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The last swiftie rehash (yeah right)

 
 
jomacc
 
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 10:24 am
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Bruce Kesler

Special to The Augusta Free Press





I am partisan, opposed to John Kerry in 1971 and 2004.

Below, I will also try my hardest to be fair. Judge for yourself.



1. Did Kerry want to go to Vietnam?

He first sought deferment from military service.



2. Did Kerry exaggerate his service on the USS Gridley, offshore Vietnam, for Douglas Brinkley's book Tour Of Duty?

His two-levels up commander and a shipmate say he did.



3. Did Kerry want to be in combat?

The Swift Boats were an offshore patrol unit at the time Kerry volunteered for it.



4. Was Kerry's first Purple Heart merited?

The senior officer there on the boat at the incident says there was no hostile fire, and Kerry would not have been out on his own at that point in his early tour.

A sailor says the officer, (now Admiral) Schachte (a senior JAG officer), was not there. The wound was probably self-inflicted from an American M-79 grenade.

Nine days later, Kerry wrote, "We hadn't been shot at yet ..."

The wound was a paper matchstick piece of likely M-79 grenade treated with a band-aid.

It may not rise to the qualifications for a Purple Heart, and Kerry's request for it was denied by his superior.

Mysteriously, three months later, after those who knew the facts were gone from Vietnam, the Purple Heart was issued from Saigon.

No documents have been released as to who was on the boat.



5. What is the significance of this first Purple Heart incident?

It, along with two others, permitted Kerry to leave Vietnam eight months early. Without it, Kerry left Vietnam before he should have.



6. Was there political influence or other explanation for the issuance of the first Purple Heart?

Kerry refuses to release his full military records or his journal. No witnesses have emerged as to how the first Purple Heart came to be issued.



7. Has the merit of Kerry's second Purple Heart been challenged?

No. It has not been seriously challenged.



8. Did Kerry's account of his second Purple Heart vary from facts?

Yes. The Kerry campaign Web site's display of partial documents contained that Kerry was the commander of the boat that day. When the actual skipper challenged that, the Kerry campaign removed a 20-page batch of documents from its Web site.



9. Did Kerry merit the Silver Star?

A Kerry supporter who commanded another boat involved in the incident writes that it was the members of other boats that first and primarily mopped up from the encounter with Viet Cong. Kerry went ashore and killed a fleeing, wounded, armed VC. Kerry's actions do not rise to the standards of the Silver Star. The other sailors and officers on the three boats involved did not receive the Silver Star.



10. Did Kerry merit the Bronze Star?

Difficult to say. The standards of the Bronze Star are lower than for the Silver. The timeline of differing witnesses of whether there was enemy fire, and most particularly whether Kerry was under fire when he picked up Rassmann, have not been clearly delineated. Similarly, the facts of how Kerry came to go a half-mile to a mile downriver from the mine explosion under another boat, later returning to the other boats that did not leave the scene, are unclear.



11. Did Kerry merit the third Purple Heart for the Bronze Star incident?

It is proven that "shrapnel" to Kerry's buttocks came from his earlier being hit when blowing up some VC rice. The "contusion" to Kerry's arm during the Bronze Star episode may not rise to Purple Heart standards. There is confusion as to whether and when in the timeline Kerry fell and hit his arm against his own boat. The Purple Heart standard says, "A wound is defined as an injury to any part of the body from an outside force or agent ..."



12. Did Kerry display physical courage in Vietnam?

Indisputably. In all cases, maybe.



13. Does the Kerry Website displayed documents show a "V" on the Silver Star, which is not practice?

Yes.



14. Do the three citations for the Silver Star contain varying accounts of its merits?

Yes.



15. Why do the three Silver Star citations contain differing accounts?

Not answered yet. The Secretary of the Navy, John Lehman, says he did not do the third citation - the signature may be an autopen - nor does he know why it was issued in the '80s.

16. Was Kerry in Cambodia on Christmas 1968?

All evidence is to the contrary to Kerry's up to 50 times repeating this story.



17. Was Kerry in Cambodia at another time?

All evidence is to the contrary. No evidence has been presented to say that he was. Brinkley now says Kerry's statement about being in Cambodia at Christmas "is obviously wrong."



18. Did Kerry write up some of the reports at dispute in the medals?

Unclear without further documents being released. At his April 22, 1971, testimony to the U.S. Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Kerry did say: "... I can recall often sending in the spot reports which we made after each mission ..." Not conclusive. Others recall Kerry often sending in reports, including when they did not. The "Market Time Spot Report 13/1/TE 194.5.4.4/1" that was the primary document relied upon for the Bronze Star/third Purple Heart was from Kerry's designator.



