Where is the US economy headed?

@JPB,

It's not necessary to even read between the lines; the increase in unemployment tells the picture very well. Why the market continues to go up is a mystery with nothing to support it.

You betcha, I'm more than nervous!

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@cicerone imposter,

There is an argument that the Equity price levels are driven by macro trends, such as treasury rates and the value of the dollar. They are not however justified based upon the value of what is being bought, by that I mean these companies. It is a bubble, which will at some point pop.

Capitalism is increasingly showing itself to be irrational, which is a huge problem. The continuation of capitalism is in jeopardy due to its continued poor performance.

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@hawkeye10,

What are you comparing it with hawk?

1 Reply

@spendius,

I made no comparison

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@hawkeye10,

A "poor performance" requires a standard of comparison.

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@spendius,

No, if what you are doing is not working you compare reality to your expectations. So yes I am making a comparison, but not comparing capitalism to some other system, which is what I thought that you meant.

The first rule of survival: if what you are doing is not working, then do something else.

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@hawkeye10,

Fair enough. But what is it?

I think it is working pretty good. The lights are on, the beer is flowing and the pub was heaving tonight. Although I must admit that the ladies don't look as pretty as they used to do.

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

There is an argument that the Equity price levels are driven by macro trends, such as treasury rates and the value of the dollar. They are not however justified based upon the value of what is being bought, by that I mean these companies. It is a bubble, which will at some point pop.

Capitalism is increasingly showing itself to be irrational, which is a huge problem. The continuation of capitalism is in jeopardy due to its continued poor performance.

The irrational includes the people that don't believe in capitalism or that don't even understand it. And the irrational are the people that think Marxism or Fascism that have been proven over and over to be absolute and utter failures and the cause of untold misery, that they should be tried again. The people that think Marxism or Fascism should be tried again, they are the truly irrational. Does that include Obama? A very distinct possibility folks!

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

It's not necessary to even read between the lines; the increase in unemployment tells the picture very well. Why the market continues to go up is a mystery with nothing to support it.

You betcha, I'm more than nervous!

What if many companies were overstaffed prior to the recession? Corporations might be doing better now, and never needed those now unemployed?

Automation just does not only come to the assembly line, I believe. Computers, and newer and more complex systems, do that which was once done by many humans.

The fact that unemployment is rising may have little to do with how well corporations are doing globally, I believe, at least for the short run.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

It's not necessary to even read between the lines; the increase in unemployment tells the picture very well. Why the market continues to go up is a mystery with nothing to support it.

You betcha, I'm more than nervous!

Me too. My only explanation for this years increases is that with the returns on safe treasuries and CDs at approximately nothing, there's a lot of money out there looking for a home.

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http://www.freedomworks.org/blog/mclemente/greenspans-gloomy-predictions

"All of this comes a mere is 8 months after Congress jammed through a so called “stimulus” bill without taking time to read it. The public was told that there was no time for debate and that even a few more hours of consideration could be catastrophic. President Obama and Vice President Biden assured us that if the stimulus passed unemployment would remain around 8 percent. With unemployment at 9.8 percent, all we can do is hope that our lawmakers have learned their lesson and take the time to read the health care bill before they vote (although, it seems doubtful, as Congress recently voted down an amendment asking for 72 hours to read the health care bill before it comes to a vote)."

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@okie,

Really? After all these years, 72 hours to read what they are voting on is just too long?

1 Reply

@roger,

This is just bullshit.

I wonder if Obama will give the public 5 full days to view the bill before he signs it (another campaign promise, but he's already broken it). I hope he does.

We (the people. the people that these jackasses in congress are supposed to represent.) need time to digest this bill and absorb it. It's a lot of money, and it's going to affect all of us in one way or another.

I expect....no, I HOPE that we have the time we need to review the final bill.

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@maporsche,

WE!? My best hope is that our representatives have, and take time to read it. The idea that we should have access is somewhere out there in dreamland.

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@okie,

okie, Your one-sided views on anything make your opinions useless and full of BS. What makes you so sure that the stimulus plan has not reduced the increase in job losses? Please provide your evidence that the stimulus plan has done nothing to help the American people.

Please provide reliable sources and evidence for all of your claims/opinions and/or for the article you seem to support.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

The unemployed are not the American people. One does have to assume that the increase in unemployment is in the interest of the American people.

1 Reply

@maporsche,

Car salesmen do not want the customer to go home and sleep on the deal. He is afraid the customer might realize how bad the deal is. A salesman wants to close the deal with a signature on the dotted line before you walk out the door. That is the same as Obama and the Democrats in Congress, they do not want full disclosure before voting on the legislation. Full information in the light of day or time to review the legislation would not bolster their chances of it passing. What should that tell us about whether the legislation is actually sound or not?

I think Obama needs to worry about the economy and about the war in Afghanistan, and forget about ramming his health care reform down our throats for now. His stimulus bill did not work, and he is doddling, stalling, and failing to be decisive in regard to Afghanistan, so it is a huge mistake for anyone to think he has the best health care ideas, in fact he is very very uninformed and amateurish. The gathering of doctors and giving them white coats, that was embarrassingly childish, and in fact most doctors oppose his reform completely.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Car salesmen do not want the customer to go home and sleep on the deal. He is afraid the customer might realize how bad the deal is. A salesman wants to close the deal with a signature on the dotted line before you walk out the door. That is the same as Obama and the Democrats in Congress, they do not want full disclosure before voting on the legislation.

What don't you think they are disclosing?

Quote:

Full information in the light of day or time to review the legislation would not bolster their chances of it passing. What should that tell us about whether the legislation is actually sound or not?

That tells us your opinion, but no actual facts with which to make projections or discussions.

Quote:

I think Obama needs to worry about the economy and about the war in Afghanistan, and forget about ramming his health care reform down our throats for now.

Good thing that you're not setting the agenda, then. It would never be the right time for you, b/c you don't want to see this reform, ever.

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His stimulus bill did not work

Yes, it did.

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and he is doddling, stalling, and failing to be decisive in regard to Afghanistan,

Better than just rushing in, didn't you say above that sleeping on an idea gives you a better idea if it is the right one? How would you like it if he was 'decisive' and just decided to deny all extra troops and start leaving?

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so it is a huge mistake for anyone to think he has the best health care ideas, in fact he is very very uninformed and amateurish.

Actually, he's quite smart, and you are uninformed and amateurish. I sincerely mean that. You don't know much about legislation, laws, or economics; just enough to complain.

Quote:

The gathering of doctors and giving them white coats, that was embarrassingly childish, and in fact most doctors oppose his reform completely.

You have no data to back that assertion up.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

Excellent article here on a consensus among economists. This is why I'm a contrarian --- I don't buy any of it other than as a best case scenario and we haven't had a best case outcome in a very long time.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33270709/ns/business-eye_on_the_economy/

1 Reply

@spendius,

What is that supposed to mean?

0 Replies

Where is the US economy headed?

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