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Poetry: Composition and Appreciation

 
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Oct, 2004 01:54 am
It was a book of groups of rhyming words, a new kind of reference book, not actually a book of poems, Oristar.

I'll look up the magazine article later.
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Oct, 2004 06:50 pm
Dear Oristar,
Hello! Hello! I got back late on Monday night after a much longer trip than expected. We had a wonderful time driving around the beautiful state of Oregon. We ended up spending a lot of time in the eastern side of the state because it was raining on the coast. That half of the state is full of beautiful countryside and amazing volcanic formations. I hope that some day you can come to the United States and see it. The most amazing place where many people from all over the world come is Crater Lake, a large lake that has filled in after a volcano, Mount Mazama blew its top. We stayed in the famous lodge there and enjoyed fine treatment and a wonderful meal, for which the lodge is well-known. Here are a couple of photos of Crater Lake -- it is bigger than you might think... six miles across, twenty miles to drive around it... and very dangerous looking with steep sides that drop hundreds of feet to the cold deep water):

http://ctein.com/thumb101.jpghttp://virginiasphotography.com/pictures/mousepads/Crater%20Lake%20FCL-2%20Mousepad_small.jpg

It wasn't my favorite place, but it may have been the most dramatic... here was another awesome sight, Fort Rock, site of an ancient native American settlement where they found 60 sandals buried in ash from a volcano that erupted 7,000 years ago... apparently the same mountain!

http://www.byways.org/library/display/10283/or.outback.JPG

We did also spend time on the beach and camped in a tent. (Does anyone in China ever go camping??? I think it is fun to be outside and in Oregon there are also "yurts" and other things that can be rented within the state parks if you don't have a tent. Many people, of course, have trailers and RV's but I think they are tacky. If you're going to be outside... might as well be outside!) I brought my poetry book with me but was so busy most of the time that I hardly read at all except to re-read "Pied Beauty" several times and a few odd poems from a small poetry book I brought with me. That was about it. Have you been reading any more poetry?

I'm really glad you liked Millay's "Invocation to the Muses" poem. You picked the best part to quote, too. You are kind to say you'd thank the Americans for helping China. I am glad that they helped too. I cannot imagine how horrible it must have been for the Chinese people to have suffered so much in 1937. Wouldn't you think that humans would get smart enough to quit having war? What use is it to kill so many people? The rape of women as a part of war just infuriates me. Will we ever become civilized people? Sometimes I wonder if it is possible.


This is a set of poems written by Millay for two people who were killed unjustly... I wish that every one of those 300,000 Chinese people could have had a poem written for them. I believe that every one of them was important, a person loved by their family and someone to be cherished.

TWO SONNETS IN MEMORY
(Nicola Sacco -- Bartolomeo Vanzetti)
Executed August 23, 1927

I
As men have loved their lovers in times past
And sung their wit, their virtue and their grace,
So have we loved sweet Justice to the last,
That now lies here in an unseemly place.
The child will quit the cradle and grow wise
And stare on beauty till his senses drown;
Yet shall be seen no more by mortal eyes
Such beauty as here walked and here went down.
Like birds that hear the winter crying plain
Her courtiers leave to seek the clement south;
Many have praised her, we alone remain
To break a fist against the lying mouth
Of any man who says this was not so:
Though she be dead now, as indeed we know.

II
Where can the heart be hidden in the ground
And be at peace, and be at peace forever,
Under the world, untroubled by the sound
Of mortal tears, that cease from pouring never?
Well for the heart, by stern compassion harried,
If death be deeper than the churchmen say, --
Gone from this world indeed what's graveward carried,
And laid to rest indeed what's laid away.
Anguish enough while yet the indignant breather
Have blood to spurt upon the oppressor's hand;
Who would eternal be, and hang in ether
A stuffless ghost above his struggling land,
Retching in vain to render up the groan
That is not there, being aching dust's alone?

Edna St. Vincent Millay


In case you wonder who those men were, here's some information from The Sacco-Vanzetti Case
Quote:
Sacco and Vanzetti were executed on August 23, 1927, a date that became a watershed in twentieth-century American history. It became the last of a long train of events that had driven any sense of utopian vision out of American life. The workings of American democracy now seemed to many Americans as flawed and unjust as many of the older societies of the world, no longer embodying any bright ideal, but once again serving the interests of the rich and the powerful. American intellectuals were powerfully moved by the case. In his epochal masterpiece, USA, John Dos Passos raged in one "Camera Eye" episode,

All right you have won ... America our nation has been beaten by strangers who have turned our language inside out ... they have built the electric chair and hired the executioner to throw the switch . . . all right we are two nations . . .


