2
   

Protecting my daughter from feminism.

 
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 08:54 am
@neptuneblue,
Quote:
However, I do see a disconnect of how the sole responsibility of safety is taught to them. Again, the burden is on a woman to be always be alert to the possibility of danger whereas men don't have to be quite as diligent.


I don't think this makes sense.

We are living in a time that is remarkably safe, particularly for White middle class women and men. My daughter takes advantage of this, she has been riding public transportation alone since she was 12. She is a city girl who likes science fiction conventions... she does just fine by herself in these environment.

The biggest risk to my daughter in the city is being hit (and possibly killed) by a car. I teach her to be smart. She is responsible for looking both ways before she crosses the street, following the rules... and getting off that stupid smartphone (this is the biggest problem). Sure, when she drives, I will also teach her to watch out for pedestrians, but that goes without saying.

She is responsible for her own safety. Yes, her being distracted by looking at her smart phone while walking across the street doesn't give a driver the right to hit her. I still teach her to put her cell phone away while she is walking.

The risk of being her being hit by a car is far greater than her risk of being raped. I don't want my daughter to go through life afraid.
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 02:33 pm
@maxdancona,
I don't want anyone's daughter to be afraid either. I want them safe. I want them to be prepared. I want them to understand there is danger out there and to minimize the risk. I want them to know what to do if or when tragedy strikes.

I want these things for every single person on this planet.

If you don't want to teach your child feminism, fine. It's your kid, do what you think is the right thing for her.

I taught my daughter to be aware of her surroundings. I taught her not to place herself in potentially dangerous situations or with people she doesn't know. I taught her not to get into a car with people who have been drinking.

I taught these things for her knowing it wouldn't make a hill of beans to her the moment her boss asks her to do something sexual in order to keep her job. Or when she walks down the street and gets asked to show her breasts. Or be told she's got a nice ass. Or labeled a prude because she won't kiss on the first date.

For your own personal knowledge, ask the women you associate with if they've ever experienced some form of sexual bias.

You make an argument about how feminism has some bad ideologies. I can't help but wonder how is wanting to change the environment we live in for a better, equality driven life be a bad ideology.

Hint: It's not.

MaleChauvinist
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 02:52 pm
@maxdancona,
I find this forum difficult to navigate. I wrote a post for another online forum about political correctness and feminism as a way to give the feminists some food for thought and to knock the out of lock step.

I will respond to your post.

Women are at greater risk for harm than men and they are fearful in situation where a man may not be fearful. This is evolutionary and hormonal. Feminists can't accept that and they can't accept the fact that a man can easily over power them. They won't accept the fact and reality to that a man will instinctively come to there aid like we would for our mother or sister if they were in harm's way.

The make up the BS about the rape culture but they conveniently forget that there is a rape and wife beating culture in the middle east that is protected by Islamic law.

We teach our granddaughter to be cautious and we worry more about her wellbeing than we did for our son who is her father. I believe that men have a moral obligation to be protective of females.

We have a grandson who we have warned about girls. He's in college now. Girls have preyed on him. He's good looking and a sweet kid and girls are drawn to him but if he rejects their advances they call him gay and start the gossip mill. He's a sensitive artist type and he is 100% straight. He has honor and integrity.

IMO the women who become feminists are rarely the picture of mental health overweight and unattractive. They have been spurned by boys and now they hate men.

Male teens are at their horniest and they need to be taught to respect girls but they don't need to learn in from feminists, they need to learn it from their fathers and mothers.

There are double standards and I think there should be some double standard because males and females are different. One thing that comes to mind is a the rash of female teachers have sex with male students. I can see firing them and banning them from teaching but if the teen boys has fun are are not harmed by it I can't see tossing them in prison since there was no victim. Conversely, if it is a male teacher and a female student the law should be involved IMO. Females often can't separate love and lust the way males can but the thing is, male teachers seem to be far less likely than female teachers to have inappropriate relations with their students. I think overall men are slightly more responsible than women.

As far as victimization goes I think it's 50/50. I was abused by my mother... mostly emotionally as was my father and sister. I think my dad and I got it worse because as males we were less likely to show emotion as quickly as a female so Mommie Dearest kept up the abuse longer and harder. Luckily it didn't make me tainted against women in general but women do scare me because I often see them as manipulative and unstable and unpredictable as compared to males. That is often my gut reaction to them.

