8
   

If only his name was Pete Williams instead of Abdul Artan, eh?

 
 
perennialloner
 
  2  
Reply Fri 9 Dec, 2016 08:08 pm
@layman,
I don't feel sorry for the Muslim. As I said before, I know that Islamic terrorism is a problem. I simply seriously question the effectiveness of banning Muslims, as well as the effectiveness of getting non-Muslims to hate Islam, which in turn will make them hate Muslims. I truly think it is bad for everyone.

I had a teacher at the American high school I attended, I was 14 at the time, who told me that the reason a lot of atheists don't criticize Islam like they do Christianity is because of their fear of retaliation by Muslims. What he said really surprised me as someone who mostly had Muslim friends, because a lot of what my friends did in their free time with each other was debate about their religion. And yet, his statement obviously suggested that Muslims would punish him for daring to pick apart their religion, unlike Christians.

People have this impression that Islam cannot tolerate criticism. I understand why, but I think people severely underestimate the ability of Muslims to thoughtfully consider and listen to critique on Islam if it were to be handled in a thoughtful way. Few people have taken the time to learn about the religion, yourself included, me too even though I've lived among Muslims, in a thoughtful way. Given this, why would Muslims bother to listen to people who attack the religion based on all the bad things they have heard about it and think Islam calls for death upon all nonbelievers.

Christians don't engage in one-sided debates either.

Progress cannot happen if people fear and hate each other. There are people on both sides who want progress and are willing to take steps to make it. We have to get those people talking together. I don't know how to do that, but that's what I think will bring about social change.

I understand your viewpoint. Honestly, I do. I just disagree.
layman
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 9 Dec, 2016 08:20 pm
@perennialloner,
perennialloner wrote:

We have to get those people talking together. I don't know how to do that, but that's what I think will bring about social change.


Then you should agree with the minority of muslims who support Trump. One of the biggest obstacles to discussion is the left's insistence on refusing to acknowledge the problem, and its insistence on shutting down meaningful discourse by shouting "islamophobia" at anyone who even mentions the problem. You can never "solve" a problem by pretending it doesn't exist, or by eliminating the discussion of it in the name of "political correctness." The muslims I"m talking about see this. Apparently you don't.
0 Replies
 
NSFW (view)
layman
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 12:47 am
@layman,
"Her crime? Nothing proven, but she was suspected of burning a copy of the Koran."

Here in America, the muslims are free to publicly burn the Bible, the American Flag, or any other damn thing they want to burn, so long as they are not endangering others.

They LOVE that. But God help the poor soul who ventures into the heart of the muslim ghetto in Dearborn, and burns a copy of the Koran.

They have been successful in demanding that US Universities prohibit the display of the American flag on campus, because it "offends" muslims. I blame the cheese-eating administrators at those colleges even more than the ignorant, self-aggrandizing muslims for that kinda crap.
Frugal1
 
  -3  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 08:30 am
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzSUa5dXgAACxp-.jpg:large
0 Replies
 
TomTomBinks
 
  3  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 09:12 am
@layman,
Quote:
They have been successful in demanding that US Universities prohibit the display of the American flag on campus, because it "offends" muslims.

Is that the University of Michigan? They should be shamed into putting the flag back!

Quote:
Her crime? Nothing proven, but she was suspected of burning a copy of the Koran."

I read of situations where someone is killed for personal reasons and then the explanation given to authorities later was that they had burned a Koran, so they avoid prosecution.
Frugal1
 
  -3  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 09:41 am
Keith Ellison bolts NYT Interview to Avoid Questions about ties to Nation of Islam

http://truthfeed.com/keith-ellison-bolts-nyt-interview-to-avoid-questions-about-ties-to-nation-of-islam/40762/
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  0  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 01:43 pm
@TomTomBinks,
TomTomBinks wrote:

I read of situations where someone is killed for personal reasons and then the explanation given to authorities later was that they had burned a Koran, so they avoid prosecution.


Yeah, it's a license to kill for these fanatics. But even that's putting it to mildly. It is a COMMAND to kill, coming straight from God.

