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NAME CHANGE FOR BOYS WITH NEW MARRIAGE

 
 
Ladicha
 
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 11:21 am
Hello i am new here and i thank you all for reading.


Well i guess this would be more of a question for the men that have children and whos ex wife or partner wishes or wished to change their childs name. Or if you are a person that can relate to this and your oppion about the matter. Just oppions please i really mean no harm by it.

Well i was married and now divorced, but about to remarry to a wonderful man and we will be having our first child together in June and the child will have his last name and i will soon have it also so my fiance said he would be honard if my two sons could carry his last name as well. NOt change their last name permanately but just hypenate his at the end that way sense they are both young two and four they would feel more apart of the whole family but not taking away their fathers name because he is the father and they can tell people that they have two special men in their life and if they dont want to continue uses the name when they get older they can drop it without having to go through legal mess, unless i am wrong, please tell me if there is legal involved with just hyphanating a name. But i talked to their father about it and he says NO NEVER! He says that is his name and he doesnt want another mans name on HIS KIDS name because they are his flesh and blood and he will fight it if he has to. His mother also feels the same and she is going to tell the kids if they were to say my name is Smith and Wright then she will tell them that their name is only Smith and the father says he will do the same causing confusion and i dont want that I can handle the mother as far as she seeing them as much and confusing the kids then she will want to fight about that because i let her keep them for two and three days and the father may have them when they are at her house for about six hrs but thats it no overnight stays or day visits not even calls, just when she has them he sees them for that amount of time. He works and puts his job first so dont take the time to spend with them but i see a mess already because i have talked to them and they seem ready to put up a fight. Buy the way no the father doesnt give me child support or any money for the boys and now child support is about to kick in and he wants to pay less than normal which would be 30% he wants to give me $100 a month for two boys thats it. So here it is peoples let me know what you all think. Sorry so long.
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Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 12:29 pm
You have several different issues here--and each of them must be considered individually.

Under the circumstances, I think your sons should keep their father's name unless their father gives up all parental rights and their stepfather adopts them. Having two names in one family is not uncommon these days. As far as I know you do not have the right to change or hyphenate your sons' name without their father's consent. Talk to a lawyer.

Child support is a separate question. The amount of money is mandated by the court. Possibily the amount could be reduced if your ex-husband could prove that he is paying all expenses for his sons when they are at his mother's house.

I am not a lawyer and this is a question for a lawyer.

Good luck.
0 Replies
 
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 12:36 pm
I can understand how the dad may feel. Perhaps he feels this is a way of shutting him out and that your future husband will be taking over his spot. No matter whether he is a low life or not he is still the boys’ dad. I think if you were to fight this it would hurt the boys more than anyone else. In this situation, I think you need to think of the boys’ feelings before anything else.

Perhaps a compromise may work here. Maybe having your future husband’s last name as a middle name.
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Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 12:58 pm
The children already have a last name.

You are concerned about the quality of time that the children spend with their father, yet you are doing everything in your power to nudge their real father out of your children's lives inch by inch.

He feels threatened, and rightly so.

You want your children to call their future stepfather, "daddy," and you want them to use their stepfather's last name.

I believe the real father, your soon to be ex-husband, has the right to the exclusive honor of having his children call him "daddy" and has the right to the exclusive honor of having his children carry his name.

The security and happiness of your future family unit (which will include your new husband and new baby) does not hinge on what your children call your new husband or what last name they will bear . . . it will hinge on how all of you treat each other.
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chispita73
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 01:29 pm
Noddy24 wrote:
Under the circumstances, I think your sons should keep their father's name unless their father gives up all parental rights and their stepfather adopts them.


Your children are too young to understand why their names would be changing. Keep them involved as much as possible, if your husband to be treats them as his own they will grow to love and respect him and maybe even take his name.

I disagree with Debra, no one has "exclusive" anything over anyone. Let them grow up and make that decision on their own. They will find out in time that it takes more than a "daddy" to be a real "father".

Good luck... You are not alone! :wink:
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Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 01:52 pm
When Mom and Dad were married, they made choices. They made choices to be parents to two children whom were born as issue of the marriage. They chose to give the children their father's surname.

