12
   

Elections in Germany update:No turn to the right, after all!

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Aug, 2005 11:12 pm
When you look at he other posters - those about the jobless and by the CDU and the others about soical secutity, protection against dismissal ...) I can only wonder, too.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Thu 11 Aug, 2005 04:57 am
Heh - the CDU/CSU keeps getting itself in a mess. Especially in the East.

First Angela Merkel's repeated confusion of netto and bruto. Then Brandenburg's Minister of the Interior Jörg Schönbohm, commenting on the dramatic find of a number of dead baby bodies in a house that such violence is the result of the GDR-era "proletarisation".

And now CSU-leader Edmund Stoiber, speechifying: "I do not accept, that the East will anew decide who becomes Chancellor in Germany. It can not be allowed to happen that the frustrated determine the fate of Germany." And: "We unfortunately do not have as smart a population as in Bavaria everywhere [in Germany]".

Sleek campaign rhetorics ... not! Razz
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Thu 11 Aug, 2005 11:21 am
This is the latest EMNID/N24 poll - showing the right-wing combination of CDU/CSU and FDP left with only a 1% majority - and the CDU losing especially in the East. And that was before Stoiber's remarks ...

http://www.n24.de/images/2005/08/11/zoom_2005081115554827090.jpg

http://www.n24.de/images/2005/08/11/zoom_2005081115560827092.jpg
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 12:29 am
Quote:
Attack on 'stupid' east Germans splits right

By Tony Paterson in Berlin
Published: 15 August 2005

Germany's opposition conservatives have been split by a row over the country's unemployment-plagued east after a senior party figure dubbed the region's inhabitants "stupid calves" who wanted to vote for "their own butcher" during next month's general election.

The extraordinary comments by Edmund Stoiber, the right-wing Prime Minister of Bavaria, were seen as an insult to Angela Merkel, the conservative party leader and east German who is hoping to become the country's first female Chancellor after the September poll.

Mr Stoiber's criticism was aimed at the 33 per cent of east German voters who have thrown their support behind a new radical "Left Party" which is currently the strongest political force in the region.

"Have you all gone mad?" Mr Stoiber asked voters at campaign rallies in the east. "Only the most stupid of calves vote for their own butcher," he added. His remarks followed similar attacks last week when the Bavarian leader claimed that east Germans voters were "frustrated" and "not as clever" as his native Bavarians.

Mr Stoiber, who has been nicknamed the "Bavarian Pit Bull" for his aggressive campaign style, led Germany's conservatives to defeat in the country's 2002 general election. He refused to apologise for his comments yesterday despite being rebuked by Mrs Merkel and several other senior conservatives.

"I have told him that east and west can only go forward together. Anything else is counter-productive," Mrs Merkel said. "We have only got five weeks until the election and we have to clear up the damage," added Jörg Schönbohm, the conservative leader in the east German state of Brandenburg. "Stoiber should think about what he is doing," he said.

The row seemed destined further to undermine Mrs Merkel's hopes of a certain election victory. Recent opinion polls have suggested that her conservatives can no longer bank on gaining an absolute majority during the election as had been the case throughout June and July.

Her party has adopted the Rolling Stones' hit song "Angie" in a bid to bolster her popularity. But weak television performances and her failure adequately to explain how she intends to tackle Germany's 5 million unemployment problem have prompted commentators to claim she does not deserve to become the next Chancellor.

Mr Stoiber's remarks and his refusal to apologise for them underlined conservative unease about Mrs Merkel's suitability as a candidate for Chancellor. Germany's main television channel noted at the weekend that the conservative prime ministers of several key states were conspicuously absent at Mrs Merkel's campaign rallies in their regions last week.

There were also reports yesterday of an angry shouting match between Mrs Merkel's conservatives and Mr Stoiber over party campaign strategy. Mr Stoiber's Bavarian conservatives were said to have accused Mrs Merkel's supporters of running a "sloppy" campaign.

Equally revealing were remarks by Hugo Müller-Vogg, Mrs Merkel's biographer, who disclosed last week that there was a strong element within Germany's predominantly Catholic conservatives which remained opposed to the idea of an east German female Protestant becoming the next conservative Chancellor.