Best,
Piffka
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Oct, 2004 06:50 pm
McTag wrote:
It was a book of groups of rhyming words, a new kind of reference book, not actually a book of poems, Oristar.

I'll look up the magazine article later.



Did you ever find that article, McTag?? Very Happy
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Oct, 2004 04:37 am
Welcome back, dear Piffka!

Wow, you've made a poetic trip!

Have you noticed the Phanton Ship in the Crater Lake, Piffka?
http://www.educeth.ch/stromboli/perm/cl/phantomship-en.html
http://www.educeth.ch/stromboli/perm/cl/phantomshipviewpoint-en.html

I felt so chilly when looking at the CL pictures both from your post and the site, although they look so pretty. I think I'd better appreciate them in summer, and then I'll no more need to open my air conditioner and pay the bill for the additional power consumption.

But Fort Rock warmed my heart. I highly appreciated its romantic legend and its wonderful landscape. Thank Mother Nature for bestowing humans the great sight. Very Happy

I think going camping has begun to become the cup of tea for so many Chinese, because camp tents seemed well sold in China. God, I imagine that I breathed in the fresh air out Fort Rock, and enjoying the mild fragrance the Oregon breeze brought from the beautiful flowers to my nostrils! I admire you that you've made such a good trip, dear Piffka!

Poem is the summit of literature. So it is absolutely needed that one has to master English (literature) if the one wanted to exactly understand and properly appreciate English poems. So I decided to study English language harder than I did before. To outward seeming, I've not insisted on learning poems everyday. But I am confident that I will learn poems more effectively when my English study has gone a great way. Thanks for your kind regard, Piffka.

I will read the poem that you attached to your post later.

Best,
Oristar
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Oct, 2004 11:38 am
Dear Oristar,
Thank you for the welcome! It is always good to come home, even when a trip has been full of fun and interesting things. There were so many beautiful and amazing things to see in Oregon -- the Painted Hills of John Day, lava beds that stretched for miles, strange little volcanic craters & cones, beautiful passes between the mountains that were filled with trees of every color. We saw a small herd of wild burros in the desert, elk in the mountains, seals in the ocean and birds everywhere. There are wonderful farms that seem to be so productive and huge ranches that stretch for miles in every direction. There are some good museums and friendly small towns, too. Lots to do!!!

It is great that you want to learn as much English as you can. I think you can already express yourself well. With people who are native speakers there is still a give-and-take: "Is this "exactly" what you mean?" someone says, and then there is more discussion. Anyway, I am sure you will be successful in your goal. I love that you want to use the nuances of poetry and I am sure you enjoy the poems as well. I try to write to you without making my words more simple -- I hope that is what you want. I think I must sometimes be confusing (I confuse English speakers, too!), so just ask if you are having a hard time understanding me, OK?

I am so glad that you ventured around the internet and found out more about Oregon. Yes, I have seen the Phantom Ship at Crater Lake, though not on this trip. This time around we decided not to drive along the top edges of the lake because it was so cold and windy. There was snow on the ground! I remember seeing the Phantom Ship from a previous trip. There is a reflection of the island in the water that can really look like a ship. (There is another "phantom ship" in the desert of the southwest -- also a volcanic remnant.) Sometimes the fog that surrounds the caldera also plays many interesting tricks as it encircles the trees and the hillside. I think I mentioned that I have never been down to the water's edge. There is a steep trail on the opposite side from the lodge and there are boats for rent. Also people can fish down there. But, to me, that lake was not meant for humans to play on. It has too much dignity and power and, at least from my point of view, should be gazed at and wondered about from the upper overlooks.

So, as I said, we took a short hike on a forest trail when we had dropped down in altitude, probably about ten miles from the summit. We were the only ones there, which is a good way to experience nature, I think. A sign was posted that said mountain lions had been seen in the vicinity in the last couple of days and to be especially careful. That puts people off (especially if they had children with them)! The mountain lions of this area are not as big as African lions, but they are aggressive sometimes and we need to be careful around them! I read all the cautionary points of how to deal with an attack (look big and make noise). Then I picked up a rock, slightly bigger than a baseball and figured I was "armed" in case of danger. Very Happy I was safe! I think that if a mountain lion were in the vicinity, I imagine he (or she) was warned off by my cocky attitude. Wink I brought the rock home as a memento for my son, who thought my story was funny. Don't worry, I also gave him some other mementos... not just a rock~!

