4
   

What, exactly, is the rationale for establishing "sanctuary cities?"

 
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 12:23 pm
@layman,
Simple yes or no question Layman (to help with my reading comprehension).

Do you believe that there is a sinister plot, supported by the majority of Mexican-Americans, to separate the Southwest US into a new nation, called Atzlan that will exclude other ethnic groups?

This is a yes or no question about your beliefs expressed on this thread... please answer first with a "Yes" or a "No" before you explain anything.
Baldimo
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 12:30 pm
@maxdancona,
I'm wondering how all this relates to Sanctuary cities and modern day illegal immigration?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 12:32 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Simple yes or no question Layman (to help with my reading comprehension).

Do you believe that there is a sinister plot, supported by the majority of Mexican-Americans, to separate the Southwest US into a new nation, called Atzlan that will exclude other ethnic groups?

This is a yes or no question about your beliefs expressed on this thread... please answer first with a "Yes" or a "No" before you explain anything.



You were the one who brought up the conspiracy theory about Atzlan. You must have thought it was important.

But if you want to back down... I won't push it.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 12:33 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo wrote:

I'm wondering how all this relates to Sanctuary cities and modern day illegal immigration?


That would be a question for Layman. It is his thread, and he brought up the topic of the Aztlan conspiracy theory.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 12:33 pm
Quote:
If California has the power to defy immigration laws, could it secede as well?

It’s time to call [California’s newly-minted status as a sanctuary state for illegal aliens] what it truly is: an act of rebellion by a state against the authority of the federal government that will endanger the lives of law enforcement officials and California residents.

SB 54, the landmark bill which was passed last October and went into effect this month, bans local officials from asking about a person’s immigration status. The immediate result of SB 54 is a growing state of hostility between California and the federal government.

Today in the state there is a quixotic but ambitious movement to have California secede from the union. By committing a brazen act of defiance against federal law, California’s elected leaders have declared that e pluribus unum no longer applies on the left coast.


http://thehill.com/opinion/immigration/367371-if-california-has-the-power-to-defy-immigration-laws-could-it-secede-as
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 12:41 pm
@maxdancona,
Simple answer: No.

Way back I made a prediction about the ultimate fate of the Southwestern U. S. (within 50 years). That prediction did not depend on what the "majority's" intentions are at this particular moment.

Unless some drastic policy changes are made (and even then....), I stand by the prediction. The handwriting is on the wall.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 01:01 pm
Quote:
Sen. Ted Kennedy when advocating for the 1965 law that dramatically changed the structure of U.S. immigration policy said:

"The bill will not flood our cities with immigrants,” Kennedy said during debate on the Senate floor at the time. “It will not relax the standards of admission. It will not cause American workers to lose their jobs.”

History has rendered a verdict on all three of Kennedy’s assurances: Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Brown will probably be gone before the true impact of SB 54 is realized. He won’t have to pay for his mistake; the people of California will.


http://thehill.com/opinion/immigration/367371-if-california-has-the-power-to-defy-immigration-laws-could-it-secede-as
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 01:08 pm
I'm done with this thread.

0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 01:48 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo, I am not sure if you are interested in a deeper discussion other than political talking points. If you want to know why American cities are supporting, and defending, sanctuary policies.... I am the one to ask.

Mayors of Los Angeles, or Boston, or New York, or Chicago not only support Sanctuary policies... they campaign on them. This is because we American voters want these policies. There are lots of reasons we want these policies... I am the person who can explain them from personal perspective; we want our police to serve the community rather than clamp down on it, we like our neighbors (including the "illegal" ones), and we care about diversity.

These are personal reasons, but we vote on them. When there is a public meeting about immigration, police chiefs give a promise to focus on local crime and not to cooperate with ICE except when absolutely necessary. There are often a couple people talking about the threat of "illegals"... but they always a small group and we generally tolerate them with a smattering of jeers and boos.

When GOP pundits or politicians start talking about cracking down on American cities, they forget that these are American voters they are targeting.

There is an election coming up...

If anyone wants to talk about the opinions, beliefs and feeling of the tens of millions of American voters who support sanctuary policies... I am the one to speak with.

If you want right wing conspiracy theories and talking points cut and pasted from ideological websites, Layman has you covered.
layman
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 04:50 pm
@maxdancona,
As always, you miss the basic point, eh, Max?

Try this: Let's say a teenager hops off a freight in your town. He has MS13 tats all over his face, but he hasn't done anything wrong. He's an illegal immigrant, but you'll never know that, because you refuse to even ask him for his papers. You don't care about that.

What do you do with this kid? Just let him wander around until he finds someplace to sleep? Take him home with you and put him in your spare bedroom? Nothing? What?

