114
   

Where is the US economy headed?

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 08:39 pm
Yeah, pure ignorance.
0 Replies
 
HokieBird
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 08:41 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Hokie, You say you haven't seen his film, but claim he lied. That's pure ignorance.


As I've already pointed out, he's been discussing the film Sicko all over the place. I can form opinions about what he says in those discussions, even if I haven't seen his film, right?

And now let's remove ourselves from this thread and let others get on with their discussion on how our economy is doomed and the sky is falling.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 08:41 pm
parados wrote:

No one making 20K would get $5,000 in tax credits but if they did it would count as income for figuring poverty. So your argument is factually incorrect on many counts okie. You shouldn't claim you disproved anything when you don't have any facts to back up your claims.

Before taxes, Parados. I stick by what I said. Money paid back to people over and above what they pay in taxes, due to tax credits, is not counted.
0 Replies
 
HokieBird
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 08:46 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Yeah, pure ignorance.


Right. And people the world over are flocking to Cuba for their world-class healthcare Laughing
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 08:56 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
HokieBird wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Compared to the US, yes. If you challenge what Moore claims in the film, please show evidence that it isn't what he claims. I'd be interested in seeing your "truth." Have a nice trip to Cuba.


No, thanks. I'll leave you to your little 'fantasy' island of believing Moore. He, after all, has such a great track record with 'fair and balanced' Smile


He does have a good track record with factual inaccuracy.

Cycloptichorn


I fixed that for you, you misspelled that one word.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 09:14 pm
Hokie can't help himself from making more ignorant statements.


Hokie: Right. And people the world over are flocking to Cuba for their world-class healthcare
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 09:33 pm
McGentrix wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
HokieBird wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
Compared to the US, yes. If you challenge what Moore claims in the film, please show evidence that it isn't what he claims. I'd be interested in seeing your "truth." Have a nice trip to Cuba.


No, thanks. I'll leave you to your little 'fantasy' island of believing Moore. He, after all, has such a great track record with 'fair and balanced' Smile


He does have a good track record with factual inaccuracy.

Cycloptichorn


I fixed that for you, you misspelled that one word.


You're 100% wrong, and have no proof to back up your allegations. But of course you knew that before you typed, and were only displaying more of that inner jerk that we all know and loathe.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 09:34 pm
okie wrote:
parados wrote:

No one making 20K would get $5,000 in tax credits but if they did it would count as income for figuring poverty. So your argument is factually incorrect on many counts okie. You shouldn't claim you disproved anything when you don't have any facts to back up your claims.

Before taxes, Parados. I stick by what I said. Money paid back to people over and above what they pay in taxes, due to tax credits, is not counted.

Funny stuff there okie..
Here is an alternative method that includes all monies and non monetary assistance. It results in a similar but slightly higher poverty level.
http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/povmeas/toc.html

Who should we believe? You or the people that actually count the number of people in poverty? I will stick with the Census bureau over you any day. The Census bureau uses measures and lists their methods. You just pull stuff out of your a**. You have consistently proven you ignore facts if they don't agree with your world view.

By the way.. you haven't provided any evidence of this $5,000 figure you proposed poor people were getting in tax credits. The maximum for 2 adults making 20K for EITC is less than $4,000 and less than $3,500 for a single parent with 2 or more children.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 11:17 pm
By the numbers: US poverty threshholds according to the US Census Bureau.

Related children under 18 years

Size of family unit Eight
..................................................None.... One..... Two..... Three,,,,, Four..... Five..... Six..... Seven..... or more


One person (unrelated individual)....
Under 65 years....................... 10,488
65 years and over.................... 9,669

Two persons............................
Householder under 65 years....13,500.... 13,896
Householder 65 years and over12,186.... 13,843

Three persons.......................... 15,769.... 16,227 16,242
Four persons........................... 20,794.... 21,134 20,444 20,516
Five persons............................. 25,076.... 25,441.... 24,662.... 24,059.... 23,691
Six persons............................... 28,842.... 28,957..... 28,360.... 27,788.... 26,938.... 26,434
Seven persons........................... 33,187.... 33,394.... 32,680.... 32,182.... 31,254.... 30,172.... 28,985....
Eight persons.......................... 37,117.... 37,444.... 36,770.... 36,180.... 35,342.... 34,278.... 33,171.... 32,890
Nine persons or more................ 44,649.... 44,865.... 44,269.... 43,768.... 42,945.... 41,813.... 40,790.... 40,536.... 38,975....
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 05:45 am
Quote:
U.S. Foreclosure Filings Jump to Record in First Half (Update3)

By Dan Levy and Brian Louis

A sign for an upcoming foreclosure July 12 (Bloomberg) -- Mortgage foreclosures in the U.S. jumped to a record in the first half as rising interest rates and falling home prices battered homeowners.

