114
   

Where is the US economy headed?

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 10:49 am
@genoves,
genoves, It's obvious you have no skill in logic. Vetting does not have any relationship to the skill level of any individual; they are separate issues.
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 01:44 pm
@cicerone imposter,
mohamed el-erian (co-director of PIMCO - the world's largest bond fund ) was interviewed this morning on CNBC .
he said that he had just come back from a quick trip visiting the financial capitals and their players around the world .
iho governments are simply too timid in dealing with the "financial firestorm" and he doesn't believe there'll be any "up movement" until all governments co-operate to get the firestorm under control - i guess that may be a while .
hbg

see : http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/SuperModels/AnLOfAGlobalBankingCrisis.aspx

Quote:
In an interview this week, he insisted that regional banks and local governments can no longer stomp their feet and claim they are immune from danger because they did not speculate on high-risk real-estate loans or structured finance: Collateral effects are going to crash into every institution that has ever lent a dime as excessive levels of debt are violently wrung out of the global financial system.

"I live in a world where crisis management is the norm, not the exception, and you learn a few things" El-Erian said. "You learn never to underestimate the destructive power of negative feedback loops."

L is for 'long term'

The insidious loop now has spun its way from Wall Street to the everyday lives of Americans as a financial crisis has become an economic crisis. Damaged money-center banks are lending less, leading to lower levels of production and curtailed expansion at companies. That has led to job cuts, which in turn have led to cutbacks in consumer cash flow and spending, which are feeding back into creating problems for credit card, auto and home loans made by smaller banks. Those troubles will in turn lead back to a diminished appetite to lend locally for projects with the slightest whiff of risk.

What makes El-Erian stand out among so many skeptics today is his view of the length of time these loops will need to play out. He argues that current stock and bond valuations are still so lofty, even after recent declines, that they suggest most investors believe solutions will come quickly -- creating a V-shaped recovery.

In contrast, El-Erian thinks U.S. government action has been so slow and timid that the recovery will instead drag out into the shape of an L and that it will curve upward into a U only when regulators and lawmakers worldwide are bludgeoned by losses to coordinate their approach despite dramatic regional differences in growth and indebtedness.

"Policy change in Washington, D.C., has been too little, too late," he said. "In a crisis like this, leaders have to be much bolder."
He gives Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke an A-plus for effort but only a B-plus for execution and outcome, which is not good enough to effect a swift recovery.









0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 01:49 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

genoves, It's obvious you have no skill in logic. Vetting does not have any relationship to the skill level of any individual; they are separate issues.


LOL !!!!
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 01:52 pm
@okie,
LOL? You're about the stupidist poster on a2k! Yeah, I laugh at your stuff all the time.

Your LOL says nothing about why. Something that continues to escape your simple brain.
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:10 pm
I am (not) amused that on a day where some dreadful news about labor came out, no one felt that was of any significance worthy of comment on an economics thread. More important is bashing, slashing and trashing each other, evidentally. Pathetic waste of a thread.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:16 pm
@realjohnboy,
realjohnboy wrote:

I am (not) amused that on a day where some dreadful news about labor came out, no one felt that was of any significance worthy of comment on an economics thread. More important is bashing, slashing and trashing each other, evidentally. Pathetic waste of a thread.


What is there to say?

Here's a pic

http://timeswampland.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/joblosses26091.gif?w=580&h=385

I'm getting sick of hearing Conservative idiots claim there's no problem and we should do nothing at all.

Cycloptichorn
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:17 pm
@realjohnboy,
rjb, I don't mind people laughing at my post/opinion, but "LOL" just doesn't say much to me without so much as why it's funny.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:30 pm
@cicerone imposter,
With congress stuck on the stimulus plan, they are only delaying cash into our economy that will help resuscitate tax revenue, but the longer they wait, the more tax revenue they depend on will drop precipitously to the point a) they will not be able to pay off the deficit, b) pay for current expenditures, and c) they'll be working for themselves, because there won't be an economy left for them to "manage," and everybody (99%) will be on the dole for food and shelter. They'll surely create socialism and chaos not only for the US but for the whole world.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:32 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Just another thought: since property values are dropping at unheard of rates in every state, it will surely reduce tax revenue to the point they will not be able to pay for our schools, police, and legal system. What then?
0 Replies
 
