Where is the US economy headed?

@Kolyo,

I guess you just proved me right.
They (the fed) don't make loans to banks to make loans.

The Fed didn't make loans to persons that couldn't pay the money back. The Fed is not omnipotent. It doesn't look at every loan prior to a bank making it. It doesn't have that power.

Yes, the Fed had to step in to save the banking system. That doesn't mean they are a failure because they didn't foresee the problem and correct it before it happened. Nor does that failure mean they don't know anything about economics.

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@georgeob1,

Quote:

I can assure you that my company is not included in the data set and neither are most of our competitors. The same is true of many industries across the country.

Are you saying your company doesn't report CEO pay as required by law for publicly held corporations?
http://www.sec.gov/answers/execomp.htm

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@parados,

What a jerk you are !

I pointed out above very clearly that a very large fraction of those who are employed in this country work for privately held companies which have no requirement to report this data to anyone, and that, based on my own observations, the salary ratios among these companies are on average a good deal lower than those for the generally fewer, but much larger publicly traded conpanies. (Not to mention that the ratios published by EPI and other self-serving propaganda organizations are highly manipulated and misrepresent the real facts.

I also noted the self serving manipulation of just what constitutes "average workers" or "workers" in these ratios. Most don't include all, and many not even a majority. of their employees in these categories.

Our company is privately held. The majority stockholder is an ESOP that includes all employees. I and a few other managers collectively own about 35% of it. We have about 500 employees and their median salary is about $66,000: the average is closer to $61,000. At the bottom of the scale we have 7 entry level employees including 6 field office receptionists who earn an average of $24,000, and based on them the CEO's salary is about 23 times theirs: based on the company average salary the ratio is less than nine. This is typical of a very large number of companies across the country about our size, and together we employ most of the workers.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

I blame a lot of this lopsided pay scale on the board of directors who approve these unequal pay scales for CEO's and officers. By their actions, they have hurt our economy in ways that can't be measured, because of the multitude of variables at play in the world economies. All I can assume is that our economy would have been much stronger if the wealth was shared with their workers.

It's clear you have never served as a Director of a corporation.

The system you advocate is contrary to human nature, and it hasn't worked very well in the countries that have tried it. There's lots of data out there supporting this - that is if you care to consider facts and history instead of the prefabricated opinions you consume so avidly.

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@georgeob1,

You,

Quote:

The system you advocate is contrary to human nature, and it hasn't worked very well in the countries that have tried it. There's lots of data out there supporting this - that is if you care to consider facts and history instead of the prefabricated opinions you consume so avidly.

No, I have never served on a corporate board of directors, but have served on nonprofit organization boards (2). We made decisions on pay and benefits for all the staff. We have "never" approved lopsided pay scales for Executive Directors - NEVER - like the pay scale differences in commerce in the US.

It's not about "human nature," but of equality and fairness. We live in different worlds where I view people who work to produce the products and services (and who make companies successful) are as valuable as the honchos who run it.

It seems most other developed economies understand this simple tenet.

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@cicerone imposter,

That's why they call them non-profits !

We do live in different worlds. it's just that yours is imaginary.

Human nature doesn't seek equality. It doesn't take much knowledge of human history to know that.

Definitions of fair vary a great deal. Obama thinks it''s fair to forcibly take increasingly large shares ot the earnings of some to reward others. Many don't agree. Others believe fair is giving everyone an equal opportunity to succeed on their own merits and contributions. There is no general agreement on the definition.

Most socialist societies have ended up as impoverished tyrannies which punished everyone equally. Except those who disagreed - they were killed.

The poor in China are now a lot less poor than when they were ruled by socialism. They are a lot more free as well.

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@georgeob1,

Quote:

This is typical of a very large number of companies across the country about our size, and together we employ most of the workers.

Really? Do you have anything to back that up? I would love to see your study that shows that to be true.

By the way:
Do you not file federal income taxes? Because that would be required for the figures using the income taxes to be wrong.

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@georgeob1,

We're not talking about equality for all humans; we're talking about US pay scales and benefits between the head honchos and their workers.

People who work in nonprofits are not in it for the money; they are dedicated to caring for other people.

I worked in management, Audit Manager, for Florsheim Shoe Company, and was paid very well. I was also a controller for a couple of small companies.

I did budgets for the retail division at Florsheim, and as controller for the small companies I worked for, made recommendations to the board of directors for pay scales and benefits for "all" employees. The boards usually accepted my recommendations. I never recommended loposided pay scales and benefits found in commerce today.

It seems from Cyclos article that most developed countries agree with my kind of reasonable pay scales for the top honchos of companies compared to the worker at the same company. I'll stick with my experience and actual experiences of other developed countries pay scales and benefits to be more level-headed and reasonable.

The only exception I may agree to is the pay of the owner or founder of any company that is successful.

You'll never convince me I'm wrong.

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@parados,

From economic.about.com.

Quote:

Many visitors from abroad are surprised to learn that even today, the U.S. economy is by no means dominated by giant corporations. Fully 99 percent of all independent enterprises in the country employ fewer than 500 people. These small enterprises account for 52 percent of all U.S. workers, according to the U.S. Small Business Administration (SBA). Some 19.6 million Americans work for companies employing fewer than 20 workers, 18.4 million work for firms employing between 20 and 99 workers, and 14.6 million work for firms with 100 to 499 workers. By contrast, 47.7 million Americans work for firms with 500 or more employees.

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Obamanomics is designed to knock the US economy down a few notches, it's working, but we have not hit bottom yet.

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@H2O MAN,

stock market almost as high as when Bush took office and began the 8 year tanknomics.

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@farmerman,

Despite Obama's efforts to kill it.

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@cicerone imposter,

The problem with that ci. is that the 99 percent of all independent enterprises in the country which employ fewer than 500 people are waiting upon, in the sense of a restaurant waiter, the decisions in what might be called the "key industries" which supply their energy, credit and other resources at the price they deem fit and which set the pace regarding such things as pay and conditions. They stopped smoking in the workplace first. They have first choice in graduate recruitment drives.

They dominate everything. They are the almost invisible tail that wags the dog. And business profit is all they are interested in because that is the test they are judged by both by themselves and by the public who clamour for a high return on their savings.

They still allow you to fart in your own time though.

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@farmerman,

watersquirt never provides any useful information; just bull **** that he learned from FOX News. He lives in another galaxy where everything Obama is negative - without understanding real world experience. My funds are up 3.5% for the first half of January. squirt's brain has already drowned in Fox News.

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@cicerone imposter,

And that says nothing about what workers are paid.

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@parados,

That's not what watersquirt is ignorant about - Obama. The GOP has stopped any legislation that would have helped small businesses.

http://politic365.com/2010/08/03/senate-gop-blocks-help-to-small-businesses/

and

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-arensmeyer/blocking-small-biz-bill_b_1672583.html

There's no cure for ......

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@cicerone imposter,

Have you not noticed ci. that "ignorant" and "ignore" are similar words?

You have ignored my post you ignorer of anything you can't answer.

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@spendius,

Are you suggesting the ignorant be ignored?

I can't ignore you and ci because you provide so many laughs...

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@parados,

parados wrote:

Do you not file federal income taxes? Because that would be required for the figures using the income taxes to be wrong.

The Federal Income tax return requirements do not incliude identification of the returns of either CEOs or those who might be classified as "workers" by some union financed propaganda factory.

Parados is certainly WEFT.

(wrong every ******* time)

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@H2O MAN,

What else is there to do on a dark, cold winter's day with nothing but weeping on the news?

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Where is the US economy headed?

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