Almost 926,000 foreclosure notices were filed, 56 percent more than a year earlier and the most since Irvine, California- based RealtyTrac started tracking the data in 2005. Foreclosures were the highest last month in California and Florida, where some home prices have fallen as much as 25 percent, and Ohio and Michigan, where the automotive industry fired more than 50,000 people in the past 10 years.

The jump in 30-year mortgage rates by more than a half a percentage point since May is putting a crimp on borrowers with the best credit just as a crackdown in subprime lending standards limits the pool of qualified buyers. Foreclosures also are increasing as the supply of unsold homes hit a record 4.43 million in May, according to the National Association of Realtors.

Foreclosure rates in ``most states remained substantially above last year's levels,'' RealtyTrac Chief Executive Officer James Saccacio said in a statement.

In June, defaults surged 87 percent to 164,644 from a year ago, said RealtyTrac, a seller of foreclosure data, in the statement today. Last month's total was 7 percent lower than in May. California, Florida, Ohio and Michigan accounted for half the national total in June.

Worsening Slump
Homeowners are losing their property as the National Association of Realtors is forecasting the housing slump will persist into next year as builders curtail production. The group yesterday reduced its sales forecast for the seventh consecutive month and said existing home sales will fall 5.6 percent.

The rise in defaults has spurred credit ratings services to take action. Moody's Investors Service yesterday said it may downgrade $5 billion of collateralized debt obligations after lowering the ratings on subprime mortgage bonds that make up the securities.

A cut would affect 184 pieces of 91 CDOs, representing about 3.6 percent of rated CDOs containing asset-backed securities, Moody's said. Moody's on July 10 sliced ratings on $5.2 billion of subprime bonds that back CDOs.

Ratings Cut
Investors have criticized Standard & Poor's, Moody's and Fitch Ratings because their ratings on bonds backed by mortgages to people with poor or limited credit don't reflect the fastest default rate in a decade.

U.S. home prices will drop 1.4 percent this year and housing starts will tumble in 2008 amid higher mortgage rates and a glut of properties for sale, the National Association of Realtors said yesterday. The Chicago-based group said the median home price was $223,700 in May, a 2.1 percent decrease from a year earlier.

An estimated 58 percent of properties in the foreclosure process are linked to borrowers with subprime loans, and RealtyTrac expects U.S. foreclosures to reach 1.8 million by year's end, Rick Sharga, a spokesman for the company, said in an interview.

``We're running much further ahead of what we had anticipated in terms of year-over-year,'' Sharga said. ``Historically, 40 percent of properties entering default make it as far as auction, with half of those going back to banks and the other half to investors.''

Lenders typically begin default proceedings against homeowners after mortgage payments are 90 days late. The foreclosure process varies by state, ranging from 21 days in Texas to an average of 455 days in New York, Sharga said.

Nevada had the highest foreclosure rate in June with one filing for every 175 households, more than four times the national average of one per 704, RealtyTrac said. Nevada had 4,722 foreclosure filings, more than three times its total a year ago.

California Soars
California had the second-highest rate, with one filing per 315 households, and the most filings overall, 38,801, for the sixth month in a row. Foreclosures in California, the most populous state, increased almost three-fold over a year ago.

Colorado had the third-highest rate with one foreclosure per 317 households. Florida was fourth with one per 347, followed by Arizona with one per 383, Ohio with one per 403 and Michigan with one per 420.

Six of the top 10 U.S. foreclosure rates for metropolitan areas were in California. Stockton, Merced, Modesto and Riverside- San Bernardino occupied the top four spots. Vallejo-Fairfield was seventh and Sacramento eighth.

Las Vegas had the fifth-highest foreclosure rate, Greeley, Colorado was sixth, Detroit was ninth and Miami was 10th.

To contact the reporters on this story: Dan Levy in San Francisco at [email protected] ; Brian Louis in Chicago at [email protected] .

Last Updated: July 12, 2007 13:05 EDT

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=afjq9WCz.Zy8&refer=home
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 03:25 pm
Could this mean anything other than the dollar falling in value?

Quote:
Iran Asks Japan to Pay Yen for Oil, Start Immediately (Update3)

By Megumi Yamanaka

The Japanese oil tanker Mogamigawa July 13 (Bloomberg) -- Iran asked Japanese refiners to switch to the yen to pay for all crude oil purchases, after Iran's central bank said it is reducing holdings of the U.S. dollar.

Iran wants yen-based transactions ``for any/all of your forthcoming Iranian crude oil liftings,'' according to a letter sent to Japanese refiners that was signed by Ali A. Arshi, general manager of crude oil marketing and exports in Tehran at the National Iranian Oil Co. The request is for all shipments ``effective immediately,'' according to the letter, dated July 10 and obtained by Bloomberg News.

