You're All Going to Hell!

I choose Hale's Ale Amber over Millcrap or Budpuker or Coronatagoodun' beer any day.

So I take it no one believes in hell.

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I believe Hell to mean the absence of life, the cessation of being.

It is not hard for me to believe that after judgement those not chosen for heaven will simply die one last final time, cease to exist in God's presence, but this eternal fire thing is just not believable. Neither an impersonal God OR a loving God would do that. What would be the point?

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blueveinedthrobber wrote:

I believe Hell to mean the absence of life, the cessation of being.

It is not hard for me to believe that after judgement those not chosen for heaven will simply die one last final time, cease to exist in God's presence, but this eternal fire thing is just not believable. Neither an impersonal God OR a loving God would do that. What would be the point?

Adam and Eve were told the punishment for disobedience would be death. If they had not sinned, they would still be here, would they not? Solomon agrees with you that death is the absence of life. "For there is an eventuality as respects the sons of mankind and an eventuality as respects the beast, and they have the same eventuality. As the one dies, so the other dies. (Ecc 3:19)

But don't expect to go to heaven. "The meek shall inherit the earth", remember?

As for the few selected to go to heaven ". . . you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth." (Rev 5:6)

And Hell? It's a myth perpetrated by power hungry religious leaders to maintain control over the masses.

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Beware of them meeks! I'm sure they are concocting plans how to take over the Earth as we speak!

i agree that hell is the absence of existence. frightening thought, way more frightening than devils and flames and all that.

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fredjones wrote:

I choose Hale's Ale Amber over Millcrap or Budpuker or Coronatagoodun' beer any day.

So I take it no one believes in hell.

Since you're from Seattle, how about this?

http://www.cascadebrewersguild.org/images/mj_aa.jpg

Who would prefer heaven over that?

PS The Romulan Correctional Facility is in Edmonds, WA. And there's no such thing as hell.

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I just want to be a fly on the wall on judgement day. I mean there's going to be some embarrassing moments for everyone.

How would you like to be the guy who , when he was 12 ,put his sisters dirty panties over his head and jerked off and get called on it in front of everyone? Laughing

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blueveinedthrobber wrote:

I just want to be a fly on the wall on judgement day. I mean there's going to be some embarrassing moments for everyone.

How would you like to be the guy who , when he was 12 ,put his sisters dirty panties over his head and jerked off and get called on it in front of everyone?

Just how did you know about that, blue? Laughing

But, seriously, why would there be a need to rake over our old sins? I submit that the judgement has to do with ones deeds AFTER learning the truth about God.

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neologist wrote:

fredjones wrote:
I choose Hale's Ale Amber over Millcrap or Budpuker or Coronatagoodun' beer any day.

So I take it no one believes in hell.
Since you're from Seattle, how about this?
Who would prefer heaven over that?

PS The Romulan Correctional Facility is in Edmonds, WA. And there's no such thing as hell.

Mac and Jacks is another staple of mine. Smile

As far as hell, I wonder sometimes if the reason I don't believe in hell is because I'm going there someday. I am agnostic, therefore I don't accept any god. So I'm pretty much assured that any hell there might be, I am going. But even when I did believe in a god, I still didn't believe in hell. It has always seemed to be a silly notion to me. I wonder if we took a poll of Americans, what percentage would agree with the notion of a hell (Judeo-Christian or otherwise)?

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Fred, it seems that about 73% of Americans believe in hell. I'm not one of them.

Religious beliefs of Americans

It's amazing what utter nonsense people will believe, such as "there exists a God who consigns souls to eternal torture for not believing that he became mortal and had himself killed so that he could save us from being thrown into hell by God himself for the sin of having the inherently sinful souls that he gave us."

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Terry wrote:

Fred, it seems that about 73% of Americans believe in hell. I'm not one of them.

Religious beliefs of Americans

It's amazing what utter nonsense people will believe, such as "there exists a God who consigns souls to eternal torture for not believing that he became mortal and had himself killed so that he could save us from being thrown into hell by God himself for the sin of having the inherently sinful souls that he gave us."