Did you notice that while this crazy-ass mob was beating an unarmed, defenseless, non-threatening woman to death they were screaming "Defend Islam." See, they weren't attacking anybody. They were merely "defending" themselves from an attack by a heinous evil-doer. That's the way it is with them. They are always the "victim," whatever atrocities they commit. Leveling the twin towers on 9/11 was merely an "act of defense." It was "caused" by America. I'm just surprised that so many American cheese-eaters actually buy into this line of "reasoning."
TomTomBinks
 
  2  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 07:20 pm
@layman,
Can you point me to the report of the flag being taken down on university campus(s)? I searched but didn't find anything.
layman
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 07:26 pm
@TomTomBinks,
TomTomBinks wrote:

Can you point me to the report of the flag being taken down on university campus(s)? I searched but didn't find anything.


For you, I'll take a quick look. That was 5-10 years ago, believe it or not.

Here's something similar I quickly came across, but it's not the one I had in mind:

Quote:
First, a student legislative council at the University of California-Irvine approved (6-4) a resolution to ban the American flag from student government offices. The banners felt those should be “inclusive” spaces, while the American flag has been “flown in instances of colonialism and imperialism.” And besides – get this – “freedom of speech, in a space that aims to be as inclusive as possible, can be interpreted as hate speech.”

http://reason.com/archives/2015/03/18/the-death-of-free-speech-on-college-camp

Free speech is "hate speech," eh? Go figure.

This might have been it:

[/quote]FIRE Coalition Shatters Window Display Censorship Policy at University of Alabama

The policy was issued after a student was ordered to remove a confederate flag from the door of his dorm room. Other students, aware of the threat to their liberty posed by this regulation, subsequently displayed American flags to challenge administrators to enforce the ban....
Etheredge cited a draft of a university policy that forbade putting up any displays “in view of the general public” that were “inconsistent with accepted standards or University policies.” The policy also outlawed “harassing or intimidating” visual materials. Professor White refused to enforce this policy because he recognized that it violated the First Amendment of the United States Constitution....

FIRE wrote to UA President Robert E. Witt in July, pointing out that the university’s requirement that window displays meet “accepted standards” was so vague that it would allow administrators to choose what sorts of expression would be allowed based solely on their whims and unfettered discretion. The letter informed Witt that “The only ‘accepted standard’ should be the First Amendment of the United States Constitution.”

Rather than admit their error and commit to their legal and moral duties under the First Amendment, administrators chose to ban all window displays. This galvanized the residents of the Byrd Hall dormitory who defiantly disobeyed the ban by prominently displaying American flags. FIRE publicly supported the students who challenged the ban.

he ASA and its allies organized a vigil for freedom of speech that brought together people from across the political spectrum. Student and faculty participants took a variety of flags, including national flags from across the world, to a meeting of a university committee that was discussing the ban on flags and window displays. Additionally, the Alabama chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union and the League of the South publicly declared their opposition to the policy.

On September 18, Dean of Students Thomas S. Strong informed the university community that the administration had “indefinitely tabled” the ban and that he personally would work to protect free speech on campus.[/quote]

TomTomBinks
 
  3  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 08:03 pm
@layman,
Thanks for the link, but that story isn't about a university banning US flags from campus. It was about a student council voting to keep flags out of student government meetings. Their decision was misguided and subsequently vetoed. So it was never put into practice. My other searches for flag banning also came up empty. Exaggerations and misinformation. So unless you can actually show me that US flags have been banned from college campuses I'm calling bullshit.
There was one widely circulated story of an apartment complex in Texas that asked a tenant to take down his flag. The story was circulated on social media for a couple of years as a Muslim group demanded the flag be taken down because it offended them. The apartment manager upheld the demand and forced the man to take down his flag.
The actual story was that the man had a flag hanging from a balcony railing and that was against policy. There were no Muslims involved and the complex itself had a proper flagpole with the flag correctly flying on it's grounds.
So how does a story like this become so popular. More importantly, WHY does it become so popular?
I'll answer my own question. It's melodrama designed to illicit indignation and rage at a given group. Propaganda. The NAZIs did it to the Jews. Whites did it to Blacks. Etc. And now we're doing it to Muslims.
layman
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 08:53 pm
@TomTomBinks,
I posted two stories there. I couldn't add the second link because the time for editing had expired. But I don't even that one was it.