The yen rose on speculation for an increase in demand for the currency, the result of Japan's annual 1.24 trillion yen ($10.1 billion) of oil imports from Iran. Central bankers in Venezuela, Indonesia and the United Arab Emirates have said they will invest less of their reserves in dollar assets because of the weakening currency.

``What else can Japan do but to accept the request, once the oil producer sent its wish?'' said Hirofumi Kawachi, an analyst at Mizuho Investors Securities Co. in Tokyo. ``The tensions between the U.S. and Iran are escalating, and it's Iran's measure to hedge risk.''

A spokesman for Iran's oil ministry in Tehran said he could neither confirm nor deny that the letter had been sent. Most Japanese oil refiners have until now used U.S. dollars to pay Iran for oil, said the spokesman, who declined to be identified by name because of government policy.

Yen Advances
The yen advanced to 122.07 per dollar at 2:30 p.m. in New York, from 122.42 late yesterday.

Iran is cutting its U.S. dollar reserves to less than 20 percent of total foreign currency holdings, and will buy more euros and yen as tensions with the U.S. increase, Central Bank Governor Ebrahim Sheibany said on March 27.

The United Nations Security Council is preparing for another round of sanctions against Iran because of the nation's nuclear research.

The Islamic republic, holder of the world's second-largest oil and gas reserves, has refused to halt uranium enrichment that it says is for use in nuclear power plants to produce electricity. The U.S. says Iran seeks instead to develop an atomic bomb. Enriched uranium can be used to make nuclear fuel or build nuclear weapons.

Iran isn't alone in wanting to drop the dollar for pricing oil. Russia has been examining plans to price the Urals oil export blend in rubles to curb currency risks. The nation plans to open the Energy Stock Exchange in St. Petersburg in the first half of next year to trade oil in rubles, UBS AG reported June 14.

`New Payment Mechanism'
Iran asked the refiners to use the yen exchange rate quoted at the Bank of Tokyo Mitsubishi UFJ on the date oil cargoes are loaded. The use of yen-based letters of credit for oil ``has finally been approved'' by the Iranian central bank and the NIOC, according to the letter, titled ``New payment mechanism for Iranian Crude Oil Cargoes.''

Japan imported 1.59 million kiloliters of Iranian crude oil in May, the least since June 2006, according to government data.

Only Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates are larger oil suppliers to Japan than Iran.


http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aLaColVYu5LA&refer=home
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 03:33 pm
xingu, This is the beginning of the end for the US dollar's value; it's going to lose a good percentage against all major currencies in the very near future.

Americans will begin to feel the inflationary pressures before year end, and interest rates will climb.

I hope you are prepared.

The only good news is that our products and services will become more competitive in the world marketplace, but I'm not convinced it'll have any dramatic positives for Americans.
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 03:47 pm
I've heard a lot of speculation about what may happen if the dollar falls. We're making enemies and more countries want to have nothing to do with us.

Interest rates will have to rise if we want other countries to buy our debt. With Bush in office we will never see a surplus as we did under Clinton (bless his heart). The only thing we can look forward to is more debt and fewer friends.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 04:08 pm
To top it off, Bush said we'll have to stay in Iraq "until we win." I smell bankruptcy in more ways than one.
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 07:50 pm
So what's with Bush and the Executive Office?

http://benmoseley.com/images/bush_pay_raise.jpg
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 07:52 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
xingu, This is the beginning of the end for the US dollar's value; it's going to lose a good percentage against all major currencies in the very near future.

Americans will begin to feel the inflationary pressures before year end, and interest rates will climb.

I hope you are prepared.

The only good news is that our products and services will become more competitive in the world marketplace, but I'm not convinced it'll have any dramatic positives for Americans.


Exactly right.. I suppose now the Bush administration will have to accelerate its war aims on Iran and might as well also put Japan in the axis of evil now. We have to prop that dollar up some how. haha.. Too bad this isnt funny.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 08:39 pm
Can any of you explain to me how the party of small government can justify the spiraling cost for the Bush whtie house? He is a "conservative" isn't he?
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 04:00 am
cicerone imposter wrote:
Can any of you explain to me how the party of small government can justify the spiraling cost for the Bush whtie house? He is a "conservative" isn't he?


In a word...NO!
He is not a conservative and never has been,no matter what he says.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 05:21 am
mysteryman wrote:
He is not a conservative and never has been,no matter what he says.


Well, yes, when you say so. (wHell, he's more to right than any European conservative.)
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 05:36 am
Bush is against stem cell research-conservative

Bush is against abortions-conservative.

Bush says he wants to balance the budget but, instead, creates hugh deficits, like Reagan-conservative.

Clinton says he wants to balance the budget and does it-liberal
0 Replies
 
 

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