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Volume # 60/ The Darker Side

 
 
sumac
 
Reply Mon 23 May, 2005 09:15 pm
This month gave us the 60th anniversary of VE Day in Europe: the end of a time of great distress, turbulence, hunger, deprivation, and death to humans of so many countries.

This past week we saw the introduction of the 6th (I believe) in the Star Wars series of movies, which saw "The Dark Side" take center stage.

And so, World War II and 'The Dark Side' share much in common. But not for just humans, but for all of our animal friends as well.

If we broaden the topic to include all forms of misery, from war to natural disasters, then there is quite a vast amount of things to discuss. From the possibility of a large meteor causing the extinction of the dinosaur and other life forms, to cultural differences of what may be eaten and what may not be consumed, to the ability of some species to sense impending disaster and act appropriately (the recent tsunami as but one example), the consequences of man-made disasters to species survival, the short-term consequences of man's hunger for certain life forms (eating most of the pigeons in Italy during WWII) - the list can go on and on.

This is a continuation of the rainforest thread, where we feel our sublime connection to our natural world and all life forms on it. Please join us.

We strive to do what we can to act to preserve the rainforests and botanical and animal species within all such wondrous ecological systems. To that end, we work in concert to save them.

Quoted below from a previous thread (with thanks to Stradee):

Welcome AKTIBIRDs57 to the newest rainforest thread!

Spring has finally arrived and your clicking has saved over 42 acres of rainforest! 42 ACRES!!!!!!!!!!!

We are currently the Number One team in the world among thousands of teams and over a million people participating.

Please join us and help preserve rain forest! To join, go to the Race for the Rain Forest at Care2.com. Just click on a button and somewhere in the world, you'll save a lot of square feet of rain forest, prairie, or wetlands, -- you choose! Corporate sponsors show their logos when you click, and in return, they pay for the habitat saved.

Just click: http://rainforest.care2.com/welcome?w=856730509

To register for the first time, create your own Distinct Log-in name
and Password. Then each time you visit the site to click you simply
Log-in and click on the Rainforest button. It's that simple. The
site is FREE. If you have a question, we have plenty of answers. FREE.

After clicking, feel free to post on this thread. We have the most
wonderful and helpful group of people clicking here. Any time you can't
click, we can arrange for a substitute to click for you.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 May, 2005 11:06 pm
sumac, thanks for the new thread!

With the end WW2 came the rebuilding of countries that suffered devastation. Found a website with architectural before and after photos of small towns in Germany.

Dresden, Germany - 60 yrs ago -
Dresden's baroque Frauenkirche Lutheran church shows why the German city was once called the Florence of the North.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40820000/jpg/_40820901_frau-afp-300x220.jpg

Series of Photos
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/4259313.stm

A visit to Normandy - 60 yrs and beyond
http://www.pbase.com/rhssr/normandy60
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danon5
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 08:08 am
Yea!! Thanks for the new thread sumac.

Nice intro.

All clicked.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 09:40 am
g'day all ~

sumac, terrific intro! Good job!

all clicked
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 09:49 am
What group of individuals has preserved more wildlife habitat in the U.S. than any other?

I'll keep this up until you choke on the truth.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 10:00 am
my throats clear, nn.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 10:04 am
Sportsmen and women pay over $4M each day for conservation through license revenues, excise taxes, special taxes and stamps. They provide more than 75% of the annual income of the 50 state conservation agencies.

That's hunters and fisherman.

Know the truth. Know your facts.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 10:13 am
Stradee wrote:
Found a website with architectural before and after photos of small towns in Germany.


Could you please give that link as well :wink:
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 10:50 am
Thanks for the new thread, sumac.

I'll send the link to the team tonight if I can.
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Stradee
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 11:00 am
Walter, the Dresdon Link ~

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/4259313.stm
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 11:12 am
Got that (I just thought, because you spoke of smaller towns, you'd found a different one. [Dresden had a population of 600,000 plus a couple of hundredthousands of refugees :wink: ].)
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 12:14 pm
My off the top of the head guess would have been that native Americans probably preserved more wildlife and habitat than any other group.

Take the buffalo, for instance. It was never 'harvested' other than for need, and then ALL parts were used; food, hide, clothing, ceremonial attire, sinew for sewing, footwear, etc.

