Where is the US economy headed?

@hawkeye10,

Loaning money to someone that has collateral is massive wealth redistribution? Who is the wealth being distributed to? You are arguing the exact opposite of the OWS people.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

It might but only if the poverty is extreme. Attitudes, education, habits of thought and lineage are not altered much by being hard up.

I've met middle class tramps.

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@parados,

parados wrote:

Loaning money to someone that has capital is massive wealth redistribution? Who is the wealth being distributed to? You are arguing the exact opposite of the OWS people.

As I explained to you already we have massively redistributed wealth from the savers to the debtors. Those who have savings get almost nothing in interest from it because of the Fed, and those who are in Debt (so long as they are the right someones) are lent money by the Fed for free when they should be paying a tidy sum for it.

We claim that America tuns on the capitalistic system, but it is mostly a sham assertion. Our Government ( and **** the assertions that the Fed is not the government) picks winners and losers, it does not believe in capitalism enough to let capitalism decide the winners and the losers, for the most part. This is what happens when a formerly democratic and capitalistic nation allows the government to become corrupted by the corporate class.

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@spendius,

spendius wrote:

It might but only if the poverty is extreme. Attitudes, education, habits of thought and lineage are not altered much by being hard up.

For shorts amount of time...the newly poor are never going to claw their way back into the middle class. Their kids are not likely to be able to do so either, the Attitudes, education, habits of their former class will not last for long.

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The Republican sponsored Balanced Budget Amendment to the Constitution failed in the House 261 (for) vs 165 (against). That is not as close as I thought it might be. A 2/3rd margin was the bar that needed to be cleared.

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

spendius wrote:

It might but only if the poverty is extreme. Attitudes, education, habits of thought and lineage are not altered much by being hard up.

For shorts amount of time...the newly poor are never going to claw their way back into the middle class. Their kids are not likely to be able to do so either, the Attitudes, education, habits of their former class will not last for long.

A gross and wildly inaccurate overstatement. In the first place you have no basis for such a prediction. In the second, history confirms that social/economic mobility here is very great and there is lots of movement (both up and down) over single generations.

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@georgeob1,

Quote:

The most comprehensive comparative study, done last year by the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, found that “upward mobility from the bottom” — Daniels’s definition — was significantly lower in the United States than in most major European countries, including Germany, Sweden, the Netherlands and Denmark. Another study, by the Institute for the Study of Labor in Germany in 2006, uses other metrics and concludes that “the U.S. appears to be exceptional in having less rather than more upward mobility.”

from "The Downward Path of Upward Mobility" by Fareed Zakaria
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-downward-path-of-upward-mobility/2011/11/09/gIQAegpS6M_story.html

the links of interest:
http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/2/7/45002641.pdf

http://ftp.iza.org/dp1938.pdf

I don't quite know if you are aware of how your statement contradicts objective reality in today's America, or simply don't care, regardless, you are incorrect.

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@kuvasz,

Yes --but upward mobility is not an important class signifier compared to lineage, education and settled habits of thought. And it was class that was being discussed.

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@georgeob1,

Quote:

history confirms that social/economic mobility here is very great and there is lots of movement (both up and down) over single generations.

There is a lot of mobility as the middle class get erased...the problem is that most of it is downward. Still my argument does not depend upon how many are currently changing class but you should be aware that your belief that America is the land of upwards mobility potential is out of date. You sir have not kept up on current events, you are showing your age here.

from kuvasz's link

Quote:

In fact, over the past decade, growing evidence shows pretty conclusively that social mobility has stalled in this country. Last week, Time magazine’s cover asked, “Can You Still Move Up in America?” The answer, citing a series of academic studies was, no; not as much as you could in the past and — most devastatingly — not as much as you can in Europe.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-downward-path-of-upward-mobility/2011/11/09/gIQAegpS6M_story.html

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@kuvasz,

The objective reality of the comment which you so superficially criticized was that economic mobility here is "very great" and more than sufficient to prevent ALL of those falling out of the middle class as a result of the current economic downturn from EVER recovering their former status as was absurdly alleged.

That there has been more downward than upward movement of late is merely the obvious effect of the economic downturn. The trend is likely to be as cyclic as the rest of the economy.

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@georgeob1,

Class is not affected by economic downturns George unless the poverty becomes extreme enough to engage the body.

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Weapons of mass financial destruction?

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@spendius,

spendius wrote:

Class is not affected by economic downturns George unless the poverty becomes extreme enough to engage the body.

That may be true in the UK, ( where as my Father used to say, "the slaves still love their chains"). Not so much here.

The Christmas season is almost upon us. Happy Christmas Spendi .. to you and all the Brits here.

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@reasoning logic,

I quite like Max Keiser, but you need to realise he has his own agenda. It's not for nothing he works for Russian TV. Try to bear that in mind when watching him, I do.

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@izzythepush,

I watch him quite often izzy. Who is that female he sometimes has with him? She looks fearsome.

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@spendius,

Do all women that are more intelligent than you look fearsome? Laughing

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@spendius,

Not too sure, but RT in many ways is the flip side of Fox News, both are trying to pursue an agenda. That agenda is not unbiased and objective journalism, if you bear that in mind when watching it you shouldn't go too far wrong. A really good programme on journalistic bias is The Listening Post on Al Jazeera. Follow the link if you wish, there's plenty there to keep you occupied.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=al+jazeera+listening+post&oq=al+jazeera+li&aq=4&aqi=g1g-s1g6g-s1g1&aql=1&gs_sm=c&gs_upl=4159l10785l0l13813l13l13l0l0l0l0l240l2107l2.7.4l13l0

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

I quite like Max Keiser, but you need to realise he has his own agenda. It's not for nothing he works for Russian TV

Russian TV seems to be non bias like Iranian TV don't they? Idea

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@reasoning logic,

Quote:

Do all women that are more intelligent than you look fearsome?

They certainly do. I assume you have never noticed yourself. Which is odd bearing in mind that the whole bloody tribe of the buggers are more intelligent than the best of us poor saps.

You really are a little misogynist aren't you? I bet you think that every little thing a specimen tells the assembled TV crews is a true and faithful record of what actually took place. That she is so simple that she is incapable of thinking up any variations on what actually happened. And that she is coming before the cameras solely to warn the nation as to the character of the man they are thinking of electing so as to save us all from suffering 8 years of his rule.

1 Reply

@spendius,

Quote:

I bet you think that every little thing a specimen tells the assembled TV crews is a true and faithful record of what actually took place.

You would be a loosing man to make bets like that!

Quote:

You really are a little misogynist aren't you?

No not at all, I think there are good women and there are bad just like men!

How are things going in the monarchy today?

2 Replies

Where is the US economy headed?

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