"There are those who say: if Merkel wins it will be good - if she loses it will also be good," Mr Müller-Vogg said in an interview.

By contrast, Chancellor Gerhard Schröder tried to add to his Social Democrats' gradually increasing popularity at the weekend. Echoing the anti-Iraq war strategy that won him Germany's 2002 election, he warned President Bush against going to war against Iran.

Germany's opposition conservatives have been split by a row over the country's unemployment-plagued east after a senior party figure dubbed the region's inhabitants "stupid calves" who wanted to vote for "their own butcher" during next month's general election.

The extraordinary comments by Edmund Stoiber, the right-wing Prime Minister of Bavaria, were seen as an insult to Angela Merkel, the conservative party leader and east German who is hoping to become the country's first female Chancellor after the September poll.

Mr Stoiber's criticism was aimed at the 33 per cent of east German voters who have thrown their support behind a new radical "Left Party" which is currently the strongest political force in the region.

"Have you all gone mad?" Mr Stoiber asked voters at campaign rallies in the east. "Only the most stupid of calves vote for their own butcher," he added. His remarks followed similar attacks last week when the Bavarian leader claimed that east Germans voters were "frustrated" and "not as clever" as his native Bavarians.

Mr Stoiber, who has been nicknamed the "Bavarian Pit Bull" for his aggressive campaign style, led Germany's conservatives to defeat in the country's 2002 general election. He refused to apologise for his comments yesterday despite being rebuked by Mrs Merkel and several other senior conservatives.

"I have told him that east and west can only go forward together. Anything else is counter-productive," Mrs Merkel said. "We have only got five weeks until the election and we have to clear up the damage," added Jörg Schönbohm, the conservative leader in the east German state of Brandenburg. "Stoiber should think about what he is doing," he said.

The row seemed destined further to undermine Mrs Merkel's hopes of a certain election victory. Recent opinion polls have suggested that her conservatives can no longer bank on gaining an absolute majority during the election as had been the case throughout June and July.
Her party has adopted the Rolling Stones' hit song "Angie" in a bid to bolster her popularity. But weak television performances and her failure adequately to explain how she intends to tackle Germany's 5 million unemployment problem have prompted commentators to claim she does not deserve to become the next Chancellor.

Mr Stoiber's remarks and his refusal to apologise for them underlined conservative unease about Mrs Merkel's suitability as a candidate for Chancellor. Germany's main television channel noted at the weekend that the conservative prime ministers of several key states were conspicuously absent at Mrs Merkel's campaign rallies in their regions last week.

There were also reports yesterday of an angry shouting match between Mrs Merkel's conservatives and Mr Stoiber over party campaign strategy. Mr Stoiber's Bavarian conservatives were said to have accused Mrs Merkel's supporters of running a "sloppy" campaign.

Equally revealing were remarks by Hugo Müller-Vogg, Mrs Merkel's biographer, who disclosed last week that there was a strong element within Germany's predominantly Catholic conservatives which remained opposed to the idea of an east German female Protestant becoming the next conservative Chancellor.

"There are those who say: if Merkel wins it will be good - if she loses it will also be good," Mr Müller-Vogg said in an interview.

By contrast, Chancellor Gerhard Schröder tried to add to his Social Democrats' gradually increasing popularity at the weekend. Echoing the anti-Iraq war strategy that won him Germany's 2002 election, he warned President Bush against going to war against Iran.
Source
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 02:53 am
nimh wrote:
"We unfortunately do not have as smart a population as in Bavaria everywhere [in Germany]".

What was wrong with that one? <looks innocently>

I agree about Stoiber's 'brilliance' though. It's good news for you and Walter, but I'm really mad about it. What a boor!
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 04:49 am
Thomas wrote:
What a boor!


Isn't that very unpatriotic? <Says Walter who rightly celebrates his saint's day at the Day of the Innocent Chidren>
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 08:33 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Thomas wrote:
What a boor!

