Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Neither NASA nor CRU are collection our weather data (primarily) here.
Particularly I don't believe that they make the weather.

There are only three official organism responsible for world surface temperature collecting: NASA-GISS, Hadley Centre and CRU.
They take local temperatures from national weather stations, massage them to give a world mean temperature which is officially communicated to the press, governement, UN agencies...
The way they do that is far from transparent and far from honest when you see all the "correction" (guess in which way) they have done to the data lately (see my previous link to climateaudit.org). This is not a hollow accusation, this is a documented demontration of scientific frauds. For example, the very influential world mean temperature collected by Jones is not public, nor the way he makes Urban Heat Islands correction, nor the way he decides to retain or reject a particular station ("quality" control).

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The graphics I posted aren't related to such.

At least, the source doesn't say so.

Besides, the don't show world temperatures but those in Europe.
(To be found online as well as more on the European Environment Agency website)

miniTAX wrote:

There are only three official organism responsible for world surface temperature collecting: NASA-GISS, Hadley Centre and CRU.

In the 70's our boat was equipped (various, here not to be discussed reasons) with some additional scientic-meteroligic apparata.
Since I had undertaken some courses in meterology (and passed), we became a voluntary weather station for National Meteorological Service, Deutscher Wetterdienst (DWD), and thus twice the offical weather ship (during replacements) for "India" and "Mike".

Be assured that I know who collects data. (.... and why Laughing

[this more a remark for George Laughing

]

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It's really not so much related to the topic, but because I now rember the situation very vividly ...

Those weather data I took had to be transferred to punched tape (took me ages the first time to get it done correctly).

However, this had to be done a second time, with a couple of more, different data added. Data, I had to make ... completely.
On paper.
As punched tape, it became "Nato secret".
And only our captain (and the first officer as deputy captain) had that security clearance.
Within less than 48 hours, I got it as well. (The second reason for that was: I was literally the only person who could handle a certain photographic equipment in the squadron ... the results of that were NATO secret as well.)

In the retroperspective a funny time ...

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a very interesting article from NASA trying to give a better understanding of temperatures in antarctica .
not being a scientist , i don't think i comment much on it - simply food for thought .
the illustrations provide a good glimpse "at the other end of the world" .
hbg

Quote:

see full article and illustartions :
NASA - ANTARCTIC TEMPERATURES

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Interesting picture with that article (thanks, hamburger):

http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Newsroom/NewImages/Images/antarctic_temps.AVH1982-2004.jpg

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old europe :
i have to admit , i'm a sucker for pictures .
even reading a history book - right now : david starkey " monarchy - from the middle ages to modernity" as seen on channel four - , i like to have some pictures for visual illustration .
hbg

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I recall from highschool chemistry class that freezing water releases heat while melting ice absorbs heat and thus cools the environment around it. So couldn't it follow that a colder Anarctica, i.e. freezing water/ice, would temporarily warm the perimeter a bit? Or would it all get colder simultaneously, in which case where is the heat going?

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miniTAX wrote:

parados wrote:
Why was the high month in Sept in 2005?
Anyone want to bet that Gore and his family weren't there in August-Sept of 2005? A quick google search shows Gore was in New Orleans aiding victims of Katrina and then on the west coast for speaking engagements in early Sept. Why don't you guys complain that Gore wasted energy by paying to fly a bunch of Katrina victims to Tennessee.

Oh poor Gore. He was far away from home helping News Orleans BEFORE it was struck by Katrina which made his macmansion consume only 19x the american household average instead of 20x. Lets drop a tear

It seems that Aug-September now occurs before Aug 29th in miniTAX's world. The last time I checked my calender Mini September 2 is NOT after the end of September. Nor is Sept 4th or 7th.

Don't let stupidity get in the way of your tears there.

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

Data, I had to make ... completely.

Walter - do you mean you fabricated the data... made it up? I'm surprised... but possibly just confused. Very Happy

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I wizld never do that, but had you ever mered at full night, during an icy winter storm, the air temparatures with three different methods, the water temperatires in five different depths ... .?

No, what I wanted to say is that it was just me who had to do all that by hand, from taking the various measurements up to noting and coding the data. And the normal navigation as well. (I onlay was a conscript in those days and a lower ranked reserve officer later.)

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georgeob1 wrote:

I don't know if what we view as the universe is finite or not. I can accept that it can scientifically be shown to be so. But no science here can yet say what lies beyond what we call the universe either. We know only an immeasurably tiny amount of all there is to know.

I'm not sure if you're implying this, but the finiteness of spacetime does not necessarily mean that there is a beyond. Since it's hard to imagine the curvation of the four-dimensional spacetime we live in, here is a three-dimensional analogy. The question, "if spacetime is finite, what lies beyond?", is much like a four-dimensional version of asking, "if the surface of the Earth is finite, what lies beyond its edge?". And the question, "what happened before the Big Bang?", is much like a four-dimensional version of asking "what lies north of the North Pole?"

I don't know if that's what you had in mind with "what lies beyond what we call the universe". But if it was, you probably have mistaken notions of spacetime geometry (as we all do unless we pay a hell of a lot of attention).

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Where did you find that quote? I don't think it was recent.

I'm not sure of the context in which it was written, & ordinarily wouldn't use a phrase "beyond the universe" with respect to space or time. I eitther misspoke or perhaps was referring to something 'beyond the concept of the universe' as science knows it.

Even simple thermodynamics can demonstrate that the universe is not infinite in space time. The contemporary physics model as you know is clearly bounded, and, except for the initial singularity, inflation, dark matter, & black holes, reasonably comprehensible to physicists.

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old europe wrote:

Interesting picture with that article (thanks, hamburger):

ooooooo...that's so pretty

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But really very cold just now

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georgeob1 wrote:

Where did you find that quote? I don't think it was recent.

That was a quote from Foxfyre, lifted from this post of yours. I removed what you wrote, then removed Foxfyre's name instead of yours. Sorry.

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

But really very cold just now

´
Indeed it is. At least 80°F of global warming will be necessary to make it suitable for human settlement. Unfortunately the anti-global warming crowd will obstruct every effort to make Antarctica's climate safe.

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Foxfyre wrote:

I recall from highschool chemistry class that freezing water releases heat while melting ice absorbs heat and thus cools the environment around it. So couldn't it follow that a colder Anarctica, i.e. freezing water/ice, would temporarily warm the perimeter a bit? Or would it all get colder simultaneously, in which case where is the heat going?

Sorry fox but the last time I was in freezing arctic water, my perimeter was not warmed one bit. (Its true that heat can be generated or absorbed when a substance changes state. But heat and temperature are not the same as you know or would do if you had being paying attention all those years ago :wink: )

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hamburger wrote:

old europe :
i have to admit , i'm a sucker for pictures .
even reading a history book - right now : david starkey " monarchy - from the middle ages to modernity" as seen on channel four - , i like to have some pictures for visual illustration .
hbg

hbg, a visual illustration of Global Warming with another perspective:

http://skyfall.free.fr/images/Global+Warming+Perspective.jpg

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yes even a hockey stick looks merely slightly bent when you stretch it enough...which distortion by minitax is tantamount to doing the same with the truth.

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I've just looked at the falsified officially data: miniTAX, how did you manage that the most coldest period ever in Le Bourget (1879/80) didn't get in your excellent graphics? And what about 1949?

I'm sure, you're working differently in your job.

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Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

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