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:32 pm
@realjohnboy,
rjb wrote :

Quote:
I am (not) amused that on a day where some dreadful news about labor came out, no one felt that was of any significance worthy of comment on an economics thread. More important is bashing, slashing and trashing each other, evidentally. Pathetic waste of a thread.


unfortunately i have to agree !

btw canada's unemployment has risen to nearly 8 % - and no end in sight !!!
i'm wondering if some worksharing might be of help ?
the toyota plants in britain will pay workers being laid of for 16 weeks , if they agree to put in the equivalent amount of time when work picks up (though i think believing that in 16 weeks we'll see any kind of recovery is looking through rose-coloured glasses ) .
it would seem to me that worksharing might be of benefit to almost all workers . wouldn't it be better to share some work and wages rather than have unemployment and welfare payments skyrocket ?
in the end it has to be paid for by the people that are working .
why not have two long weekends a month - less traffic , some more leisure time , time for the family ... ...
i think business and governments should encourage worksharing by giving people that share work a break on their taxes (and other incentives) .
having massive unemployment could easily lead to civil unrest - it has happened before !
hbg
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:34 pm
@hamburger,
All this while the bankers who received government bailout monies doesn't seem to have any problems with their $18 billion bonus from those funds last year - while they failed their fiduciary responsibilities.

It gets more weird by the day.
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:37 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

... I don't mind people laughing at my post/opinion, but "LOL" just doesn't say much to me...


Get over it and get back on topic would be my gentle suggestion. It is yall's call.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 04:39 pm
@realjohnboy,
I will not let stupid comments and responses off the hook, and will challenge each one. My call.
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 06:15 pm
@cicerone imposter,
c.i. wrote :

Quote:
All this while the bankers who received government bailout monies doesn't seem to have any problems with their $18 billion bonus from those funds last year - while they failed their fiduciary responsibilities.


agreed , that's outrageous !

however , we still need some quick solutions now .
if an arsonist has set my house on fire , i would first try and get the fire under control ... thereafter i (and the police) can try and track the arsonist down .
by trying to chase down the arsonist first and not trying to control the fire , i'd likely wind up without a house - not a good alternative imo .

similarly , the governments should to everything to get the financial meltdown under control FIRST - spending time on the blame game now , wastes precious time - and i'm concerned that we may not have much time left to prevent a real meltdown without quick action .

i think we are dealing with a "firestorm" and not with a little "brushfire" that might burn itself out .
if it turns out that the financial situation stabiles soon , nothing has been lost . it'll be a good exercise for the next crisis imo .
hbg










cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 06:28 pm
@hamburger,
Ditto; I mean I agree; it's a firestorm.
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 06:33 pm
@cicerone imposter,
we better call the "water bombers" out - canada has plenty of them - sometimes even sent overseas (france) to fight fires .
take care !
hbg

http://www.northwestontariomaps.ca/sscimages/floatplane/IMG_0309WATERBOMBER_1.jpg
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 07:00 pm
@hamburger,
We had a little rain today, but long term draught is still anticipated.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 07:26 pm
@cicerone imposter,
We have long term draught in the pub ci. It's been on since I was a kid. I anticipate it will outlast me.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Feb, 2009 07:30 pm
@spendius,
spendi, Everything will outlast you!
0 Replies
 
genoves
 
  1  
Reply Sun 8 Feb, 2009 01:58 am
@cicerone imposter,
Are you senile? Vetting is defined thusly:

Main Entry: 2vet
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): vet·ted; vet·ting
Date: 1891
1 a: to provide veterinary care for (an animal) or medical care for (a person) b: to subject (a person or animal) to a physical examination or checkup
2 a: to subject to usually expert appraisal or correction <vet a manuscript> b: to evaluate for possible approval or acceptance <vet the candidates for a position>
" vet·ter noun


NotTO EVALUATE FOR POSSIBLE APPROVAL OR ACCEPTANCE--VET THE CANDIDATES FOR A POSITION.

It is clear to most people, except those who are in the beginnings of senility that the Obama Administration has done a terrible job of vetting---

The Obama Administration WERE UNABLE TO EVALUATE FORPOSSIBLE APPROVAL--THE FOLLOWING:

Richardson, Daschle. They also were so stupid that they could not discover that Geithner had tax problems.

0 Replies
 
 

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