Now, Mom and Dad are getting a divorce. Dad is not divorcing his children. Dad remains their father and he has a right to maintain a meaningful relationship with his children.

The fact that Mom is going to be remarried does not change things. Why does Mom insist that her children call her fiance "daddy" and to carry her fiance's surname except to nudge DAD out of the children's lives and replace DAD with someone new?

Dad is struggling to maintain his parental role in his children's lives. He doesn't want to be replaced. I think his request that the children call him "daddy" exclusively and retain his surname are reasonable requests that he is entitled to make. It's part and parcel of the bond between parent and child. Except in cases of abandonment, I don't think that father/child bond should be weakened or diluted or tampered with through the mother's efforts.

Encouraging the children to call another man, "daddy," and giving the children a another man's name is parental alienation on the mother's part . . . perhaps the alienation is subtle in its form . . . but it is devastating in its effects.
0 Replies
 
Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 02:22 pm
remarriage
Read this article:

REMARRIAGE AS A TRIGGER OF PARENTAL ALIENATION SYNDROME

Excerpt:

Quote:
Parents who remarry often believe that they now have the perfect family setting in which to raise their children. But one thing mars this image: the former spouse. Many remarried couples harbor the fantasy, "If only the ex would disappear from the scene . . . " One way to fulfill this fantasy is by driving a wedge between the children and their other parent.

A parent is most likely to regard the other parent as dispensable when her child was very young at the time of the divorce, or the parents were never married, and the new marriage occurs soon after. In these cases, each parent has had little opportunity to observe the child around the other parent. A mother may believe, in the abstract, that children deserve to know their real father. But if she has not lived very long together with the father and child, she has not experienced first hand, how her child benefits from spending time with the man. Certainly a 1-year-old child cannot tell her how much he looks forward to seeing his dad.

Without a history of family interaction involving mother, father, and child, it is harder for the mother to appreciate the father's role in the child's life. When she remarries, she would rather such family history be centered around her and her current husband. The father is seen as an interloper. His involvement complicates the picture. Essentially, the mother would like to pretend that her relationship with the child's father never happened. When he won't bow out gracefully, he is seen as thwarting her second chance for a happy family. One remarried woman told her exhusband, "My daughter has a mother and a father in her home. She doesn't need you."

Some people believe that the less time the child has been with the father, the less that is lost if the stepfather replaces the father. To a certain extent this is correct. Generally speaking, younger children find it easier than do older children to become attached to, and develop a relationship with, a stepparent that approximates a parent-child bond, and to benefit from a competent stepparent's involvement (Bowerman & Irish, 1962; ; Duberman, 1973; Hetherington, Stanley-Hagan, & Anderson, 1989; Lutz, 1983; Ransom, Schlesinger, & Dercleyn, 1979). However, there is no reason why children should have to choose. They are capable of having strong ties to their father and stepfather.

Even when her child is so young that the stepfather could adequately replace the father, a mother still has reasons to promote the father's involvement. When the child is older, he or she may want to know the father. Many children suffer intense feelings of rejection when a divorced parent has not remained involved. Boys and girls who have lost contact with a parent following divorce are more likely to have problems with interpersonal relationships and lower self-esteem (Biller, 1993; Hetherington, 1972). The children's problems may, in turn, diminish the quality of their relationships with custodial parents and stepparents.

It is worth considering, too, what would happen if the mother's second marriage failed (not an unlikely event since second marriages have a higher divorce rate than first marriages). In most such cases children lose all contact with their former stepfather even when he has been a central figure in their development (Brody, Neubaum, & Forehand, 1988). Maintaining a close tie to the father is good insurance against such a loss. Much less likely, but also possible, is the death or incapacitation of the mother. In these cases, custody is usually transferred to the father. A good strong relationship with their father can help children through such hard times. A history of alienation from the father would compound the tragedy.

A parent who has simply not considered some of the issues discussed above may benefit from an educational intervention, it is essential to involve the new partner because he or she is likely to exert much influence over the ultimate decision regarding the child's contact with the other parent.