Here is a poem by the poet, Robinson Jeffers, who lived for much of his life in California, in the redwoods. Those are huge and ancient trees which are wonderful to walk among. One of the best times on this trip was a few moments of absolute quiet that we had while standing in the warm sunlight and surrounded by these gigantic trees. We were in the California Redwoods of Del Norte county for one day -- it is very close to the Oregon border.

Robinson Jeffers has a way of looking at the beautiful natural world and then seeing the impact of humans on them which is something that (for me) also intrudes on my enjoyment. I have spent a lot of time trying to reconcile myself to that. I am learning to paint and when I consider my subjects, I often see that a beautiful vista is marred by power lines or some other human encroachment. This I have long resented, but I am growing more understanding of the foibles of people. I try to see that the powerlines & other manifestations of people have a place within nature. (I just wish ore people had better taste in how they build and paint their houses!)

I think it is wonderful that the Chinese people are finding camping to be enjoyable. It is something we can share. I worry, sometimes, that so many Chinese people live in cities and don't have the opportunity to see nature in her unencumbered glory. I have heard that some of the ancient sites of Chinese Taoists are among the most beautiful places in the world. I would like to compare them to the beautiful places I know here in the western United States.

So anyway, here is Robinson Jeffers, musing about his ocean-front home and the growth of human habitation around him.

Best,
Piffka


Carmel Point
Robinson Jeffers
The extraordinary patience of things!
This beautiful place defaced with a crop of surburban houses-
How beautiful when we first beheld it,
Unbroken field of poppy and lupin walled with clean cliffs;
No intrusion but two or three horses pasturing,
Or a few milch cows rubbing their flanks on the outcrop rockheads-
Now the spoiler has come: does it care?
Not faintly. It has all time. It knows the people are a tide
That swells and in time will ebb, and all
Their works dissolve. Meanwhile the image of the pristine beauty
Lives in the very grain of the granite,
Safe as the endless ocean that climbs our cliff.-As for us:
We must uncenter our minds from ourselves;
We must unhumanize our views a little, and become confident
As the rock and ocean that we were made from.
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Oct, 2004 07:40 am
Dear Piffka,

It is nice that you will write your messages without any simplification particularly made for me to better understand them. Thanks for both your kindness and the good advice. Also, if there is somewhere in my message that confuses you, please let me know. And I will learn from you or other English masters to improve it.

Your description has given me a beautiful Oregon picture that painted from vivid lives there. It looks so romantic except there is some dangerous smell from lions. However, since cocky Piffka, who armed herself with the most primordial weapon - a piece of rock, has made them chicken out, the pristine beauty has caught a chance to completely show off its special charm. I think the charm is the part of the American dream that has been pursued by everyone, including me, who appreciates American freedom.

No doubt, standing in the middle of the absolute quietness in such a picturesque place is a special yet great joy in our lives, especially when we were from a bustling city.

And no wonder Robinson Jeffers would complain what defaced the beautiful place, beause human's intrusion would stain both the beauty and the perfect quietness. But wait a monent, dear Robinson: were you human? Were you unhuman? Supposed I came there for the first time, I pampered myself into the stunning pristine beauty, and suddenly, I found there was a man who sat quietly on a big rock in deep meditation. What would I think? I thought the unmatchable beauty there has been stained by this man called Robinson? Would I be angry when I further learned that he has built his home in the beautiful place, because his home defaced the beauty -- just as what Robinson himself described in his poem? But if I had the right to demande him to leave and remove his home, how could he enjoy the beauty again?

So sorry I couldn't tell you whether or not I appreciated his Carmel Point untill he tells me the answer.

Regarding the ancient sites of Chinese Taoists, I think one of the most famous sites in China is WuDang Mountain, of the world cultural heritage:

http://www.gb.taoism.org.hk/general-taoism/image/1-5-5-11ab.jpg

Best,
Oristar
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Oct, 2004 11:51 pm
Dear Oristar,
Four times throughout this day I have written a long reply to your kind post and have had my work lost. I am simply exhausted at the thought of having to rewrite it, though I know (I KNOW) I should just write in Word where at least things don't get lost. So much hard work and hard thinking!!! Very Happy I promise to rewrite it all again tomorrow when I'm fresh.

Meanwhile, you are right to question Jeffers and I have written (and rewritten) several things to that effect. I will rewrite it again, I promise.

You were wonderful to post that Taoist Mountain. I wonder, have you been there? Is it as beautiful as it seems?

Henry David Thoreau said "In Wilderness is the preservation of the World." Do you agree?

Best,
Piffka
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Oct, 2004 09:27 am
Dear Piffka,

I had a blackout today, so please take it easy. Very Happy In addition, I want you always feel comfortable in the communication between us, so please take time to reply.