Girls are getting more violent. I worry about the time when boys get interested in my granddaughter. She's petite and cute and girls will be jealous of her especially the fat ones. I worry more these day about girls harming her than boys.

Teen girls are different today. They still have carte blanche to disrespect boys but I think that they are more predatory than the girls of a generation ago and socially delusional many of them. The new Feminism is probably the cause.

maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 02:54 pm
@neptuneblue,
There are a lot of women who are not feminists (and they will tell you so). A lot of us non-feminists tell our daughters and our sons to not get into a car with people who have been drinking. That isn't what feminism is about.

There is a political ideology, that is called feminism, that is pushing a narrative. This narrative exaggerates risks to women, pushes a set narrow view and attacks people with other viewpoints.

I want to protect my daughter from the political ideology. I want her to feel safe. And I want her to be free to question anything rather than being pushed to accept a narrative without thought.

We can talk about the specifics. I agree with you on some points (i.e. workplace harassment). We disagree about others (whether she should worry at all if other people think she is a prude). But isn't what I am talking about.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 03:07 pm
@MaleChauvinist,
I can't take your post seriously when you are talking about feminists (or any women) being "overweight and unattractive". That is nothing like what I am saying.
0 Replies
 
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 03:14 pm
@maxdancona,
Ok, fine, wearing vagina hats was just plain stupid. Throwing pads in the streets warrants a fine for Public Littering.

But I don't believe feminism exaggerates risks to women. Since you're not a fan of statistics, please, ask a few women if they actually feel as safe as you think they should be. Maybe having a personal view may help you see what I see.

Sure, there are women who view certain tasks belong in the male column and others in the female column. That's ok too. It's their right and privilege. It seems to me that you want me to be shockingly not ok with that. Well, it's all good. Go forth and be "you".

All feminism does is demand (we're not asking any more) is to be treated fairly, equally. How is that narrow minded? And I have yet to attack you, although I've had to retype some lines due to your condescending choice of words.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 06:56 pm
@neptuneblue,
Quote:
All feminism does is demand (we're not asking any more) is to be treated fairly, equally.


This is simply not true. Feminism is a political movement with some demands that have nothing to do with equality and a few demands that directly oppose equality. Let's talk about the issues.

- Father's rights, particularly the idea that fathers are equally important to mothers, is dismissed or attacked by most feminists. Equality means that men gain custody of their children half of the time (or custody would be equally shared). Find me a prominent feminist who supports this rather than explaining this away.

- Abortion rights are not about equality. The sarcastic comments that equate babies to erections are ridiculous when they are taken seriously. I am pro-choice, but I am including this to illustrate that feminism is a political movement.

- Due process is the idea that someone accused should be given every opportunity to defend themselves before they are judged and punished. There were remarkable number of feminists writing about how due process shouldn't apply for one reason or another.

- Gender Stereotypes are often propagated by prominent feminists. Feminists are unwilling to see women portrayed as perpetrators or men as victims even though there are data that show that this happens more than anyone thinks.

The powerful women who have been accused of sexual harassment have been swept under the carpet because they don't match the narrative.

- Politics matter. The majority of feminists are Democrats. There are many women who are Republicans who are not feminists. Feminism has come to represent a strident wing of mostly neo-liberals. In the recent election Hillary was the feminist candidate and people who didn't support her were called "Bernie Bros"; a term that meant misogynist. Of course, a majority of White women voted for Trump.

You might want feminism to be about equality. In practice it is a political ideology that often has nothing to do with equality.
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 07:13 pm
@maxdancona,
Father's Rights- The common custody arrangement is shared, 50/50 Legal and 50/50 physical. At least that's what it is here in Ohio for the past 15 years. Certain cases are litigated on the merits and awarded accordingly.

Abortion Rights - Another Political stance to govern something that doesn't belong to the State. My body, my choice.

Due Process - Absolutely. Unless my Due Process trumps your Due Process.

Gender Stereotypes - Dumb Blondes and Dumb Jocks were stereotypes way before feminism. Serial killers tend to be male. Baby nappers tend to be female.

The powerful men who have been accused of sexual harassment have been swept under the carpet because they don't think they did anything wrong.