When the effort to remove the other parent from the child's life reflects the wish to deny the reality of the relationship that produced the child, the alienating parent must be helped to appreciate that this denial may satisfy the parent's short-term desires, but will sacrifice the child's interests and, therefore, the parent's long-term interest in raising a healthy child. Furthermore, denying the former relationship handicaps the new marital relationship. The new marriage will stand on a much firmer foundation if the spouses face, rather than avoid, the existence of the former partner. Therapists should attempt to facilitate communication between spouses of unspoken thoughts and feelings regarding the former partner. This can result in a general reduction of anxiety and may reduce the need to eliminate the other parent from the child's life.

If the remarried parent is genuinely worried about the impact on the child of maintaining a relationship with the other parent, these anxieties should be explored with all the adults involved. Each party should think of things that they can do, and that the others can do, to ease the anxieties. For example, a father may provide some indication to the mother of his value to their child, if he describes some of the activities and routines that father and child share. The goal is to help the mother see the reality of the relationship. This gives her a concrete experience of what she would be destroying if she succeeded in alienating the child from the father.
0 Replies
 
chispita73
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Mar, 2005 03:32 pm
Debra_Law wrote:

Dad is struggling to maintain his parental role in his children's lives. He doesn't want to be replaced. I think his request that the children call him "daddy" exclusively and retain his surname are reasonable requests that he is entitled to make.


Agreed, Mom should not force or tell the children to call her new husband "daddy". I'm a firm believer that the new parent has to earn the childrens love, trust, respect and then the honor of them calling him "daddy". Children no matter what age should not be pushed, asked to or manipulated into calling the new step-parent either mommy or daddy.

Lind- how would you feel if the roles were reversed?
Sounds like your ex is a little insecure of where he stands in the childrens lives. Keep the childrens feelings and well being in mind at all times. Put yourself in the other parents place and when making decisions "for the children" don't do it out of spite.
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Ladicha
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Mar, 2005 12:07 pm
RESPOND
Debra, I dont know why you have so much anger towards the topic but you are totally out of line when it comes down to the decisions that i have made about my kids calling my new daddy. Also that is another topic that i addressed to you and others on a different page so you should stick to the topic. As far as me trying to ease the father out of their lives you are making your own judgement on the subject and i didnt ask you for your two sense and you can keep it to yourself making me sound like i would make my children call him daddy like you know me. I stated in the other message that the children feel confortable calling him their other father and daddy is not used frequently, but if that makes them happy then i will not stop them from using it, Also i stated that i want their father to be as close to them as possible but you are so cought up in your own thoughts about the whole daddy thing you felled to read closely that he has the oppertunity to have as much time with them as he wants and i have never once pushed him away or kept him from seeing them. Yes he might feel threatened thats because he has a lot of pride but when it is coming down to the boys he has to relize that this man is in their life now and will be their step father and will do for them so he will have to just be the daddy beyond just the word Daddy because making a baby dont make you a daddy. YOu keep taking about what i want and how i want them to do this Daddy and Name think well the name will be a decision that the adults (me and the father) makes and I am not going to force it upon the children because they are young and dont know but does understand that their dads name is still their and when they get older they dont have to keep it if they dont want to. As far as the future unit being THE NEW BABY AND THE NEW is not the hing it includes the whole family my boys two and if you dont like that then tuff because i dont seperate my boys from this man and new baby because they dont have the same blood, but you know what they have the same mother and now anther man that loves them just as if they were his own, then you say its how we treat eachother is what matters, well again if you was reading instead of lashing out at me then you would read that there is alot of love in this house and the only one not showing love or some kind of understanding for both sides is you and if you cant say anything nicely unjudginly then you shouldnt respond at all. Keep you personal problems to whatever i write to yourself.
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Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Mar, 2005 09:05 pm
Ladicha--

In your first post on your other thread you announced:

Quote:
Hello everyone I am new here and I have been reading some of your post and you all are very nice and upfront about your advice and i like that.


You asked for opinions. Debra gave you one--and Debra being Debra gave you an opinion with footnotes.

