114
   

Where is the US economy headed?

 
 
okie
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 01:51 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
It is obvious you will defend Obama no matter how blatant his failures are. If you wish to compare, Obama knows nothing about running a business, nor does he know anything about health care, unless you wish to count his wife's big salary job at the hospital in Chicago where she did little or nothing for a big fat pile of money, as approved by other political buddies of Obama in Chicago, in exchange for who knows what. And he doesn't even know much about the health of his own kids, as he claimed once that his daughter had meningitis, which apparently turned out to be a total and absolute lie.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 03:15 pm
@okie,
okie wrote:

It is obvious you will defend Obama no matter how blatant his failures are.


No, I wouldn't, either. However, he hasn't really failed at much yet, so I haven't had to give him much of a hard time yet.

Quote:
If you wish to compare


Compare what, to who?

Quote:
Obama knows nothing about running a business


This is a lie on your part.

Quote:
nor does he know anything about health care
,

Another lie on your part. Unless you have some evidence, you're just slinging **** at the wall and hoping some will stick.

Quote:
unless you wish to count his wife's big salary job at the hospital in Chicago where she did little or nothing for a big fat pile of money, as approved by other political buddies of Obama in Chicago, in exchange for who knows what.


Oh no, politicians getting people around them hooked up with jobs! Whatever will we do.

I doubt you could find a single politician on our national stage whose family members are not in similar positions.

Quote:
And he doesn't even know much about the health of his own kids, as he claimed once that his daughter had meningitis, which apparently turned out to be a total and absolute lie.


You are 100% incorrect, Okie. You'll swallow anything that is dangled in front of you, just like a stupid fish.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/10/06/taking_liberties/entry5365670.shtml

Cycloptichorn
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 05:02 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Now wait a minute Cyclo.

Saying that okie will "swallow anything that is dangled in front of him, just like a stupid fish" is not a satisfactory answer to his charge that Mr Obama "claimed once that his daughter had meningitis, which apparently turned out to be a total and absolute lie". Nor will it do to assert that okie was " 100% incorrect".

You ought to ask him for his evidence.


cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 06:10 pm
@okie,
okie, You continue to repeat "Marxism and Fascism,," but have never provided any evidence for your claim. Your imagination is your worst enemy, because your brain is not capable of seeing any reality.

Our country is based on capitalism; over 99% of products and services are based on capitalistic ideals.

You're just an ignorant bastard who fails to understand economics or politics.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 06:14 pm
@JPB,
JPB,
good article, and I agee with you.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 06:57 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:
And he doesn't even know much about the health of his own kids, as he claimed once that his daughter had meningitis, which apparently turned out to be a total and absolute lie.


You are 100% incorrect, Okie. You'll swallow anything that is dangled in front of you, just like a stupid fish.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/10/06/taking_liberties/entry5365670.shtml

Cycloptichorn

Interesting issue here, I understand that the doctor told the Obama's that their daughter might have meningitis, but Obama said that she was diagnosed with meningitis. Now, apparently she was not diagnosed with meningitis, cyclops, do you have evidence to the contrary? If not, I would appreciate an apology and an admission that I was correct, and that Obama did in fact lie either intentionally or unknowingly, we can discuss which one of those possibilities when we get to that.
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:00 pm
@okie,
Did you read the article?

Quote:

There's just one problem with this nice little gotcha story. There's no evidence that either Obama lied.


Nothing to apologize for, Bro; just you snapping up whatever is dangled in front of you.

Cycloptichorn
okie
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:00 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Answer the question.
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:05 pm
@okie,
I did answer the question: there's no evidence that Obama lied.

Why don't you ask yourself, for a second: how ******* petty have you become, in an effort to make some sort of dent, in a guy that you obviously loathe?

Cycloptichorn
okie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:08 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
You cannot answer a simple question? Was Obama's daughter diagnosed with meningitis, yes or no? Mrs. Obama said she was not, while Mr. Obama said she was. Unless you have evidence that she was in fact diagnosed with it, then Mr. Obama apparently lied, as I think Michelle would know more about her infant daughter than daddy, don't you?
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:19 pm
@okie,
Christ, you've hit a low point, Okie. I got nothin more to say till you calm down a bit.

Good Day, Sir

Cycloptichorn
okie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:25 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
So I've hit a low point to question President Obama? And apparently you cannot or will not answer a simple question anymore. Until you can provide evidence that Obama's daughter did in fact have meningitis or was diagnosed with meningitus, you owe me a personal apology for your gutter language and accusations pointed at me. After all, Obama is on tape as declaring that his daughter had meningitus, which apparently is a lie, either knowingly or unknowingly, I would be willing to debate that point after you submit the apology.

You have apparently become very unhinged, even worse than previous, as you just cannot apparently bring yourself to objectively examine the honesty of Obama. This is such a simple matter and can be so simply resolved, if you could bring yourself to be honest. Do you have it in you?

By the way, I am totally calm, it is you that is way out of sorts. All I am asking is a simple answer to a simple question, it should be easy for honest people.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:38 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

Now wait a minute Cyclo.

Saying that okie will "swallow anything that is dangled in front of him, just like a stupid fish" is not a satisfactory answer to his charge that Mr Obama "claimed once that his daughter had meningitis, which apparently turned out to be a total and absolute lie". Nor will it do to assert that okie was " 100% incorrect".

You ought to ask him for his evidence.