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQMZNVstPX5CNW5Kc746uR7F3YeyVKAbZwstiovNDQ0qPrKhv4IFA
layman
 
  0  
Reply Wed 31 Jan, 2018 05:41 pm
@layman,
I'm gunna speculate that, being the generous, empathetic person that you are, that you will semi-adopt the kid. Take him home, feed him, buy him some clothes and personal items, and tell him he's welcome to stay with you as long as he likes.

Once he has your address, he asks if you one of his homeless friends from San Salvador can come stay too. You don't ask anything about who his friend is, of course. You don't want or need to know anything like that. You know all you need to know already: He needs a home. So you say "Sure." In a couple of weeks this guy shows up at your door:

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRrKUvsCU6LSU7f4kAWzgFzWicIyD_PoGJwj2nlkaB2snJdjmOPKQ

Then, together, they ask if a couple more of their friends in need can come stay with you too.

Would you ever say "no?"
layman
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Feb, 2018 06:14 pm
@layman,
Quote:
Nearly 200 illegal immigrants found in just three January smuggling busts

http://a57.foxnews.com/images.foxnews.com/content/fox-news/us/2018/02/01/nearly-200-illegal-immigrants-found-in-just-three-january-smuggling-busts/_jcr_content/par/featured_image/media-0.img.jpg/1862/1048/1517504640328.jpg?ve=1&tl=1

Nearly 200 people from Mexico and Central America were stuffed inside large trucks and caught trying to enter the United States illegally during in just nine days in January. Officials in southern California said 77 people, including 5 children, were found near the Mexico border Monday packed inside a sweltering truck that had been painted to resemble a UPS truck.

The San Diego Union-Tribune reported a U.S. border patrol agent in Boulevard, Calif., noticed the truck was riding low and “could smell body odor mixed with a distinct type of pungent soap which is commonly used in Mexico.”

Inside the truck's cargo area, officials found people sweating and standing shoulder-to-shoulder.

A similar scene greeted authorities last week in Laredo, Texas, where border patrol agents found 76 immigrants, including 13 children, from Mexico, Honduras, El Salvador and Guatemala lying on the floor or crouching against the walls of a tractor-trailer rig.


Detected by smell, eh?

Looks like you lost some dinner guests, eh, Max? I'm sure that you would have instantly created jobs for all these criminals and immediately have made productive, loyal people out of them if not for that damn ICE, eh?

0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Feb, 2018 09:50 pm
@maxdancona,
Will it ever dawn on you, Max, I wonder, that whatever the problems you want to "fix" may be:

1. Your "solution" is grossly inadequate,
2. Your "solution" is criminal, and that
3. If you want to invest energy into trying to "change the law," you're only defeating your own goals by devoting it to the passage of sanctuary laws. Try lobbying your representatives to vote for changing U. S. immigration law into a code that reflects a completely "open borders" policy, if that's what you're seeking. The simplest way to do that would be to just repeal ALL immigration law, I suppose.

Granted, that would be a waste of time too, but at least you could stay out of jail, know what I'm sayin?
layman
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Feb, 2018 10:09 pm
@layman,
Word on the street is that the DOJ is working on filing the most massive indictments (for conspiracy to encourage illegal aliens to enter, or stay in, the U.S. in violation of Section 1324) in history.

Word is that hundreds of thousands (in some states many millions) of people in every sanctuary city/state will be named as co-conspirators and would include anyone who has every lobbied or voted for "sanctuary" laws to be passed in their jurisdiction. There will also be many others, of course.

Huge prosecutions like this take a lot of time to investigate and prepare, of course, but the DOJ had been working on this project 24/7 ever since Sessions was confirmed as the U. S. Attorney General. Just have patience, they say.

The penalties sought will vary with the degree of activity taken to advance the criminal purpose and end sought. But the expectation is that enough will have to forfeit all their property to fund the employment of thousands more immigration judges, border patrol agents, etc. In due time, the whole sorry criminal existence of illegal aliens entering and staying in this country will be solved once and for all. The "final solution," ya might say.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  3  
Reply Fri 2 Feb, 2018 02:24 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

The economic benefit of "illegal immigrants" in the US was made clear in several states, including Georgia and Arizona that suffered economic damage when then cracked down on them. Georgia farms lost millions of dollars because they couldn't find the workers and crops rotted. But I don't think that is important.

Let's be honest about the real debate here... The real issue is whether the US has a homogeneous culture dominated by European Protestant influences, or whether the US is a multi-cultural democracy.

That is the real philosophical divide. The rest is just politics.



Actually, I think the main crux of the debate here is that the right thinks that the left are given an advantage in voting booths by amnesty programs.