MS Word is excellent, but it is too big. I've usually been using note board/notepad to write my messages, because the program could be launched quickly. And I keep a habit to click "save" button every minute, so every time my computer collapsed, my work would not be lost. Very Happy

Sympathy to both you and myself, because I was also exhausted today as you were.

I'm sorry I've not been to the Wudang Mountain.

David Thoreau seems to have a great interest in
environmental protection. I think I have to read his work to exactly figure out what he said meant. But I am too exhausted today to do this. What I impressed at first sight by "In Wilderness is the preservation of the World" is that he strongly criticized that human's activity has had a great minus effect, and that human should strictly behave himself to keep the order and harmony between the nature and the society.

Best,
Oristar
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Oct, 2004 09:36 am
Dear Oristar....
Hey! We're almost in realtime! Are you there?

Sorry you are exhausted. Have you been working too hard?

Best,
Piffka

Thoreau loved the wild world more than the human world, that is true.
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Oct, 2004 09:45 am
Dear Oristar,

One of the things I wanted to say about the Jeffers dilemma was that I share his love of the primordial world -- who wouldn't? It is amazing to think that without the touch of humans, things can turn out so beautifully. Jeffers had the problem of moving to an incredible place (where he built his home 100 years ago is one of the most beautiful in all of California) and then he lived there with his family in peace and the beauty of the ocean seascape. But when people come in, as they do, they bring the stink of their cars and the noise that seems disrespectful, they tear up the landscape and block views. Worse, they often had no thought for the creatures they were uprooting. I have a large sympathy for Jeffers. I grew up on a lonely saltwater bay and now part of my view is blocked by new people. Sometimes I want to see beyond their roofline... I'm watching for one of our boats or I'm observing a seabird. <grump, grump> I have never personally seen those people do any watching themselves. They built there home in front of mine and then they covered their windows.

Meanwhile, when I was in Oregon and was taking photographs of the landscape, at first I carefully kept all sign of humans out of my pictures. But I found that it gave the pictures "a story" if there were a lonely house out in the desert, or an old truck body in the foreground. Even a long and decrepit fence that faded into the distance had a story to tell.

OK. Since I didn't follow your (good) idea to write this anywhere except on the a2k reply box, I am going to stop while I can still send this.

Best to you,
Piffka
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Oct, 2004 09:35 am
Dear Piffka,

Thanks for your kind regard. I myself was also astonished that I would be so exhausted yesterday. I just spent several hours to a county-level city by bus and then came home, feeling unusually exhausted. Thank God, or luckily, I've basically recovered now.

Yes, you've talked sense that without the touch of humans, the primordial world would turn out to be amazingly beautiful. The best situation is that only Jeffers or Piffka could come there to enjoy the great beauty, while the rest of the world would never know there is such a poetic place on the planet.

Life always poses some paradox for us. Since Jeffers could not help himself and leaked the secret - he published his poem that deeply touched the heartstrings of the people, the result, like that some people wanted to imitate what Jeffers did, and that some "bad" guys coveted and moved to the beautiful place... occurred.

So what we need to do is how to make a great balance between nature and society which will keep both the pristine beauty and the greatness of human's works.

Best,
Oristar
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Oct, 2004 05:28 pm
Dear Oristar,

I am concerned that you were so exhausted... also a little confused as to what a county-level city is. (??) I do understand spending a long time traveling by bus though and it is hard. I hope that you are feeling better and take good care of yourself so that you stay well.

As for the primordial world -- we all are "bad guys" to somebody, I think. Probably there were native Americans whom Jeffers displaced, and while at my little house near the water, I personally don't displace anyone's view, perhaps they don't care for some other thing that we do. For that reason I try hard to stay friendly to the neighbors, even those whose roof annoys me.

This great balance you speak of - do you have any ideas?

I was going to say... in fact, I said several times in the posts that were lost!! ... that the buildings on the Taoist Mountain are so well-designed that they don't seem to distract from the scene. I think they make it more memorable; better even than without the human touch. So you see, I'm not against all human works, I just wish that most were more thoughtfully arranged. I am very fond of good architecture and have studied it a little. Understanding a sense of place and encouraging building that is sympathetic to that place -- in color, shape and dimension -- is how we determine what is the greatness of human works, at least those of stone & wood, don't you think?

Meanwhile... we haven't talked of poetry for a while. Have I posted this poem here? It is one of my favorites. The first line is a lament for many things that are gone and such a plaintive wish for that stillness which is a big part of the primordial world:

PASTORAL
EStVM
If it were only still!--
With far away the shrill
Crying of a cock;
Or the shaken bell
From a cow's throat
Moving through the bushes;
Or the soft shock
Of wizened apples falling
From an old tree
In a forgotten orchard
Upon the hilly rock!

