on PBS, called Ceremonies of Innocense, a show about rituals after such events. He had done that just before I met him.

That kid sounds like a real pain.

He had a "reason" to set the house on fire?

By chance was it to cure dad from ennui? On the ennui thread, someone suggested that if someone was suffering from that affliction, one cure might be to set their house on fire. I mean it sounds like there's a good chance he did the other part of the cure: read The Romantic Agony.

I cannot even now picture Harvey in ennui. Me yes, him no.

The kid was a girl. I knew the story about the fire, and that was more than thirty years ago... I remember it as stupid, but not as malicious, not the details at this point.
The girl is a middleaged woman now; I am not in touch with her; I have the feeling I could look her up or she me. She had a lot of difficulty over the years, but a lot of heart. Last I heard she's fine.


and, guessing again, from her point of view, her dad was not easy to deal with either.

Well yes it sounds like thats one sleeping dog that best to just let sleep. Probably just dredge up some more pain.

I see by my eagle eye that I swung us off on a tangent, sorry about that.

Well I think thats an interesting aspect of the topic of Pain.

I mean, is their any subject we could get off topic on, that wouldn't have a pain angle potentially invovled?

Thats what I found ironic about even when great things would happen: you knew there would be a sort of sweet pain attached even to the good things, because eventually they would be taken away or pass away. Well I guess that doesn't necessarily have to be painful.

extra medium



EM, I solemnly swear I had nothing to do with that fire. Or any other fire as well.

About "life = pain". There are different levels of pain. In a moment you can be under extreme pain and later under a medium pain. The difference between the two levels of pain is pleasure. So, as Epicurus explained, when you have no pain at all, that means you have the maximum pleasure.

There is an experience you can do, and you will see Epicurus was right:
Put your hand in boiling water for one minute. Then put the same hand in cold water: you will immediately feel an exquisite pleasure. Weeks later, when you leave the hospital, and your hand doesn't hurt anymore you have reached the maximum possible pleasure.

Surely a hand in boiling water for 60 secs would hurt for the rest of your life.Or the stump would.

spendius



Critics. Always the critics.
Well then, let's say you put your hand in boiling water for ten seconds. Is that right with you?

I didn't mean physical pain. But I don't like the word 'psychical.' I was depressed last night, put it that way - and for no particular reason. Seems like a biological thign to me.