They think 1.8MM dreamers becoming citizens means 1.8MM democratic voters and that's the primary reason they're against it. They won't say that usually, but if these people were voting republican they wouldn't be as concerned (but maybe the democrats would be...probably).
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Fri 2 Feb, 2018 06:43 am
Quote:
ICE raid hits 77 businesses in Northern California

Federal immigration agents raided 77 businesses in Northern California this week, demanding proof that their employees are legally allowed to work in the United States, officials said Thursday.

It was believed to be the largest such localized sweep of workplaces by the Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency since President Trump took office. ICE agents swept into nearly 100 7-Eleven stores nationwide and arrested 21 suspected undocumented immigrants.

The businesses were served notices of inspection and given three working days to comply. Experts were struck by the scale of the operation.

“Serving 77 notices of inspection on different employers in the last three days within a single area of responsibility, in this case, San Francisco, appears unprecedented,” said Angelo Paparelli, an immigration attorney in Los Angeles with the firm Seyfarth Shaw LLP.

Thomas Homan, the agency’s acting director, has called for a “400 percent increase” in such workplace operations.


http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/ICE-workplace-sweep-hits-Northern-California-12544863.php

Good work, Moonbeam. If these businesses comply with federal law, you will prosecute them under State law. If they don't comply, their owners/managers will be in Leavenworth. Just one more reason for businesses to get the hell out of California. Not a good trend for a bankrupt State, eh?
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Fri 2 Feb, 2018 07:34 am
The California Business Journal wrote:
Even the breathtaking beaches, the dazzling mountains and national parks, the beautiful hot desert, the Silicon Valley influence — and the most gorgeous weather in the world — isn’t even enough to keep businesses from fleeing the Golden State of California because of high taxes.

So, California’s so-called “hostile business environment” continues to drive thousands of companies away. "California is an inhospitable place plagued by over-regulation, mindless bureaucracy, high taxes and endless lawsuits,” — in addition to the nation’s highest income-tax rate and highest minimum wage.”

California’s elected officials do not appear to care too much about businesses leaving the state. Yet the problem is real.

The full extent of the damage these regulations have done to California’s economy is impossible to calculate, but Vranich highlights several key areas of impact. Besides the job losses, he found evidence of at least $62 billion in capital that was diverted to other locations.

Unfortunately for the companies still left in California, their future in the Golden State is far from bright, according to Vranich, who points out that state officials are currently considering enacting still more taxes and fees on businesses in 2016 and 2017, which would trigger the worst demands on private-sector finances ever organized by the state’s politicians.”


http://www.calbizjournal.com/whybusinessesleavecalifornia/

Why are taxes so high in California and why is the State nonetheless insolvent? Well, one big reason is that they have to leech off of productive American citizens in order to provide food, shelter, and pocket money for the millions of impoverished Mexican citizens who have illegally parked their asses there, ya know?

Word is that California will exploit the federal tax cuts by adding the amount saved by those reduced taxes (and more) to the State taxes imposed on their hapless residents. With a State government that bad, I imagine that submitting to the governance of Mexico would be a preferable alternative for most citizens, eh?
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Sat 3 Feb, 2018 11:47 pm
HEY!
Look at me!
I give sanctuary to illegal aliens!
Ya hear me, Trump?
What the **** ya gunna do about it, punk?
**** you!

Quote:
TRUMP ADMINISTRATION WANTS TO ARREST MAYORS OF 'SANCTUARY CITIES

The Department of Justice is considering subjecting state and local officials to criminal charges if they implement or enforce so-called sanctuary policies that bar jurisdictions from cooperating with immigration authorities.

Director of Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Thomas Homan, said California would feel the wrath of his agency because of its decision to become a sanctuary state.

Homan also called for local and state elected officials to be charged with federal crimes for adhering to sanctuary policies.

Senator Kamala Harris, a Democrat from California, who grilled Nielsen on the issue, "was deeply disturbed to hear that this Administration is actively looking for ways to prosecute California elected officials.


http://www.newsweek.com/trump-administration-wants-arrest-mayors-sanctuary-cities-783010

Just for that, Kamala, you're gunna be next in line, after Moonbeam.

Ya seen this Homan perv? He aint playin!
layman
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Feb, 2018 12:16 am
@layman,
Actually, Homan doesn't need to bother with Harris. Sensible citizens with pitchforks will handle her, eh?

0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Sun 4 Feb, 2018 07:48 am
In fairness to Harris, she does have one redeeming quality. She's kinda HOT, ya know!? Wrinkled-ass forehead and all. I bet she gives some mean head, know what I'm sayin?
 

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