Just a week or two ago, some northeastern college refused to allow an american flag to be raised again after it had been burnt. They didn't want to "provoke" anyone to do it again, as I recall.
0 Replies
 
Frugal1
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 09:00 pm
@TomTomBinks,
You finally figured out what the democrat party is all about, congratulations!
layman
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 09:12 pm
@TomTomBinks,
TomTomBinks wrote:

So how does a story like this become so popular. More importantly, WHY does it become so popular?


Maybe this story and opinion piece will help answer that question, eh?

Quote:
MUSLIM OFFENDED BY AMERICAN FLAG, TAKES “JUSTICE” INTO HER OWN HANDS

In a recent story being hidden by the media, we are reminded of what life will be like inside this country should we continue to allow millions of Muslims relocate here....A young cashier wearing an American flag pin encountered a burqa wearing Muslim woman in the check-out line...this Muslim went completely psycho on this cashier for wearing an American flag pin, but luckily the cashier had the support of many others standing in the line.

A man in the back of the line stepped forward and calmly replied:

"Lady, hundreds of thousands of men and women like this young man (pointing to a military man in line) have fought and died so that YOU could stand here, in MY country and accuse a check-out cashier of bombing YOUR countrymen. It is my belief that had you been this outspoken in YOUR own country, we wouldn’t need to be there today."

So once again it seems that Muslims in this country want special treatment or they want this country to change its way of life to appease theirs. That is not how it works, and this country isn’t changing for anyone....So while Muslims want to destroy our flag, attack our way of life, insult our citizens, and even threaten to leave this country if we do not change our culture, let’s give them a portion of what they want. If Trump is elected, Muslims claim they will leave the country...


https://conservativedailypost.com/muslim-offended-by-american-flag-takes-justice-into-her-own-hands/

Hit the road, ingrate.

CAIR sends out flyers telling all muslims to REFUSE to talk to FBI agents, informing them that they will be tortured if they even open the door, etc. They have adopted a "code of silence" and many of them have no desire whatsoever to "assimilate."

You seem to want to suggest that they all love America, and are "great material" for immigration. Fraid not.
0 Replies
 
TomTomBinks
 
  3  
Reply Sat 10 Dec, 2016 10:50 pm
@Frugal1,
Quote:
You finally figured out what the democrat party is all about, congratulations

??? Do you think the Dems are behind this type of propaganda? Each party has it's own propaganda machine and it seems the only purpose is to discredit the other party. By whatever means necessary. Nothing is sacred. If anyone gets in the way they are steamrolled. And there's no loyalty to anything or anyone. Both sides.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 11 Dec, 2016 10:57 am
We all knew this would be coming, eh?:

Quote:
OSU Activists Complain Terrorist Was Wrongly Shot By Police

An Ohio State University (OSU) student who went on a stabbing spree last month before being gunned down by a nearby officer has been added to a protest list of non-white “wrongly” shot and killed by a police.

The OSU Coalition for Black Liberation is a campus protest group on OSU’s main campus in Columbus. Gender studies student Maryam Abidi said: "The protest against police brutality extends to the innocent and the guilty alike, because we know that no matter the crime, justice and due process don’t come from a cop’s bullet.”

Pranav Jani, an associate professor at OSU, said it was important to understand why Ali engaged in his act of violence, even if one didn’t condone it. Ali suggested he was lashing out over the oppression of Muslims around the world. Jani also defended Stephanie Clemons Thompson, an OSU staffer who urged sympathy for Artan just a day after the attack."


http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/08/osu-activists-complain-terrorist-was-wrongly-shot-by-police/

What the hell is this? "Gender studies?" That's a college major now? Being told by her professor that sympathy for the poor muslim "victim" is required? That a man who, intent on butchering more people, refused to drop his butcher knife and surrender was "wrongly" shot? That "police brutality" is the problem here? That the oppression of muslims was responsible for all the injuries caused?

