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Intelligence reform

 
 
au1929
 
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 11:57 am
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/style/comics/images/Toles/20041124.gif

Three years after 9/11
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 1,474 • Replies: 32
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Steppenwolf
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 12:04 pm
Laughing
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 12:12 pm
I wonder how fast the legislation would be enacted if an amendment for a congressional salary increase was included.
I keep getting the feeling that our representatives are in business for themselves.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 12:26 pm
Goss Told to Build Up Other Staffs, Too

By Walter Pincus and Dana Priest
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, November 24, 2004; Page A04



President Bush has ordered CIA Director Porter J. Goss to increase by 50 percent the number of qualified CIA clandestine operators and intelligence analysts, an ambitious step that would mean the hiring and training of several thousand new personnel in coming years.

Bush also ordered the doubling of CIA officers involved in research and development "to find new ways to bring science to bear in the war on terrorism, the proliferation of WMD [weapons of mass destruction] and against new and emerging threats." In the presidential order, dated Nov. 18 and released by the White House yesterday, Bush also called for a 50 percent increase in the number of CIA officers proficient in "mission-critical languages" such as Arabic.



The fact that there was a deficiency in human intelligence was highlighted almost immediately after 9/11 and a good while before the 9/11 commission. I am relieved to see that someone finallyy told our president.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A8650-2004Nov23.html?referrer=emaillink
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Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 01:32 pm
Why was there a deficiency in human intelligence in the first place? Can anyone tell me that? It happened in the 90's with someone wanting to take a moral stand in intelligence gathering. They didn't want the US working with unsavory people. The only problem is, the unsavory people have all the info. Technology can only get you so far.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 02:15 pm
Baldimo
Stop trying to shift the blame. It has been three years since 9/11 and the need became apparent.
It is about time that some direction has come from the White House. Don't you think?
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FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 02:19 pm
Baldimo wrote:
Why was there a deficiency in human intelligence in the first place? Can anyone tell me that? It happened in the 90's with someone wanting to take a moral stand in intelligence gathering. They didn't want the US working with unsavory people. The only problem is, the unsavory people have all the info. Technology can only get you so far.


Someone took a moral stand in the 90s? Shocked
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 02:23 pm
It is sort of nutty to imply that the WH hasn't responded to 911.


The Patriot Act, Homeland Security, the international coalition that works together pretty effectively against terrorism... England just foiled a British 911 a few days ago.

I think the work that has been done is grossly underappreciated.
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candidone1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 02:24 pm
au1929 wrote:

I keep getting the feeling that our representatives are in business for themselves.


I sincerely hope that this is not a new revelation... :wink:
...but I agree with you.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 02:46 pm
Lash/sofia
President Bush has ordered CIA Director Porter J. Goss to increase by 50 percent the number of qualified CIA clandestine operators and intelligence analysts, an ambitious step that would mean the hiring and training of several thousand new personnel in coming years.

Bush also ordered the doubling of CIA officers involved in research and development "to find new ways to bring science to bear in the war on terrorism, the proliferation of WMD [weapons of mass destruction] and against new and emerging threats." In the presidential order, dated Nov. 18 and released by the White House yesterday, Bush also called for a 50 percent increase in the number of CIA officers proficient in "mission-critical languages" such as Arabic. Note the date. The year is 2004 not 2001.
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Lash
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 02:50 pm
I will admit this one is late, IMO. But, I applaud the previous steps taken.
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Steppenwolf
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 03:13 pm
Baldimo wrote:
Why was there a deficiency in human intelligence in the first place? Can anyone tell me that? It happened in the 90's with someone wanting to take a moral stand in intelligence gathering. They didn't want the US working with unsavory people. The only problem is, the unsavory people have all the info. Technology can only get you so far.


As I understand it, the shift was principally technology based. Some people wrongly thought that advances in surveillance technology could replace on-the-ground intelligence.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 03:23 pm
Steppenwolf

Baldimo is well aware of the reason. That is not the reason for his response. His aim is only to deflect any blame away from his messiah Bush. He studiously avoids the three year gap. Which is the crux of my question.
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candidone1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 03:54 pm
Lash wrote:
It is sort of nutty to imply that the WH hasn't responded to 911.
The Patriot Act, Homeland Security , the international coalition that works together pretty effectively against terrorism... England just foiled a British 911 a few days ago.

I think the work that has been done is grossly underappreciated.


I addressed Homeland Security's shortcomings "Unlimited Enemy" re: Homeland Security Spending ...and I think other reforms can fall as similar prey.
The work done has been grossly underappreciated because the work done has been substandard and grotesquely misdirected at best.
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Lash
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 07:00 pm
It has WORKED.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Nov, 2004 07:30 pm
Yes it has worked. In 1991 George Tenet, a Clnton appointee, was still at CIA and assuring President Bush that all was well. When it turned out all was not well, Tenet left. This is an ENORMOUS agency that had been decimated by budget cuts and an inept leadership for a very long time. There is no way anyone could walk in there and reform it in a matter of weeks or months. So since Tenet left, the administration has been doing their homework. What is wrong with the CIA? What needs to happen to fix it?