You respond:

Quote:
Debra, I dont know why you have so much anger towards the topic but you are totally out of line when it comes down to the decisions that i have made about my kids calling my new daddy


Does this translate, "I want your opinion if your opinion bolsters my own"?


On your part I'm sensing a bit of the Virgin Mary syndrome. Perhaps your kids were not planned. Perhaps their father talked about abortion. All the same, he is their father.

Whoops!? You picked a stud who is just developing paternal instincts? You think this new stud is going to be a Delightful Daddy? I hope so.

The role of the step parent can be harder than the role of the parent, particularly when one or the other of the natural parents wants to shut the other one out of the kids' lives.

The thrust of Debra's argument was that your kids need both parents. You reacted as though you were the only parent with rights.

Your soon-to-be-ex might not be Prime Parent Material--but you picked him. Together you created the kids. Married or divorced, you have to raise those kids together--and this means that as the kids' father he gets a vote on what is important to him.

When you ask strangers for unbiased advice, you're likely to get unbiased advice--which may or may not be what you want to hear.
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Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Mar, 2005 02:08 pm
Re: NAME CHANGE FOR BOYS WITH NEW MARRIAGE
Hi Ladicha:

I'm not being mean or disrespectful by discussing both of your posts in the this thread. I understand that you just joined this forum and made two posts on March 15. One post was placed in the relationships forum and a second post was placed in the parenting forum. Both posts, however, concern the same subject matter and the following information can be gleaned from your posts:

You have two children from your marriage. You have a 2-year-old boy and a 4-year-old boy. You are going through a "long divorce." However, while you were still married to your husband, you met another man and fell in love. You are now several months pregnant by your new lover / fiance. Your new baby is due to be born in June. You and your fiance plan to get married someday, probably after your long divorce has been finalized.

Since your separation from your husband, the children spend three days every week at their paternal grandmother's house where they continue to bond and have a relationship with their father and their father's extended family. Your husband continues to work at his job during those three days of visitation each week. You and your new man feel very strongly that your husband (the children's father) ought to be taking time off from his job to spend more time with the children during scheduled visitation. Nevertheless, you acknowledge that the children love their father "to death."

Here are your topics:

My ex and My new

Your husband wishes you well in your new relationship, but he doesn't want his sons calling your new husband, "daddy." You don't understand your husband's objections. You believe it is in the children's best interest to call this new wonderful man in their life, "daddy," if that's the way that they want to address them. However, your husband has told the children that he is their daddy and that he would prefer things if the children called their future stepfather something else.

NAME CHANGE FOR BOYS WITH NEW MARRIAGE

You want to give the children your new husband's last name. You want to hyphenate the children's existing last name with their future step-father's name so that the children will feel like part of the family. Your husband does not agree that the children should use their future step-father's last name. The paternal grandmother also strongly objects to changing her grandchildren's last name.

You, however, think changing the names is justified because the children spend far more time with you than they do with their father. You noted that child support is still an issue of contention in the divorce matter and that your husband doesn't want to pay as much as the law requires.


CERTAINLY, a lot has happened in your life during the last five years. You were married; you had two children with your husband; you found someone new and fell in love; you separated from your husband; you became pregnant with your third child; you're going through a divorce; you are planning to marry your new man.

I guess this demonstrates that lots of things in one's life can change in a short period of time. Just as your first marriage failed, it's possible that your second marriage could fail. There are no guarantees in life. But the one thing will remain constant and stable in these children's lives is their loving relationships with their mother and their father.

And, you are so wrapped up in the romance and and vision of happiness in your future life with your future husband, baby and two boys . . . and so wrapped up in your strong feelings that your soon-to-be ex-husband is not worthy (he isn't spending enough time with the two boys; he isn't paying support) . . . that you fail to look at the total picture.

Your boys don't need to call your future husband "daddy" or carry their future stepfather's last name to feel like a part of your new life. They already have a daddy who loves them very much and who would be hurt if they called another man "daddy" or took another man's last name. Your children can love their stepfather . . . your soon-to-be ex-husband is not undermining your relationship . . . he wishes you well. He would just like his wishes on these two matters to be respected.