19. Did Kerry accuse the U.S. and Vietnam veterans of committing pervasive, sanctioned atrocities?

Yes. Read the words and accounts of the time in 1971.



20. Did Kerry attend a meeting of Vietnam Veterans Against the War in November 1971 at which it was proposed to assassinate several pro-Vietnam war U.S. senators?

Yes.



21. Did Kerry deny he was there?

Yes. Until a New York Sun reporter showed that FBI records proved otherwise.



22. Did Kerry report the danger to any authorities?

No.



23. Did Kerry break the Logan Act by going to the Paris Peace Talks to talk with the North Vietnamese and Viet Cong delegations, or other laws related to his deserve obligations in his protest activities?

That's for judicial decision. Others have not been convicted for similar deeds.



24. Did Kerry mislead that he tossed his medals during a protest demonstration?

Yes. Confronted, Kerry now says they were ribbons.



25. Were Kerry's words used against POWs in North Vietnam?

Words like his were. Also, at least four of the POWs say publicly that John Kerry's words were used to try to break them down, so probably more were so subjected.



26. Did Kerry push normalization of U.S. relations with Vietnam, and for a relative's profit?

Kerry and others pushed for normalization. His cousin soon after obtained a large contract with Vietnam, but no direct link has yet been proven.



27. Has Kerry ever apologized or recanted for any of his above actions and words?

No.



28. Has John Kerry released his full military records and journals?

He refuses. Kerry has claimed he can't release his journals due to contractual obligations to Douglas Brinkley, author of Tour Of Duty. Brinkley says, however, according to The Washington Post: "... the papers are the property of the senator and in his full control." Brinkley says, "I don't mind if John Kerry shows anybody anything."



29. Has the mainstream press requested the release of Kerry's full military records?

Only one says so, the Washington Post, which only received about six of 100 pages of records.



30. Has there been more smoke than wood in much of this public debate?

Yes, in my opinion. That is why I wrote the above.





Bruce N. Kesler resides in Encitas, Calif.


http://www.augustafreepress.com/stories/storyReader$25995
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jomacc
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 10:26 am
Btw this was posted by Mickey Kaus, a Kerry supporter (although lukewarm I think) as some of the questions Kerry would have to answer if he ever had another press conference.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2106296/
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 10:38 am
Did Kerry go to Vietnam? Yes.

That's it, that's all. Nothing to see.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 11:12 am
No, that's not it and that's not all.

Apparently there is plenty to see. It's too late in the game to put this matter into Gore's imaginary lockbox.
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 11:18 am
Re: The last swiftie rehash (yeah right)
Bruce Kesler wrote:
Below, I will also try my hardest to be fair.

He failed.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 11:30 am
It really is all, mcG.

It's about facts. We know that Kerry went to Vietnam. Everything past that <shrug> we may never find out.

Sticking to facts makes politics boring. I know that.
0 Replies
 
jomacc
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 11:32 am
ehBeth didn't get 14892 posts by being longwinded
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 11:37 am
ehBeth wrote:
It really is all, mcG.

It's about facts. We know that Kerry went to Vietnam. Everything past that <shrug> we may never find out.

Sticking to facts makes politics boring. I know that.


Did Bush serve in the National Guard? Yes.

That's it, that's all. Nothing to see.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 10 Sep, 2004 12:56 pm
That'll work for me.



McG, I'm pretty sure you know that I like factcheck.org. A lot. As much as I disagree with much that timber believes and posts, he uses factcheck.org as one of his references. I think he's one of the posters who helped me find it, by his linking. It's a good resource, regardless of your political orientation.

I like facts. I will certainly consider opinions, but I'm always more interested in what the facts of a case are. In the cases of John Kerry and George Bush, and many others - the complete truth about their service records will probably always remain somewhat murky. There are some facts available - and people have to (I think) use facts to help them develop their own opinions. What worries me is the people who ignore facts that counter their opinions. Actually, they kind of scare me.

The willingness and ability to assess and re-assess your position/opinion is, I think, an important part of being a citizen (of whatever country).

So,

Kerry went to Vietnam. Bush was in the National Guard. Much of the rest of it is debatable. Some of the debate is based in fact.

Which leaves us with, for absoluted@ngsurely, Kerry in Vietnam, Bush in the National Guard.





Neither of them seems, on my reading of many postings and links here, and in the Taunton Woodshed, to have sterling legislative records. I don't envy you your limited options in the U.S. Right or right - not much to choose between them.
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