From what I hear from the talking heads now, reforms are well underway and have been for some time and they will be sweeping.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Nov, 2004 09:14 am
2 Top Officials Are Reported to Quit C.I.A.

By DOUGLAS JEHL

Published: November 25, 2004

WASHINGTON, Nov. 24 - Two more senior officials of the Central Intelligence Agency's clandestine service are stepping down, intelligence officials said Wednesday, in the latest sign of upheaval in the agency under its new chief, Porter J. Goss.

As the chiefs of the Europe and Far East divisions, the two officials have headed spying operations in some of the most important regions of the world and were among a group known as the barons in the highest level of clandestine service, the Directorate of Operations.

The directorate has been the main target of an overhaul effort by Mr. Goss and his staff. Its chief, Stephen R. Kappes, and his deputy resigned this month after a dispute with the new management team.

An intelligence official said that the two division chiefs were retiring from the agency and that there would be no public announcement. Neither could be named, the official said, because they are working under cover.

A former intelligence official described the two as "very senior guys" who were stepping down because they did not feel comfortable with new management.

In a memorandum to agency employees last week, Mr. Goss warned that more personnel changes were coming as part of what he described as an effort to rebuild the ability of the agency to perform its core mission of stealing secrets.

Last week, President Bush directed Mr. Goss to draw up detailed plans in 90 days for a major overhaul of the agency, to address shortcomings that have become evident with intelligence failures related to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks and prewar assessments of Iraq.

The directive included a call for 50 percent increases in crucial operations and analytical personnel, a goal that the agency had already set in a five-year strategic plan drafted in December under George J. Tenet, the previous director of central intelligence. Many of the agency's top officials, including John E. McLaughlin, the deputy director, and A. B. Krongard, the No. 3 official, have stepped down or announced plans to do so since Mr. Goss took office in September. The upheaval has been most extensive in the operations directorate, made up of spies and spymasters who have made careers out of stealing secrets.

The clandestine service is a proud closed fraternity and one that sees itself as fiercely loyal and not risk-averse. It is also a group that has recoiled in recent weeks at the criticisms leveled at the agency, including comments this month from Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, who accused the agency of acting "almost as a rogue" institution.

Mr. Goss is a former spy and a member of the clandestine service who worked in Latin America in the 60's. More recently, he was a Republican congressman and the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, and he has made plain his view that the current crop of case officers is not bold enough.

What is playing out in the agency headquarters is no less than a clash of cultures on a scale not seen there. since the Carter administration, when Stansfield Turner, a retired admiral, took a half-dozen Navy officers with him to the agency in 1977.

Under Mr. Goss, it is a cadre of former House Republican aides, not Navy officers, who dominate the new management team. This month, they have toppled Mr. Kappes and his deputy, Michael Sulick, in a way that former intelligence officials say has shown little regard for the tradition-bound clandestine service which has always prized rank, experience and lines of authority.

"The C.I.A. is a line organization like the military," said Christopher Mellon, a former intelligence official at the Defense Department and the Senate Intelligence Committee. "When staff guys insert themselves, that causes confusion and discontent."

Under Mr. Goss, the extent of the rebellion in the ranks is not clear. Much of the anger has been focused on a former Congressional aide, Patrick Murray, the chief of staff, who is said to have raised the hackles of some station chiefs around the world. The atmosphere has so deteriorated in the agency that some career officers have begun using derogatory nicknames for Mr. Murray and his colleagues, former intelligence officials said.

Contiued
Can the CIA afford to lose it's most seasoned supervision. Politics seems
to have reared it's ugly head.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Nov, 2004 09:43 am
Quote:
Can the CIA afford to lose it's most seasoned supervision. Politics seems to have reared it's ugly head.


Well you (collective you/us) can't have it both ways. If the CIA wasn't getting the job done, changes needed to be made. The 9/11 Commission was pretty blunt that this was the case. If the problems are systemic/policy/structure, you change the system/policy/structure. If the problems are with personnel, you change the personnel. If the personnel won't cooperate with needed systemic changes, you change the personnel too. And then you wait for the whiners to start complaining that its all political.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Nov, 2004 09:50 am
Foxy
And the way to fix it is to uproot all of the top level and most experienced and knowlegable leadership and replace it with political hacks.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Nov, 2004 09:55 am
You don't know that's what is happening do you Au? They didn't even name the people. Apparently the people there haven't been getting the job done. It's way premature to say that the people coming in won't do a better job.

Having been in a position of having to reform a fairly large agency that was struggling, I know how difficult it can be and how ruthless the top person can be perceived to be who has to make necessary decisions. Tenure doesn't mean a thing if the person is incompetent or out of step with the agency goals.
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