Isn't that very unpatriotic? <Says Walter who rightly celebrates his saint's day at the Day of the Innocent Chidren>

Unpatriotic of Stoiber to play Ossies against Wessies this way? You bet it is!
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 09:24 am
Yes it is.

But actually I thought, it is unpatriotic of a citizen of THE freestate to use "lèse-majesté" :wink:
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:01 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Yes it is.

But actually I thought, it is unpatriotic of a citizen of THE freestate to use "lèse-majesté" :wink:

Well, he wouldn't be our first king to 'drown' in a lake somewhere. Bavarian patriots actually have a fairly anarchistic view of our rulers -- we're just not showing it all the time.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Aug, 2005 03:25 am
Quote:
"Have you all gone mad?" Mr Stoiber asked voters at campaign rallies in the east.

Is this man trying to deliberately scuttle Merkel's campaign? I mean, I know he had wanted to be the Chancellor candidate again himself, but I wouldnt have thought he'd let his resentment lead him to purposefully sabotaging his own coalition's campaign - and that's what this is starting to sound like! Weird.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Aug, 2005 08:42 am
'Die Linke' already thanked him - but denied that he got honourary membership in this new party.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Aug, 2005 04:33 am
www.election.de has lots of info (in German).

It includes this graph of the development of the average of the national opinion polls since the beginning of the year and this graph of the development since the last elections in 2002
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2005 05:41 pm
So, imagine this were the result ... (thats about the most optimistic I dare be right now ...)

40,9 CDU/CSU
30,4 SPD
9,3 Linkspartei
8,7 Greens
7,5 FDP
3,2 Others
0 Replies
 
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Aug, 2005 08:23 pm
nimh : thanks ! six horses in the race . right now it sure looks as if the CDU/CSU is going to win (handily ?). just spoke with my brother-in-law in hamburg by phone and i get the impression that even the usually left leaning voters in hamburg are swinging to the right - they do have a CDU city government, which is already highly unusual . i think a lot of germans may get a nasty surprise if they vote in a right-leaning government (i wouldn't call it "right-wing" - yet).
but looking at canada, we've had a number of "right-leaning" governments (conservative party of canada) in the 49 years we've lived in canada. i guess a change is sometimes necessary, if for no other reason than to bring new blood and new ideas into the parties. hope walter won't be too disappointed by the outcome - we may have to console him ! hbg
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Aug, 2005 12:19 am
What surprises me most is that polls still are good for the right parties, especially re the several 'schitt' what happened there.

Even more surpring here in Northrhine-Westphalia, where we got a conservative government a couple of weeks ago: none of their promisses can be done (which should have been clear before), but still ... see above.
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Aug, 2005 07:03 am
August 19th polls:

43% CDU/CSU
29% SPD
9% Grüne
8% Linke.PDS
8% FDP
3% Others
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Aug, 2005 08:32 am
hamburger wrote:
just spoke with my brother-in-law in hamburg by phone and i get the impression that even the usually left leaning voters in hamburg are swinging to the right - they do have a CDU city government, which is already highly unusual .

Well they had that whole Schill thing going on a few years back, even if it imploded in the end...
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Aug, 2005 05:40 am
Also on election.de: a "Wahlkreisprognose" that predicts, on the basis of the 2002 results, changes in district boundaries, current national and regional poll results and other elements, what the result by individual electoral district would be. They had 90% right in 2002.

For now, it still very much points to a landslide CDU/CSU victory (the image gives the update for 20 August). How many ueberhangmandate are we talking about in a case like this?

http://www.election.de/img/maps/btw05e_prognose_050820.gif
0 Replies
 
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Aug, 2005 06:37 pm
it all looks pretty "blue" to me ! is the white spot at the top "hamburg" ? hbg
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Aug, 2005 09:57 pm
hamburger wrote:
is the white spot at the top "hamburg" ? hbg


Correct - "unknown territory", not explored yet Laughing


Since neither Hamburg nor Berlin could be printed with all their constituencies on this rather small map, here are both city states shown seperately

http://www.cdu-wedel.de/html/Umfragen/P_050820.gif
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.08 seconds on 11/24/2024 at 07:30:38