Unlike "sportsmen" who shot them from moving trains, leaving the dead and dying to rot in the prairie grasses.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 12:27 pm
That's your problem sumac. You're living in the wrong century.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 01:09 pm
Not entirely true. I still believe that native Americans have greater respect for all animal forms than any other group in the US - in this century as well. We just deprived them of the best habitats to live and hunt in.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 01:26 pm
Actually, I'll agree with you on that, to a point. They still hunt quite effectively, just for tourist dollars and retirees social security paychecks these days. Wink

A couple years ago I was in Michigan in fall, and the salmon were running. The rules for fisherman are this. You have to hook the salmon in the mouth with a single pointed hook, and the fish has to be within size limits. That and a fishing license. This makes it next to impossible to legally catch one of them as they aren't hungry, so people wait for the fish to accidentally get the hook in its mouth then yank. Typically, they snag another fish in the side, which they have to throw back.

Unless your a native American. While I was watching this spectacle, a truck pulled up and a guy got out. Short hair, glasses, slightly dark complexion. He puts a line in the water, snags a salmon, reels it in, and promptly throws it over his shoulder to die slowly in the dirt patch behind him. His kids beat on it with sticks and rocks. Right in front of a DNR officer, who ignored it. This process repeated until he had several fish flopping around in the dirt. No one said a word.
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sumac
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 02:11 pm
That certainly was a depressing, on the darker side, image.

Just ran across a book, "Been Brown So Long, Looked Green to Me", with the following editorial review:

"From the co-founder of CounterPunch, "America_s best political newsletter" (Out of Bounds Magazine) comes a comprehensive seven-part reader on environmental politics. Covering everything from toxics to electric power plays, St. Clair gives you a shocking view of how money and power determine the state of our environment.

St. Clair names the culprits and exposes the deeds. The book opens with Oregon as a metaphor for the nation. Now becoming "Californicated," Oregon_s mythological beauty is transforming into just that: more myth every day.

In Been Brown So Long, It Looked Like Green to Me you_ll meet:

Bill Clinton, "saving" Yellowstone National Park from the miners. This turned out to be a thinly disguised a payoff of Noranda who was given leases on other federal lands.
Not to be outdone is Chainsaw George. Bush II is out to stop forest fires by stopping forests.
But St. Clair also profiles the heroes like David Chain who gave his life fighting for the forest, and founder of Friends of the Earth David Brower railing against the -increasing conformity of the environmental movement.


From the struggle over the lobo wolf in New Mexico to the fight to save the Grizzly (in Idaho), from the shooting of wild Bison in Montana to how the Sierra Club provided the cover for a federal program that shoveled federal lands into the hands of private investors, St. Clair gives a well-rounded account of where the environment stands -today_and what to do about it.

Praise for Jeffrey St. Clair_s White Out: The CIA, Drugs and the Press:

"A history of hypocrisy and political interference the like of which only Frederick Forsyth in a dangerous caffeine frenzy could make up."_The Guardian



About the Author
Jeffrey St. Clair founded Counterpunch with Alexander Cockburn, and is the co-author of White Out: The CIA, Drugs and the Press, Al Gore: A Users Manual, and Powers of Babylon"

Anyone ever heard of it?
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 03:34 pm
pssst

Sumac's been good enough to start Rainforest Wander # 60.

Can someone call dibs on asking TPTB to make this a featured thread in Wilderness, Wildlife and Ecology, and de-listing #58 and 59 as featured?
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 04:08 pm
You and your 283 friends have supported 1,858,273.4 square feet!

Marine Wetlands habitat supported: 40,331.7 square feet.
You have supported: (0.0)
Your 283 friends have supported: (40,331.7)

American Prairie habitat supported: 35,179.8 square feet.
You have supported: (9,925.6)
Your 283 friends have supported: (25,254.2)

Rainforest habitat supported: 1,782,761.9 square feet.
You have supported: (160,793.5)
Your 283 friends have supported: (1,621,968.5)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

1 Aktbird57 .. 1109 42.656 acres

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

so whadda ya think - will we actually make it to 43 acres this time?
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 06:38 pm
checking in
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Aa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 May, 2005 07:14 pm
sumac, thanks for this thread and for placing focus on the darker side that we need to acknowledge.

It surprised me once when I read, perhaps in Smithsonian Magazine, that a historic ecological situation runs contrary to the usual image of Native Americans.

The statement was that there were a number of species which went extinct because of Native American hunting, long before settlers started arriving in North America.

(I wish I had kept the citation information, but it is no longer available to me.)
0 Replies
 
 

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