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Ossama who? sorry, we're busy finding WoMD in Iraq

 
 
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 11:53 am
BAGRAM, Afghanistan - Al Qaeda chief Osama bin Laden and his No. 2 are still directing attacks in Afghanistan, a top American commander said Saturday, three years after the Sept. 11 attacks that drew US forces into this strife-torn country.
Maj. Gen. Eric Olson told The Associated Press that the trail was cold in the hunt for the alleged mastermind of the 2001 attacks. But he said strikes like the recent suicide bombing of a US security firm in Kabul bear hallmarks of the militant network.
"We've even tied it to a group that has ties to Al Qaeda. It could be a splinter group of some sort," Olson said in an interview after a ceremony at the main US base north of Kabul to mark the third anniversary of the attacks.
Olson, the operational commander of US-led forces in Afghanistan, said the military had not intercepted any radio traffic or instructions from either bin Laden or his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahri.
Still, the involvement of well-trained foreign fighters in attacks near the Pakistani border convinced him that the fugitive leaders were pulling strings.
"What we see are their techniques and their tactics here in Afghanistan, so I think it is reasonable to assume that the senior leaders are involved in directing those operations," he said.
Reports poured in Saturday of fresh fighting in the country, where more than 900 people - mostly Afghan security forces and rebels - have died in political violence this year.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 12:44 pm
And to think there are people who intend to vote to re-elect this incompetent group!!!
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padmasambava
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 03:56 pm
There was once a committee to re-elect the CREEP too.

They say Bush makes Nixon look like a gentleman. And Nixon was no gentleman, much less a Quaker.
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padmasambava
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 04:01 pm
We need a new category of joke: the Osama Yo Mama joke.

Here's one spontaneously conceived:

"Yo Mama is so ugly, Osama is using her face as a model for a mask that makes everyone look in the other direction!"
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padmasambava
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 04:02 pm
Yo momma let Osama use her tinted glass Cadillac to make a getaway!
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Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 04:06 pm
First of all, the quotation in the first post should be attibuted so that the reader can check it. Secondly, you want us to be afraid of the dangers posed by terrorism, but not of the dangers posed by WMD. Sadly, we have to act aggressively on both, and I believe we are.
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Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 04:41 pm
Exactly what's been accomplished lately re WMDs, Brandon? Since they haven't been found, presumably whatever was done to get rid of them happened before the Iraq War.

As for acting aggressively on terrorism, that's a joke with this administration. Afghanistan is returning to its pre-war status, and there's more hatred for the US now than ever.

Terrorism, unlike the Iraqi army, won't be defeated so easily. And certainly not if we pursue four more years of the Bush-Cheney strategy.
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Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 04:59 pm
D'artagnan wrote:
Exactly what's been accomplished lately re WMDs, Brandon? Since they haven't been found, presumably whatever was done to get rid of them happened before the Iraq War.

Since one single use of one single WMD in a population center could kill a collosal number of people (between a few thousand and more than a million depending on the exact scenario), the threat they pose must be taken with grave seriousness. At the moment of our invasion of Iraq, based on the totality of our history in trying to get Hussein to destroy the weapons and stop the programs, there was a significant probability that he had not yet done so. Bear in mind that he had demonstrated intent to deceive the inspectors many times. There was a non-negligable probability that WMD and/or WMD programs were still there. Had Hussein been continuing his development of WMD, we might have had a finite time window before he progressed far enough to either demand we allow him to continue or to use them within the US and then deny involvement. It would not be sensible to ignore a significant probability of disaster. Bush acted correctly to invade to preclude a future in which Hussein had achieved invulnerability and possibly used WMD to strike a crippling blow against the West.

D'artagnan wrote:
As for acting aggressively on terrorism, that's a joke with this administration. Afghanistan is returning to its pre-war status, and there's more hatred for the US now than ever.
Could I please see some evidence to back your assertion that this administration treats terrorism like a joke? Perhaps the Islamic fundamentalists and their sympathisers hate us because we are now acting decisively to fight them. It is right and proper to use every means at our disposal to fight terrorists, or to stop the worst of the worst dictators from developing and stockpiling WMD.

D'artagnan wrote:
Terrorism, unlike the Iraqi army, won't be defeated so easily.

Yes, you are right. That is why it is so moronic when liberals tout every reversal in what will certainly be a long battle as proof that we are losing globally.


D'artagnan wrote:
And certainly not if we pursue four more years of the Bush-Cheney strategy.

Disagree.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 05:40 pm
Brandon9000 wrote:
First of all, the quotation in the first post should be attibuted so that the reader can check it.


Since you apparently don't know how to use Google, and don't know how to access the Associated Press site - here is one of many links to the article ... http://www.kplctv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2287184

One of the more interesting articles available right now is at the
Deutsche Welle site.

Quote:
Three years after the Sept. 11, the terrorism map has spread and the threat has become transparent and harder to ferret out. Nor have we tackled the roots of the problem: poverty and oppression in many Muslim countries.