Spendi, cyclops has shown himself for what he is. Apparently he simply does not have the courage to face the truth, and loyalty to Obama is more important to him than honesty or honorable principles. He owes me and other honest posters an apology. I think that also probably includes you? I think you are a pretty honest chap.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  2  
Reply Mon 12 Oct, 2009 07:48 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

okie wrote:
unless you wish to count his wife's big salary job at the hospital in Chicago where she did little or nothing for a big fat pile of money, as approved by other political buddies of Obama in Chicago, in exchange for who knows what.


Oh no, politicians getting people around them hooked up with jobs! Whatever will we do.

I doubt you could find a single politician on our national stage whose family members are not in similar positions.
Cycloptichorn

Another point that is repulsive, cyclops, you pull out the old play out of the Democrat playbook, "everybody does it" alibi. Frankly, its getting old, and it rubs me the wrong way, I can't say everyone else feels this way, but if Laura Bush had been appointed to a nonjob with a big salary by political cronies, we would never have heard the end of it. I think it was totally corrupt, and it is obvious, and I am not going to forget it to please the Obamas and all of their worshipers. This is not about getting somebody a job, it is about creating a nonjob as a political payoff or favor.

I notice now that the administration is going after Fox. I would not be the least bit surprised to see some kind of move to try to shut up the opposition. That is what leftists do, that is their natural tendency, as they are totally hung up on themselves and their bloated view of themselves and their right to power, and that nobody has the right to oppose them or even question them. Perish the thought that Lord Obama would ever submit to a serious question from anyone from Fox News. I would not consider the interview with O'Reilly as a serious attempt at it. The man wants to be treated as if he is royalty and he cannot abide serious questions, just as cyclops is offended that I would so much as ask him a question about something Obama said.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 13 Oct, 2009 12:33 am
@okie,
In regard to Obama's vendetta against Fox News, it is pretty revealing that Obama will talk to the madman from Iran without preconditions, apparently anytime, but Obama will not talk to Fox at all. He is more afraid of a question from Fox than he is from a guy that denies the holocaust and wants to wipe Israel off the map. This would be funny if it wasn't so incredibly pathetic. And dangerous.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 13 Oct, 2009 08:25 am
@okie,
What kind of "Preconditions" do you think is justified? You have no concept of diplomacy or international relations. You are an idiot.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Oct, 2009 07:13 am
September retail sales drop 1.5% -- biggest drop in 9 months as car sales plunge.

So reads the breaking news headline on MSNBC.

Car sales plunge? Why is that a surprise to anyone?
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Oct, 2009 07:14 am
@okie,
Aren't there at least 3 other threads where you guys can take this discussion?
okie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Oct, 2009 08:05 am
@JPB,
Sorry about the tangent I allowed cyclops to lead me off into. Back to the economy, in regard to car sales, conservatives including me predicted this would happen. Essentially car sales were artificially front loaded at the expense of sales later on. Things like this always happen when artificial non fixes are enacted rather than fixing the overall foundational economic problems. The same thing is happening in other industries as well, example the real estate industry. I believe tax policy should be formulated to be consistent over the long term rather than these stop gap short term policies that people cannot predict or count on. It produces anomalies and unintended consequences. Basically it is short term and ill advised meddling int0 the free market, which is very very poor public policy. Very amateurish, and I think it is but another indicator of the lack of understanding of economics by this administration.
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Oct, 2009 08:50 am
@okie,
Normally I'd agree with you on the long term over short term philosophy but we're in very special times right now. I found this column in the Financial Times (London) very interesting... Roger Altman suggests that we have to continue the current policies short-term in order to prevent the derailment of a fragile recovery but should commit NOW to reduce the deficit as soon as the short-term crisis has stabilized.

Quote:
America’s fiscal dilemma is unprecedented because the short-term need differs so dramatically from the long-term one. Today, all the data are signalling weakness. Consumer spending, which represents 70 per cent of gross domestic product, and employment are especially downbeat. Joblessness, having hit a 26-year high, will not improve much through 2010. That puts pressure on consumers. The pace of recovery, therefore, will be painfully slow.

This requires that policy remain stimulative over the next year. The economy could slip backwards without it. That is why the Federal Reserve is maintaining a zero Fed funds rate. It also explains why the $787bn (£492bn, €534bn) stimulus will expand, perhaps to $900bn.<br><br>But for 2011 and beyond, the fiscal challenge is fearsome. A combination of prior tax cuts, years of high spending and a brutal recession have produced the worst budget conditions in 75 years. Through 2019, private forecasts predict deficits averaging $1,000bn a year. In 2019 the deficit would represent 6.5 per cent of GDP and be rising. Worse, national debt will hit nearly 85 per cent of GDP. Annual interest costs on it would exceed the US defence budget and the whole category of discretionary spending. The Treasury’s annual borrowing, including refinancings, would average a breathtaking $4,000bn. All this occurs before the Medicare/Medicaid share of GDP explodes beyond 2019.

... snip ...

President Barack Obama and Congress should not risk a replay of the Carter experience. The scale is so much larger now that the impact of a dollar stabilisation programme would be more punitive. It would jeopardise the entire recovery. This is why an overt commitment to deficit reduction should be made now.

It could take the form of legislation creating a bipartisan deficit reduction group modelled on the successful budget summit of 1990 and consist only of administration and congressional leaders. Its recommendations, by law, would be submitted by December 31 2010 and face an up or down vote within three to four months. It would acknowledge the need for higher taxes and spending cuts.

It is true that Mr Obama inherited the deficit. But, like Afghanistan, it is his responsibility now. Only he can forge a process for solving it.more (registration required)
 

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