It doesn't undermine the happiness of your future family unit in any way to allow your children's father to retain the title of "daddy" and to have his sons continue to carry his last name. After all, he will always be their father. The children have a right to have a meaningful relationship with their father. Their father has a right to a meaningful relationship with his children. Neither the divorce nor your remarriage will ever change that fact.

If you do not respect the father's wishes on these matters, you are engaging in parental alienation. It's your subtle way of nudging him out of your children's lives and replacing him with your future husband. I gave you a link to an article concerning the triggering of parental alienation upon remarriage. I hope you read it objectively and consider your motives in making decisions that go against the reasonable wishes of the children's father.

But, I am not the villian for pointing these things out to you. These are things you need to consider before you encourage your children to call your fiance "daddy" and before you change their last names to your future husband's last name. I don't think you're truly considering the best interests of the children with respect to their LONG-TERM relationship with their father.

Best wishes.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Mar, 2005 06:50 pm
Very well put, Debra.

Ladicha, I responded to your other post about not knowing what will happen in the future. I didn't respond here because I would have been saying the same thing. I agree with Debra. As much as you hope your crystal ball is clear regarding your future with your fiance, you never really know what the future holds. Encouraging your boys to consider your fiance their father, in more than one way, when their biological father wants to maintain a healthy relationship with his sons is a disservice to your sons and their father.

Your sons are lucky to have a good relationship with their grandmother. You are wise to not want to destroy that relationship. There are all kinds of blended families these days. Your sons will be fine with having a different last name than you as long as they have a good relationship with their father.
0 Replies
 
Ladicha
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Mar, 2005 09:28 am
RESPOND
Hello everyone, to Noddy24, I got your post and and no i am not trying to say that you or anyone cant give an oppion unless its something i like, no not at all, its just when its said that i am doing something that i know i am not, for example: telling my kids to call my new daddy, and i said they choose to call him that every now and then, but i am considering how they would feel if i said NO dont do that he is not your DAD and the baby will soon call him daddy and they MIGHT want to call him daddy, but its ok if they dont. Another example: That i am trying to take the real father out of their lives, Never would i do such a thing, he choses to see them when he does and we dont talk about it anymore because he doesnt want to talk to i dont nag him about it i feel that maybe one day it would change and he make his own decisions when coming down to the boys no matter what i might say. We havent been able to commicate for a long time and i dont think hes ready just yet but when he is i am there to listion and compromise. What i dont understand how i came off as I FEEL LIKE I AM THE ONLY one with rights, I dont feel that way at all because if i did i would have never asked the father would he alow this or what he felt about it. I want to be open with him and i have about everything including my own relationship I am not going to just go ahead and do it despite of what he feels or what he says but this is just the beginning to and end and i wanted to see what others would think, regaurdless if they agree with me or not i just want everyone to know that i am not against the father at all it would just take time for the both of us to see eye to eye.

Debra, well said i know your not the villian i just wanted to be very clear about what i stated and i see you did understand its just how you keep saying that I AM INCOURAGING the boys to call him daddy and changing their name and i am not thinking in the best interest of the children with the respect to the long term with the father. I do consider the children and thats why i would not take this into court and battle or something so complicating and difficult for the adults decide if we cant come to agreement looking at all the options of what affects it could cause then nothing will change but i will never know if i cant or dont view all the options and the father will be right there with me to get these view points as well. Thanks for your repond, no hard feelings here.

JB, you are right as well, I dont know what the future holds and with my first marriage was going last. I thought I knew him over a period six yrs, I thought i knew alot of things then, but I relize that you dont know and you only can pray for the best and take it a day at a time. THat i am doing taking it a day at a time and i will not stand in fear of if this future marriage will not work or if i will ever really know him or if live will bring me happyness, i can only think that my children are my world and my life and if those things go the opposite way i have my children to care for and they are number one in my life nomatter if i have happyness with a man or not God will feel that void and my children will forfill that happyness that i need. Thanks for your respond.
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