If you count Iraq and Afghanistan, for some time now, not a single day has gone by in which a terrorist attack has been carried out somewhere in the world against innocent victims: passersby, tourists, hotel guests, airline passengers, train passengers, the pious or children on their first day of school.

The world map of terrorism has grown and the targets have scattered even further over the continents, but the phenomenon is the same: political demands are executed through violence against innocents who have nothing to do with politics. Governments are extorted, citizens are frightened and terrorized.

Taking stock of the war against terror three years after Sept. 11 and its terror attacks can be an equally sobering and depressing exercise. Under the leadership of the United States, an international alliance has formed that includes Western democracies as well as countries that formerly sponsored at least some forms of terrorism. But a victory over terrorism is still far from sight.

In some respects, it could even be farther from sight than it was three years ago. At least back then we knew the enemy's address. At least the most important enemy: Osama bin Laden and the leaders of his al Qaeda terror network mostly lived in Taliban-ruled Afghanistan -- and even if they weren't captured, they were at least real characters. Whereas after the fall of the Taliban leadership, the terrorists fled underground, transforming themselves into phantoms. But such phantoms live longer and appear to be more effective than real and detectable people. After all, Osama bin Laden is still considered by wide circles in the Islamic world to be a hero because he's the only person who has stood up against the world's only superpower and he has dictated the negotiating terms.

Indeed, al Qaeda has already found a replacement for the regimes that once supported it, and it's an extremely reliable substitute: bin Laden's organization has the support of close to 20,000 alumni who received training in terrorist camps operated by al Qaeda in Afghanistan. Long ago, these international terror trainees returned to their homelands, where many are operating as sleepers who could be activated at any time.

The growing opacity is also making al Qaeda more enigmatic: Wherever a terror attack is carried out now, the name al Qaeda is quickly raised and it is almost always asserted that bin Laden has played a role in it. But that's almost certainly not always the case. But what is often true is that the attackers follow the example of al Qaeda. And that holds true in Indonesia, Turkey, Morocco and Ossetia. The list of terrorist targets are growing and all too often they include world regions where disaffected and the frustrated allow themselves to become fanatics and consign themselves to violence.

In that sense, it would be wrong to consider al Qaeda a sort of tightly organized "Terrorism Incorporated." The "Network of Terror," and even this term may go a bit too far, already relies heavily on the existence of oppression and poverty in the world for its own survival. Those seeking to counteract the effects of poverty and oppression often use terms like "freedom," "democracy" and "human rights." But people in the Islamic world often accuse the west of double morals because of their strong feeling that Muslim countries are economically and politically disadvantaged in comparison to the West. Many interpret this as a kind of religious discrimination against Muslims.

At the same time, the West - especially the USA - does too little to address these disillusioned people. Instead it is moving mostly to protect itself through greater vigilance and an increasing number of civil rights violations. By doing so, the West is failing to recognize that those moves may also be strengthening terrorists' arguments against the West. Additionally, further violence is not going to eradicate terrorism.

The conclusion in the end is that terrorism must be fought at its roots - and not just the symptoms. Nor can there just be one method of treatment - otherwise every attempt will be futile. And there have been many efforts. Of course, a good number of participants in the coalition against terror are not democratic countries. But they have at least disavowed themselves of their previous support for terrorist groups. That's a first success. But now we must work on getting these states, like Pakistan and Libya, to make the complete transition to freedom and democracy. Only then can we increase the chances the terrorism will be diminished over the long-term.

Peter Philipp (dsl)
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 05:47 pm
ehBeth wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
First of all, the quotation in the first post should be attibuted so that the reader can check it.


Since you apparently don't know how to use Google, and don't know how to access the Associated Press site - here is...

Whose responsibility is it to provide a source for a quotation, the author or the reader?
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 05:56 pm
Personally, I find it faster to find the reference than to make a fuss about it.

I don't believe there are any 'rules' on it. If people want to provide the links - or remember to provide the links - well, that's nice - but it's not necessary. I found out long ago - it's easy enough to cut and paste two or three words - toss it into Google - and find the reference. I'm a grown-up. I can do my own homework.
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 11 Sep, 2004 06:02 pm
it's totally my fault (well, and San Andreas) and I accept full responsibily just 'cause I am a liberal you know. I did, however, assume that there was sufficient info in my post to ascertain where it was from.
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Chuckster
 
  1  
Reply Sun 12 Sep, 2004 09:14 am
Dear Cut and Pasters: All of this is immaterial. We are liberating Iraq now. There are no plans to withdraw.
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sun 12 Sep, 2004 10:49 am
are we then going back to Afghanistan to liberate them as well? Gosh Chuckster by now one would thing the level of violence against coalition troops as well as Iraqi's themselves would be going down instead of up but then its only been about 18 months of occupation. What'ya think, another 15 yrs?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Sun 12 Sep, 2004 11:32 am
As a point of journalistic procedure, the author should make sources transparent and accessible. It's a good protocol to follow.
0 Replies
 
 

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