Next....



maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 07:17 pm
@neptuneblue,
I am not arguing against you, Neptune. I am arguing against feminism.

If you are willing to stand up against prominent feminists when they push a political ideology, they you would have my support. You are brushing aside these issues, fine. I have no need to argue with your personal beliefs in this thread.
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 07:19 pm
@maxdancona,
Politics matter- Back when Republicans were actually Republicans and Democrats were not Socialists.

You might not want feminism to be about equality. In reality, it is.
0 Replies
 
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 07:56 pm
@maxdancona,
I'm stating Feminist views, not personal beliefs.

Personally, I've stood up against many ideologies, the most prominent one was the Westboro Baptist Church when they came to my hometown to protest the burial of a fallen brethren.

And I will continue to support kneeling during the National Anthem. I fought for the right to do so during my tour with Desert Storm.

You're just one of many that I've encountered who seems to think their way is the man's way.




maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 08:32 pm
@neptuneblue,
Quote:
I'm stating Feminist views, not personal beliefs.


I am wondering if you can point out a difference between your personal views and feminist views. Wink I am defining "feminist views" as the ideological views that are now commonly identified as "feminist" by the people who hold them. These are a fairly narrow set of views.

My personal beliefs are that some of these "feminist views" (as you say) are reasonable. I agree with equal pay, and abortion rights... etc. There are other things with which I strongly disagree; restrictions on the freedom of speech and due process and that women are constantly endangered.

When you give slogans such as "Feminism is about equality", you are asking people to close their minds and stop questioning about whether a given view is actually equality. I see feminism doing exactly this, people are closing their minds and attacking anyone who questions.

Quote:
You're just one of many that I've encountered who seems to think their way is the man's way.


I don't really understand what this means... is it supposed to be an insult based on gender specific terms? If that wasn't what you intended, then please explain what you meant .

If you believe this is really about equality, I don't think my gender should matter.
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 08:46 pm
@maxdancona,
What I see is a man who cherry picks ideals to throw away at a whim. And seek out nothing in return

What I see is you may have misogynistic views hidden in plain sight. You won't concede how you teach one way to your daughter but another way to your sons.

What I see is someone who says they're for equal rights, but, only, not for equal rights. That's for other people, just not you.

I'm questioning how you view how your daughter's world is going to look like, when your inability to see exactly what she faces today and tomorrow.

I'm not asking you to see feminism to close your mind - it already is.

maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 09:01 pm
@neptuneblue,
1. Why does my gender matter?

2. Where did I say anything about teaching my daughter any different than I teach my sons (I said the exact opposite)?

3. Where did I say anything about not being for equal rights?

4. Other than disagreeing with you, what have I done that is "misogynistic"?

5. I am not attacking you personally, nor am I attacking women in general (many of whom agree with me about feminism). I am attacking feminism as a political ideology. Even if I am wrong about feminism, that isn't any reason for you to take that personally. This isn't like I am attacking your religion... is it?

6. And again... why does my gender matter at all in this discussion?
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 09:16 pm
@maxdancona,
You started this "discussion" to point out you feel your daughter needs "protection" from feminism. You continually reject the notion that feminism is about equal rights. You refuse to see any other point of view besides your own.

You ask why your gender matters in these discussions and I continually say, because you don't face the same issues as much as a woman does. However, you don't accept that matters.

You can disagree with me all you want. It's your daughter that pays the price of it all.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 09:22 pm
@neptuneblue,
Yes, I started this discussion to point out I feel my daughter needs protection from feminism. Yes, I reject the notion that feminism is about equal rights.

No I don't refuse to see any other point of view besides my own; I have agreed with you on several points. And, no I don't believe that gender matters... and it doesn't. There are many women who reject feminism. In fact your political affiliation has more to do with your adherence to feminism then your gender; a Democratic man is far more likely to be a feminist than a Republican woman is.

You really think my daughter pays the price of me disagreeing with you? Geez! Wink


neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Mar, 2018 09:26 pm
@maxdancona,
Then go forth and prosper.

0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

My daughter - Discussion by Seed
acting out or real problem - Question by Bl08791
Tween girls - Discussion by sozobe
Nebraska Safe Haven Law - Discussion by Diest TKO
For Parents - Discussion by shawn1989
 
Copyright © 2019 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 09/19/2019 at 11:32:53