Oh, grey hill,
Where the grazing herd
Licks the purple blossom,
Crops the spiky weed!
Oh, stony pasture,
Where the tall mullein
Stands up so sturdy
On its little seed!


Once again, the poems that make me happy are those that rejoice in the simple details of the natural world. <not such a surprise!> I think it is interesting that the first image she uses, the sound of a cock's crowing, is mentioned in the Dao De Jing #80, as the sign of what is a good distance to be from one place to another.

Wishing you the best, as always,
Piffka

PS -- Dagmaraka posted a wonderful poem which you might like. It was towards on the thread of Incredible Silliness and was called "The Cataract of Ladore." Link to the poem website.
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Oct, 2004 09:15 am
Dear Piffka,

Please don't let my little fatigue concern you. A county-level city refers to a small city that is in a county level. Tlhat is, the former of it is the county town; since it got well developed, the government decided to set it up as a city.

Yes, the buildings on the Taoist Mountain -- Wudang Mountain are well-designed, because it is now a national park in China. One of the ideas regarding the great balance is that we make a resident community as part of a national park, so the govt has to well design the community, and all sprawling should be strictly banned. I'm very pleased to see that you've had this kind of idea in your mind. You said very well that "Understanding a sense of place and encouraging building that is sympathetic to that place -- in color, shape and dimension -- is how we determine what is the greatness of human works, at least those of stone & wood, don't you think?"

EStVM's Pastoral sounds very neat. Reading the poem, like holding a wild rose, you'd sniff at its fragrance and get comfort.

The brief introduction about Wudang Mountain was attached here.

Hmm, emperors' care led it to be well designed.

Wudang Mountain
Location: Hubei Province

Located in the northwest of Hubei province, Wudangshan stretches 400 kilometres and covers an area of more than 30 square kilometres. This mountainous area is best known as a Taoist sanctuary. As early as the East Han Dynasty (25-220AD), the mountain attracted the Emperor's attention. During the Tang Dynasty (618-907), the first site of worship - the Five Dragon Temple - was constructed. During the fifteenth century, the mountain reached its religious climax. Ming Dynasty emperors sent 300,000 soldiers and craftsmen to build as many as 160 temples, pavilions and other structures.

As a national park, Wudangshan boasts an impressive landscape and flourishing plant life. Li Shizhen, a Ming Dynasty pharmacologist, recorded more than 400 local species of plants with medical value in his Materia Medica. The sacred mountain attracts visitors not only for its beautiful scenery, but also for the mysterious Wudangshan style of martial arts (wushu). The technique was developed by Zhang Sanfeng, a famous Ming Taoist. Several Wushu schools can be found in the town at the foot of the mountain.

The highest Wudang summit is the 1612m Tianzhu Peak, a name that translates as "Pillar Propping Up the Sky", or "Heavenly Pillar Peak". Noted temples include the Golden Hall, Nanyan Temple and the Purple Cloud Temple. As the largest existing Taoist complex, these temples serve as fine examples of ancient Chinese architecture. And many of them house Taoist relics of high cultural and artistic value.
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Oct, 2004 11:29 am
Dear Oristar,

Hmmm. Thanks for the explanation -- does the designation of town or city have significant political differences? Here, I think, a town is smaller than a city and likely to have all the services of a city, but on a much smaller scale -- often using some county resources. For example, in the small town where I live, they have their own police, mayor and sewer/water systems, but rely on county services for library and garbage. I imagine this is similar to what you meant.

You wrote: "One of the ideas regarding the great balance is that we make a resident community as part of a national park, so the govt has to well design the community, and all sprawling should be strictly banned."

What a group of excellent ideas -- to live in a national park and to ban sprawl. Sprawl is a corporative plague that stretches throughout the United States -- every state has to deal with it. "Miracle Mile" it is sometimes called -- where a mile or more of street (usually a main thoroughfare entering or leaving a town) becomes the site for all of the worst in fast-food outlets & malls. Seems to me that it is a terrible way to enter a community and be introduced to its supposed identity. You can hardly tell one Miracle Mile from the next.

Thanks for the interesting explanation of WuDang. It makes me remember that I wanted to continue my Chinese studies of ideograms when I came back from my trip. <Note to self: must find time for this.> That's part of the reason for the purchase of the Apple computer. I think I will also find a map that I can hang on my wall of the many provinces of China since I cannot keep them straight in my head. I have been looking online at the Du Fu monument and realize I have no idea (none!) how far Chengdu City and Sichuan are from Hubei.

