Where is the US economy headed?

@parados,

The Commonwealth of MAssachusetts demands that sales clerks who deal with beer, wine and spirits must ask for identification of any customer who appears to be less than 30 years old.

2 Replies

@plainoldme,

Yes, but they don't demand identification that proves the person is in the country legally.

1 Reply

@plainoldme,

plainoldme wrote:

The Commonwealth of MAssachusetts demands that sales clerks who deal with beer, wine and spirits must ask for identification of any customer who appears to be less than 30 years old.

Doesn't that constitute "profiling?"

1 Reply

@okie,

We had a cookout on Super Bowl Sunday. More people expected than we had anticipated. Trip to 7-11 for a 12-pack of beer before the party. New clerk at 7-11. She carded me. I am 64.
Ha!

2 Replies

@realjohnboy,

Quote:

We had a cook out on Super Bowl Sunday. More people expected than we had anticipated. Trip to 7-11 for a 12-pack of beer before the party. New clerk at 7-11. She carded me. I am 64.
Ha!

we have a brewpub near home that was caught selling to underage, and they now card everyone as well. There is no justification for this, it is simple lack of respect for the individuals involved, both the customer and the server. We are both assumed to be unable or unwilling to tell the truth and judge people ages.

When people say that America is on the wrong track this is the kind of nonsense that they are talking about.

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

When I mentioned the issue of profiling in regard to age, I was merely making a point that we are losing all common sense in regard to "profiling." We profile all the time. For example, I had a close relative that was working in Arizona a long time ago, and was driving home for the weekend, to be stopped many times by the patrol, Navajo police, and so forth. He found out later his vehicle matched the description of the getaway car in a bank robbery in Phoenix or somewhere like that. Of course it was good for a good laugh later and he totally understood the reason for being stopped so many times. Similarly, it is not surprising to be stopped if you are driving a beat up van with a license plate hanging from one bolt, missing lights, and bald tires, with 16 hispanics packed into the back of it. These are the types of vehicles being used by illegal smugglers, and I can't count the number of times accidents have killed multiple people in New Mexico, Arizona, or even Colorado and Oklahoma, plus other places, when a tire blows out. Are we supposed to be too dumb to have suspicions about certain things we see, if we are law enforcement officers? Has political correctness taken every last ounce of common sense away from us?

Point being, a law enforcement officer can stop vehicles for missing lights and other infractions, and if suspicions warrant, there is absolutely nothing wrong with asking for ID, just my opinion. It is simply a matter of enforcing laws, and perhaps even saving lives.

2 Replies

@okie,

okie wrote:

Has political correctness taken every last ounce of common sense away from us?

No. Some Americans still rely on experience and common sense.

0 Replies

@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
We had a cook out on Super Bowl Sunday. More people expected than we had anticipated. Trip to 7-11 for a 12-pack of beer before the party. New clerk at 7-11. She carded me. I am 64.
Ha!
we have a brewpub near home that was caught selling to underage, and they now card everyone as well. There is no justification for this, it is simple lack of respect for the individuals involved, both the customer and the server. We are both assumed to be unable or unwilling to tell the truth and judge people ages.

When people say that America is on the wrong track this is the kind of nonsense that they are talking about.

It's not a question of respect, it's a question of losing your liquor license, which would be death to your brewpub. It's just not worth it.

The servers probably aren't trusted, you're right - because they screwed up in the past.

In TX where I am from, the FIRST OFFENSE of serving alcohol to a minor is a 5k fine and a night in jail - for the server or bartender.

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

@okie,

Quote:

Point being, a law enforcement officer can stop vehicles for missing lights and other infractions

That isn't profiling okie. Geez.. you guys don't even understand the meaning of it.

An officer that stops a vehicle for an infraction isn't profiling.
An officer that stops a vehicle because of the color of the driver IS profiling.

0 Replies

@realjohnboy,

realjohnboy wrote:

My bet is that this bill will pass without it going through the filibuster/cloture cycle. And at least 6 Repubs will vote for it. I can name names.

I continue to be interested in that bet.

2 Replies

@Thomas,

Hi, Thomas. There is another vote in the Senate today to bring the bill to the floor. The 3rd one, I believe. I don't know if it will get the 60 votes but you can see a couple of Repubs seemingly more inclined to move it (Voinovich of Ohio, for example).
I don't see the Repubs wanting to endure a weekend of bashing by Dems on talk shows. The Dems may agree to a few minor changes to allow the Repubs a bit of cover. But the big changes that had been demanded will probably not happen.

0 Replies

@parados,

All acceptable identification is issued by a state or nation-state.

0 Replies

@realjohnboy,

Should a clerk working in a store in Massachusetts fail to check the id of a liquor buyer and should that buyer be underage, the clerk will be fined $10,000. That's about what I earned working at the store in one year.

The store will lose its license or have its license suspended for a period, depending upon whether this is first offense or not.