Can you believe these snowflakes and their cheese-eatin college professors, I ask ya!?

This is "liberalism," where utter self-hatred, suicidal tendencies, and utter insanity reigns.

Quote:
OSU Jihadi Abdul Artan Was Taking Course On Microaggressions

Ohio State University student Abdul Artan—a Pakistani immigrant who reportedly became radicalized after learning about injustices committed against fellow Muslims—was enrolled in a class called “Crossing Identity Boundaries.” In fact, he had a group project on “microaggressions” due later this week.


http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/01/osu-jihadi-abdul-artan-was-taking-course-on-microaggressions/

Quote:
abdul artan: muslim snowflake

Fittingly, the New York Times, in reporting this barbarous and outrageous crime at Ohio State University, devoted three paragraphs to wondering aloud as to whether the perpetrator, Abdul Razak Ali Artan, had a reasonable motive: The F.B.I. was investigating comments on Facebook indicating that he may have felt Muslims were being persecuted, an investigator said. This is a news article, not an editorial, yet the Times made sure to “report”—before giving the details of the crime—that federal law-enforcement officials were on the scene to investigate bigotry.

Persecution," then, is the necessary lens through which we are to interpret Abdul Artan's brutality against college students...as a member of the Snowflake Generation, for whom insults are intolerable acts of persecution, how would ISIS or Al-Awlaki not appeal to such a person?


https://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/abdul-artan-muslim-snowflake/

Who "radicalized" this "victim?" ISIS, the college profs, the media with trash like this, or all of them?

Quote:
Somali Refugees Are Not a Threat

When I grew up in Columbus in the 1980s and 1990s, the city’s Somali-born population was negligible. When I returned in 2010, its population had boomed--estimates put it around 38,000, if not more.

The Somali community in Columbus is, by American standards, quite poor and socially isolated. Muslim, black, and culturally foreign, it’s hard to imagine a group of people more likely to be marginalized in a Midwestern U.S. city. Add to that the language barriers and personal traumas that many Somali refugees face, and you have what seems like the perfect recipe for poverty, alienation, and ultimately, radicalization. No one who understands the situation can be shocked that a few Somali Americans have turned to violence, or that this violence has taken a form that resembles Islamic terrorism. What’s surprising, if anything, is just how rare these outbursts have been...The real problems in Somali refugee communities are not religious or geopolitical, but economic and social


http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2016/12/trump_is_wrong_to_blame_somali_refugees_for_the_ohio_state_terror_attack.html

So, let's see here--this cheese-eater from Slate says we should have expected MORE terrorist attacks. The whole problem is "economic and social." If taking these ingrates in, feeding, clothing, housing, and college educating them at public expense "makes" them want to kill us because they aren't given even more, then leave all the sorry bastards in Somalia, where they can have a richer, fuller life amongst their own muslim kind, I say. And anyone who thinks the American abuse, police oppression, and American niggardliness is responsible for terrorist attacks can go with them--to a place where they won't be causing deaths world-wide because they are Americans.



Frugal1
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 11 Dec, 2016 03:52 pm
@layman,
I've always supported the notion that a terrorists stops be a terrorist when he, or she is shot in the face.
layman
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 11 Dec, 2016 06:13 pm
@Frugal1,
Frugal1 wrote:

I've always supported the notion that a terrorists stops be a terrorist when he, or she is shot in the face.


Very astute, Frug.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 11 Dec, 2016 08:16 pm
Muslim assimilation in action



Want high crime rates? Highest rape rate in the State? No problem, it's easy.
layman
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 12 Dec, 2016 04:21 am
A video which credibly claims that there are muslim terroist traing camps all over the US, which are true "no-go" zones. Take it for what it's worth, if you care to watch it at all (about 4 minutes long).

0 Replies
 
 

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