China is one of the few places in Asia that I have wanted to go. I don't care for hot weather, so most of Asia is less-appealing to me. Very Happy

I was interested in Du Fu for many reasons, chief among them his Thatched Cottage but I was wonderfully surprised to hear about the "Flower-Washing Brook" that was nearby. When I was a Girl Scout (I assume you know what Girl Scouts are?) my camp nickname was "Fern Brusher" because I liked to neaten up the forest. Silly!

Here is one of Du Fu's most famous poems. I imagine you know it...

My Cottage Unroofed By Autumn Gales
Du Fu

In the eighth month autumn's high winds angrily howl,
And sweep three layers of thatch from off my house.
The straw flies over the river, where it scatters,
Some is caught and hangs high up in the treetops,
Some floats down and sinks into the ditch.
The urchins from the southern village bully me, weak as I am;
They're cruel enough to rob me to my face,
Openly, they carry the straw into the bamboo.
My mouth and lips are dry from pointless calling,
I lean again on my cane and heave a sigh.
The wind soon calms, and the clouds turn the colour of ink;
The autumn sky is black in all directions.
My ancient cotton quilt is cold as iron,
My restless children sleep badly, and kick it apart.
The roof leaks over the bed- there's nowhere dry,
The rain falls thick as hemp, and without end.
Lost amid disorder, I hardly sleep,
Wet through, how can I last the long nights!
If I could get a mansion with a thousand, ten thousand rooms,
I'd give all scholars joy and shelter from cold.
Solid as a mountain, the elements could not move it.
Oh! If I could see this house before me,
I'd happily freeze to death in my broken hut!


What a kind man! but I'm hopeful he wouldn't really freeze to death in the eighth month. Maybe China is colder than I think?

That website might be good for me to learn traditional Chinese because poetry really does help when learning a different language.

Be well,
Piffka
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Oct, 2004 09:05 am
Dear Piffka,

Du Fu is one of the greatest poets of ancient China, whose fame is neck and neck with Li Bai. The poem, My Cottage Unroofed By Autumn Gales, is one of the most popular poems in China, in which he intoned:

"If I could get a mansion with a thousand, ten thousand rooms,
I'd give all scholars joy and shelter from cold.
Solid as a mountain, the elements could not move it."

The well known lines are frequently quoted by today's Chinese people, especially real estate merchants, who used to preach their real estates are that of the mansion that Du Fu dreamed for, so as to
lure customers.

Southern China is warm while northern cold. Nowaday's Chengdu should be really warm. I think why Du Fu felt so cold is because his ancient cotton quilt is cold as iron. I salute to his spirit that he would give his life as a sacrifice for a just cause making other poor people warm.

Talking about how far is it from Hubei to Chengdu, please grab a China map to measure it. I am too lazy to measure it for you, dear Piffka, because this is just a homework for a Girl Scout.

Reading and reciting Chinese poems would help you learn Chinese. In fact, Chinese students are taught to do so. I think that you talked sense about"That website might be good for me to learn traditional Chinese because poetry really does help when learning a different language. "

And, it seems that will do you good if you visit China in a fine day rather than in hot weather.

Best,
Oristar

PS. The original Chinese of the poem "My Cottage Unroofed By Autumn Gales":

茅屋为秋风所破歌
杜甫
八月秋高风怒号,卷我屋上三重茅。茅飞渡江洒江郊,高者挂罥长林梢,下者飘转沉塘坳。南村群童欺我老无力,忍能对面为盗贼。公然抱茅入竹去,唇焦口燥呼不得,归来倚仗自叹息。俄倾风定云墨色,秋天漠漠向昏黑。布衾多年冷似铁,娇儿恶卧踏里裂。床头屋漏无干处,雨脚如麻未断绝。自经丧乱少睡眠,长夜沾湿何由彻!安得广厦千万间,大庇天下寒士俱欢颜,风雨不动安如山。呜呼!何时眼前突兀见此屋,吾庐独破受冻死亦足!
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Oct, 2004 09:21 am
The original Chinese version of the poem "My Cottage Unroofed By Autumn Gales":