The idea of a burning hell is just another example of the insidious lies perpetrated on mankind by power hungry religious leaders. But Terry, I strongly disagree with your use of the word inherently. Adam and Eve were created with perfect consciences preventing them from sin. When they disobeyed the only command given them by God, they not only lost their right to life, they lost their perfect consciences as well. No longer perfect, they passed imperfection down to their offspring.

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Neologist, if Adam and Eve had perfect consciousnesses, they would not have sinned. God is said to be omniscient and therefore must have known that the flawed consciousnesses he gave them would react exactly as they did when confronted by the serpent. How could they be blamed for an action they took before they supposedly had any concept of good, evil, or sin?

How did they modify their own genomes to produce an inheritable imperfection? And if they did, why didn't God correct the flaw so that each generation would have the same opportunity to choose for themselves?

Why would anyone take an ancient Jewish creation myth literally, anyway? God did not actually make a man out of clay and breathe life into him, or make a woman out of a rib. There were never any talking snakes that were smarter than human beings. God did not drown his mistakes in a world-wide flood or confuse languages to keep people from building towers. Genesis is stories, not history.

Hell is here on earth, for those of us who have to put up with the fanatics who create it.

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God told Adam, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."

The serpent told Eve, "You will not surely die, for God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

They ate, their eyes were opened, and they did not die. According to Genesis, Adam lived for over 900 years after being banished from Eden.

The serpent told them the truth. If you do not believe that, tell me in what way he deceived them. Why do you suppose that God lied to them? Why would God want them to remain naked and ignorant of morality forever? Where did the serpent get its knowledge? Do you think that God forbade it to eat the fruit but it disobeyed as well?

Do you really believe in talking snakes, magical fruit, and God imposing the death penalty for choosing knowledge over ignorance, or might the Bible contain some colorful myths?

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Adam and Eve had free will and only one rule to follow. The significance of that rule lies in God's right to set standards for his creation. And yes, they did die. The sentence of death was pronounced on that very same day and they died in the very same creative day in which they sinned.

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If you seriously contend that "Adam & Eve" ever existed, than you have lost any respect i might have accorded your expression of your opinion at the outset. Do you really buy that claptrap? Do you really expect others (apart from the religiously deluded) to take such statements seriously?

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i have atheory but it only works if hell is not seen as eternal punishment.

(keep in mind this is from a muslim perspective)

i think it is that God wants us to behave in a certain way-

in accordance with the Quran. but if we do not we will go to hell

the length of our punishmwnt is proportional to the extent that we deviated from this 'way' (ie the Quran).

not all muslims follow the quran to the line.

and there are many non-muslims who follow Quranic rulings

(such as belief in one God and afterlife)

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If Adam and Eve never existed, then the Bible is obviously not God's inspired word. Hence, there is no hell. If the bible is God's word, a careful reading will reveal that there is no hell. So, as far as this thread is concerned, I'm right on target.

http://web4.ehost-services.com/el2ton1/worthy.gif

I'm sorry to have lost your respect. I'll look around in my basement to see if I can find it.

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Don't be in a hurry about it, Neo, i didn't need it for anything today.

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Setanta wrote:

Don't be in a hurry about it, Neo, i didn't need it for anything today.

I swear it just ran out into the yard!

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As far as original sin goes... Why am I held responsible for something my ancestors did? How does god know that I wouldn't have obeyed his command like they couldn't? If I am responsible for something that Adam and Eve did because I am their offspring, then god, as their father, is equally responsible. The idea that I am guilty by default is about as unjust as it gets.

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fredjones wrote:

As far as original sin goes... Why am I held responsible for something my ancestors did? How does god know that I wouldn't have obeyed his command like they couldn't? If I am responsible for something that Adam and Eve did because I am their offspring, then god, as their father, is equally responsible. The idea that I am guilty by default is about as unjust as it gets.

You are not responsible for Adam and Eve's sin. But we are all subject to their legacy. There is no hope or redemption for them. There is, however for you and me. (John 3:16, 17:3)

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You're All Going to Hell!

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