Join us in the world of George W. Bush: Obstinance

I do not understand who you can think our abilities have been curtailed. Iraq is now one less place terrorists will find a safe place to train or to get weapons. Palestinain terrorists find that it is much less lucrative to send their children to Allah than it once was. <--- McG

This is so far removed from reality, I don't even know where to begin.

Our military is heavily tied up in Iraq. Big time. And it will be for at least a few more years. And you are claiming this does not reduce our ability to fight the global war on terror?

There are whole sections of Iraq we don't control at all. The people don't want us there. And you are claiming there will be LESS ability for terrorists to train there? How much training does a terrorist really need? It's not as if these people are soldiers. They blow things up, it's pretty simple, really.

We have created a huge number of people in Iraq who don't like us. At all. Previous to our invasion, these people didn't care about us one way or the other. And you say that this makes us safer? That none of these people, whose families we've killed, cities blown up, job blown up, would consider being a terrorist against us?

McG, seriously, you need to wake the hell up and smell the coffee. We are creating a WORSE situation over there than what existed before. That is not success. It is the opposite. Even if we did remove Saddam, if our actions cause more terrorism to sprout up (and it is hard to say they are not doing so) then we are failing.



No, it doesn't. It wasn't worth the deaths of 15k Iraqis and 1k Americans. This is a very facist thing to say, that that many innocent lives were worth information that someone couldn't attack us.

Cycloptichorn

Cyclo - Well at least you did not dispute the fact the millions died at the hand of Saddam were innocent.

Other than that, you are the one who fails to see the threat Iraq posed, and apparently, you will vote accordingly. For WHO, I do not know since both candidates support the War in Iraq, one on a consistant basis and the other depending on the audience.

YOU have the difficult choice in November. Nader??

Are supposing that our military is somehow supposed to pack up and move about the globe fighting terror? I am sure every country in the world would welcome the 10th mountain division into there homes every time a terrorist strikes.

YES, I am claimimg that this does not reduce our ability to fight the global war on terror. We have allies and we have intelligence agencies helping our allies and we have laws that respect the soveriegnty of other nations and expect those that participate in the UN to fight against international terrorism. this is not a fight that the US expects to fight alone, yet you seem to think it is for some reason.

I am also beginning to think you have no idea what facism is. Especially the way you keep bandying it about.

There were no 'millions' who died at the hands of Saddam. This is a common misconception that has been thoroughly debunked. http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?noframes;read=52600

Other than that, you dropped each and every one of my points. If you cannot refute them, then you are conceding the argument to me.

Cycloptichorn

http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/voigt/040917

You believe what you want. I look at the totality of the picture.

Despite what you linked, Woiyo, there is no evidence of 'millions' killed by Saddam. It has been thoroughly debunked, and even the article you linked to provides no evidence of 'millions' murdered by Saddam.

As I stated before, you dropped each and every one of my points. As you have nothing further to add to the discussion, I am assuming you concede the argument to me.

Nice discussion though, and cheers!

Cycloptichorn

Perhaps it's because we keep acting like our allies are idiots, and saying that we will go it alone.

Let me ask you, McG. It turns out that North Korea becomes a big time problem, like they are directly behind terrorism and we know it, do you believe we can effectively take action without compromising our situation in Iraq? Having one's military tied up like ours is right now INVITES attack.

Cycloptichorn

Wasn't it YOU that said not every situation needs to be solved by violence? It's rather sophmoric to believe our foriegn policy must be dictated the same to every country.

Hey, I just want to keep our options open. Seeing as we are massively mis-spending money and resources in Iraq, I'd hate for our ability to handle a TRUE threat be compromised by this.

Cycloptichorn