茅屋为秋风所破歌
杜甫
八月秋高风怒号,卷我屋上三重茅。茅飞渡江洒江郊,高者挂罥长林梢,下者飘转沉塘坳。南村群童欺我老无力,忍能对面为盗贼。公然抱茅入竹去,唇焦口燥呼不得,归来倚仗自叹息。俄倾风定云墨色,秋天漠漠向昏黑。布衾多年冷似铁,娇儿恶卧踏里裂。床头屋漏无干处,雨脚如麻未断绝。自经丧乱少睡眠,长夜沾湿何由彻!安得广厦千万间,大庇天下寒士俱欢颜,风雨不动安如山。呜呼!何时眼前突兀见此屋,吾庐独破受冻死亦足!
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Oct, 2004 12:59 pm
Dear Oristar,
Ahhh, so you DO know what a Girl Scout is! Very Happy

Well, it has taken me some time but I would say that Chengdu, in Sichuan province, is 450 miles directly west of Yichang in the Hubei province. Is the Chongquing province a new one? It didn't seem to be on my maps though they are very old and have strange outdated names. Chengdu is also called Chengtu and Hwayang... and Yichang is called Ichang. That was a tough exercise for me without a new good map, but I am glad to do it. (I don't think you are lazy, I think you are hoping I'll LEARN something.) I suppose you would have said 650 km. or so?

The Chinese printing is back... I can see it! I have emailed it to myself so that it will be in large print, which makes it much easier for me to decipher. I wonder if it will be delivered properly? If I were to learn to recite Chinese than I'm sure I'd need an adult education class. That is a good idea.

I am now looking at a website about Yichang and it says there are
Quote:
four distinct seasons, with the best times to travel there being spring and autumn.


As always, the spring and fall are the gentle seasons.

It also listed these. If I were to go to China I'd be interested in seeing every one of these! I admire the World Heritage Program and think it is a good thing.
Quote:
What sites in China are listed in UNESCO's World Heritage Program?

Answer:

Name of Heritage Year of Recognition Location (Province)
The Great Wall 1987 Liaoning, Hebei, Tianjing, Beijing, Shanxi, Inner Mongolia, Shaanxi, Ningxia, Gansu
Mount Taishan 1987 Shandong
Forbidden City 1987 Beijing
Mogao Grottoes 1987 Gansu
Mausoleum of Qin Shi Huang and the Terra-cotta Army 1987 Shaanxi
Peking Man Site at Zhoukoudian 1987 Beijing
Mount Huangshan 1990 Anhui
Jiuzhaigou Scenic Area 1992 Sichuan
Huanglong Scenic Area 1992 Sichuan
Wulingyuan Scenic Area 1992 Hunan
Mountain Resort of Chengde and Its Outlying Temples 1994 Hebei
Confucius Temple, Mansion and Forest 1994 Shandong
Ancient Building Complex in the Wudang Mountains 1994 Hubei
Potala Palace 1994 Tibet
Mount Lushan 1996 Jiangxi
Mount Emeishan and Leshan Giant Buddha 1996 Sichuan
Old Town of Lijiang 1997 Yunnan
Ancient City of Pingyao 1997 Shanxi
Classical Gardens of Suzhou 1997 Jiangsu
Summer Palace 1998 Beijing
Temple of Heaven 1998 Beijing
Mount Wuyi 1999 Fujian
Dazu Rock Carvings 1999 Chongqing
Mount Qingchengshan and Dujiangyan Irrigation Project 2000 Sichuan
Ancient Xidi and Hongcun Village 2000 Anhui
Longmen Grottoes 2000 Henan
Imperial Tombs of the Ming and Qing Dynasties 2000 Hebei
Yungang Grottoes 2001 Shanxi
Norbulingka 2001 Tibet


It is funny you should mention that Real Estate merchants use Du Fu's poetry. That would be very unusual in the United States.

Best,
Piffka


Poem for the Day from Li Bai. I've posted it on another thread but it is so good, it is worth repeating. I do love the line "The moon doesn't know how to drink.":

Among the flowers, a single jug of wine;
I drink alone. No one close to me.
I raise my cup, invite the bright moon;
facing my shadow, together we make three.
The moon doesn't know how to drink;
and my shadow can only follow my body.
But for a time I make moon and shadow my companions;
taking one's pleasure must last until spring.
I sing--the moon wavers back and forth.
I dance--my shadow flickers and scatters.
When I'm sober we take pleasure together.
When I'm drunk, we each go our own ways.
I make an oath to journey forever free of feelings,
making an appointment with them to meet in the Milky Way afar.
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2004 09:00 am
Dear Piffka,

Yes, you've measured it correctly -- about 450 miles from Yichang to Chengdu. Chongqing is a municipality directly under the Central Government of China. I'm sorry the Wade-Giles romanization has given you a headache. Of course I would use km instead of mile, because it is one of the most popular units in China.

You said large print is good for you to learn Chinese, but I am confused why not you use "text zoom" in your browser to enlarge Chinese characters?