Some companies simply "card" all customers for their own safety.

1 Reply

@plainoldme,

Quote:

Should a clerk working in a store in Massachusetts fail to check the id of a liquor buyer and should that buyer be underage, the clerk will be fined $10,000. That's about what I earned working at the store in one year.

The store will lose its license or have its license suspended for a period, depending upon whether this is first offense or not.

Some companies simply "card" all customers for their own safety.

government is micro-managing our lives. Time to shrink government.

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Should a clerk working in a store in Massachusetts fail to check the id of a liquor buyer and should that buyer be underage, the clerk will be fined $10,000. That's about what I earned working at the store in one year.

The store will lose its license or have its license suspended for a period, depending upon whether this is first offense or not.

Some companies simply "card" all customers for their own safety.
government is micro-managing our lives. Time to shrink government.

This has nothing at all to do with government micro-managing your life, dude. You just like to repeat this over and over. It's a sign of ignorance, not a well-considered political position.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

This has nothing at all to do with government micro-managing your life, dude. You just like to repeat this over and over. It's a sign of ignorance, not a well-considered political position.

the government position is draconian...these kinds of penalties for a single offense are clearly intended to intimidate, to send a message. They are not supported by reason or a goal of a well functioning collective. A government that so abuses the individual must be fixed.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
This has nothing at all to do with government micro-managing your life, dude. You just like to repeat this over and over. It's a sign of ignorance, not a well-considered political position.

the government position is draconian...these kinds of penalties for a single offense are clearly intended to intimidate, to send a message. They are not supported by reason or a goal of a well functioning collective. A government that so abuses the individual must be fixed.

Nothing here abuses the individual at all. You are being hyperbolic.

We have laws preventing the sale of certain substances to minors, and there's nothing abusive or wrong about that at all. There are dozens of thousands of points of sale in every state and it's impossible for the police to monitor all of them. Without an appropriate fine, there is no way to ensure enforcement of the law.

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

THere are alleged to be more than 10 million illegal immigrants from Mexico. Too many of these have committed robbery and murder.

The best way, the most efficient way, and the most legal way, is for the legal immigrants to present on demand of the police their green cards. That way it will be easier to detect the illegal immigrants and protect all the legal inhabitants of the USA from crimes committed by illegal immigrants. Furthermore, it will reduce the number of illegal immigrants taking jobs away from legal Americans.

I recommend the police mainly suspect those hispanic people who do not speak English or speak it poorly.

I guess in the minds of the Odems (i.e., Obamademocrats) that makes me a linguistic bigot! So be it!

0 Replies

@Thomas,

Speaking of bets, Thomas, I continue to move my money on and off the table with regards to whether or not Germany and France will sign on to the euro-zone bailout of Greece. The cost is projected to be something like $160Bn over a couple or three years IF Greece gets its deficits under control. Big IF.
Germany seems to send a different message every day, which results in stock markets world wide being volatile.
The calendar is interesting. Greece needs the money by May 19th to avoid default. There is some big euro-zone meeting on May 10th. But, oops, there are important elections in Germany May 9th. I think I have that time line right.
I would be interested to here your take, as a German, on what might happen.
Americans are, for the most part, naively not following this. But interest rates on government debt in Greece are now in double digits. Spain and Portugal and perhaps Ireland are in difficulty. And pundits are keeping a wary eye on the U.K.
This could be another shoe dropping just as we thought the economic crisis was winding down, having a big impact on our exports and tourism.
Ms Merkel will sign on eventually, I think. But I wouldn't bet on it.
Thanks in advance for your analysis.

2 Replies

@realjohnboy,

They will bail them out, because who are really being bailed out are the Counter parties - and I believe that Germany and France are into that.

From Yglesias:

Quote:

Who Is Bailed?

An important point from Atrios that he makes specifically about Greece but has general applicability"a bailout “of Greece” would largely be a bailout of Greece’s creditors, you’d be giving Greece money that Greece would use to pay people who own Greek bonds. Obviously that’s win-win for both the bondholders and for Greek people, but it’s actually the bondholders who have more at stake. A roughly parallel situation existed with the AIG bailout, which was less a bailout of AIG than it was of institutions to whom AIG owed money and who failed to do due diligence on AIG’s financial situation.

This is part of what, to me, makes northern European (and especially German) stinginess and self-righteousness about the situation a bit hard to take. The political discourse makes it seem like we’re talking about showering Greece’s citizens with the thrifty Germans’ cash when in fact we’re talking about Greece’s citizens facing tax hikes and spending cuts while German money just cycles back to the big European banks who’ll have holes in their balance sheets if Greece defaults. And in the terms that Tyler Cowen used to frame it, it’s not just that Greece was pretending to be richer than it is, the financial institutions that lent to Greece agreed to believe them! But nobody forces banks to lend to countries with shaky political systems and questionable public finance practices.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

Where is the US economy headed?

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know