The WH Program would make you fly back and forth in China. Hmm, interesting.

Li Bai is very cool. So romantic among the flowers, he drank alone; yet the poor lonesome situation still awarded him a good poem. I envy this.

Best,
Oristar


PS. The Chinese version of Li Bai's poem quoted by you:
月下独酌
花间一壶酒,独酌无相亲。
举杯邀明月,对影成三人。
月既不解饮,影徒随我身。
暂伴月将影,行乐须及春。
我歌月徘徊,我舞影零乱。
醒时同交欢,醉后各分散。
永结无情游,相期邈云汉。
0 Replies
 
Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2004 11:31 pm
Dear Oristar,
Glad to find out that I was so close on those measurements... had to use the old scrap piece of paper folded to the right length method (too lazy to find a ruler).

"Text zoom?" Do Internet Explorer have that. (!?!) It is probably silly, but I save and send a lot of online things to my email address so that I can have them stored on my computer.

I don't know if the World Heritage site program would make me fly back and forth, but it looks like if I tried to see all those in one trip, I'd be exhausted.

I've spent a lot of time watching the moon today. I don't know if there was a lunar eclipse in China but we had a total eclipse here. Very early this morning, about 4:30am, the full moon lit up the landscape and woke me up. I had to go outside to stand in the open under the silver light.

As I was standing there I heard my big draft horse, Pearl, snort in the pasture behind me, so I opened her gate and patted her a bit. She wanted to be fed, but it was too early, so I let her come into the front yard with me. I've been learning how to paint with oils, so I encouraged her to walk in front of me. I was thinking I'd like to see what a black horse looks like in the moonlight* with my new "artiste" eyes. She stepped into the bright light and became very surprised to see her moon shadow. (Shades of Li Bai!)

She was very concerned and collected herself, arching her neck and intently looking at the thin dark shadow playing to the left of her feet. Then she began a rudimentary sidepass, side-stepping to the right with each step she took. She'd pause and then step to the right, and pause, and step to the right. I thought... hmmm, she seems afraid of her moon shadow. She was! Suddenly she wheeled and started runnning and kicking and ran behind me (for safety). It is a little alarming to have such a large animal running and kicking near you in the dark, even with moonlight! But I talked quietly to her and she stomped around a little more and then "chose" to walk in the shadows from the trees. Apparently her shadow wasn't such a good friend to her!

I hope that your day was equally enjoyable.

Best,
Piffka

There was a musician (you may have known) who was called Cat Stevens in his youth. He turned to religion as he grew older and is a serious Muslim man, now, but in his days of popularity he wrote a song that I liked. It's sort of a poem.

I'm being followed by a moon shadow
moon shadow - moon shadow
leaping and hopping on a moon shadow
moon shadow - moon shadow
and if I ever lose my hands
lose my plough, lose my land
oh, if I ever lose my hands
oh, if...
I won't have to work no more
and if I ever lose my eyes
if my colours all run dry
yes, if I ever lose my eyes
oh if...
I won't have to cry no more
yes, I'm being followed by a moon shadow
moon shadow - moon shadow
and if I ever lose my legs
I won't moan and I won't beg
oh if I ever lose my legs
oh if...
I won't have to walk no more
and if I ever lose my mouth
all my teeth, north and south
yes, if I ever lose my mouth
oh if...
I won't have to talk...
Did it take long to find me
I ask the faithful light
Did I take long to find me
and are you going to stay the night
I'm being followed by a moon shadow
moon shadow - moon shadow
leaping and hopping on a moon shadow
moon shadow - moon shadow...



*By the way, a black horse looks a little greenish in the bright moonlight!
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Oct, 2004 09:53 am
Dear Piffka,

Every browser has a 'Text zoom' button in "View" in menu bar, though the name of the buttom varies, like TZ in NN, "Size of Font" in IE etc. You can use it to enlarge any font.

As for one trip for all targets in China, maybe some travel agency could offer WH Program service. I don't know.

Poor Li Bai, his shades have been a draft horse's moon shadow?
I think Li Bai was ofter drunk, and called himself as an immortal of wine. Has the immortal flied to the US to be there?

But it is very cool to ride on a big horse in pasture. Ride high, on right way! Enjoy, dear Piffka. Yes my day could be enjoyable. Happiness, when it comes to a philosopher's eye, the poor and the rich are alike, because happiness depends on how you look at your life. Success gives your a bed of roses, while hardship makes your perfectness.

That is a good song, indeed. I especially appreciated 'I ask the faithful light". I'd like to what the light told him. Very Happy

Best,
Oristar
0 Replies
 
 

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