I would never declaw a cat... it leaves them defenseless.
I don't understand why anyone would want a cat if they have to have their claws removed.
I train my cats with water-squirt bottles, and it works very well.
an indoor cat does not need to use its claws indoors because it won't need to defend itself. cats will just use their claws for scratching, and if they decide not use a scratching post, they'll use the corner of the couch. why not have the claws removed with a relatively simple procedure? this can be done at the same time they are spayed/neutered. if they are outdoor, then the claws should be left in because at some point a cat will have to defend itself. leaving the claws in an outdoor cat will also prevent infection. is it barbaric or inhumane to remove tonsils? no, its a common practice, and so is declawing. there's nothing wrong with it.
as to bobbing and cropping, i believe both are non barbaric. For those who own great danes, you understand that their tails can feel like broomsticks when you get hit with it when they get excited. the ear cropping originated back when dogs were bred to hunt, and this kept the ears from getting bitten by boars and such. it became a breed standard by the time they were imported to the us. There isn't any reason to crop ears nowadays, unless you're showing the dog, but its not barbaric. The dog leads a perectly normal life with cropped ears. most people would opt not to because it costs so much money. but its not barbaric.
gsutphin11 wrote:an indoor cat does not need to use its claws indoors because it won't need to defend itself. cats will just use their claws for scratching, and if they decide not use a scratching post, they'll use the corner of the couch. why not have the claws removed with a relatively simple procedure? this can be done at the same time they are spayed/neutered. if they are outdoor, then the claws should be left in because at some point a cat will have to defend itself. leaving the claws in an outdoor cat will also prevent infection. is it barbaric or inhumane to remove tonsils? no, its a common practice, and so is declawing. there's nothing wrong with it.
as to bobbing and cropping, i believe both are non barbaric. For those who own great danes, you understand that their tails can feel like broomsticks when you get hit with it when they get excited. the ear cropping originated back when dogs were bred to hunt, and this kept the ears from getting bitten by boars and such. it became a breed standard by the time they were imported to the us. There isn't any reason to crop ears nowadays, unless you're showing the dog, but its not barbaric. The dog leads a perectly normal life with cropped ears. most people would opt not to because it costs so much money. but its not barbaric.
What garunte do you have that a cat will never ever get outside. It happens. If they have no claws, they are practically defenseless.
My guarantee is that my cats are wimps. They are terrified of going outside.
On the flip side what guarantee do you have of an outdoor cat from getting hit by a car or being attacked by another animal. None. There are no 100% guarantees, but you can make certain changes in order to dramatically decrease these changes. Including making sure your cat is not nearby when you go in or out the house. Open the door only slightly when you enter, etc. Just some common sense moves. Also if you should only declaw front claws of a cat. One reason is for the balance, the second is so they can scoot up a tree if they do get outside and need to get away from a dog or other animal.
I'm aware of what one can do to keep a cat inside, but there are those rare occasions that they can sneak out.
How can a cat climb a tree with no front claws?
If you have to surgically alter your pet, then I don't think you should have a pet.
Those are some good links, and I did read them. It says that cats can still climb trees, but I can't imagine they could do that with the ease they would have with their front claws.
I've seen many cats scratch a dog's nose that got too close. I'd hate to have seen what could have happened if the cat couldn't do that.
I appreciate your info, and I'm glad its not as inhumane as I originally thought... but I'm still not sold on the idea. I think its the lazy way to save your furniture.
I agree Hood. I don't suggest it for saving furniture, especially if you have not tried other methods first. There are some reasons that are understandable to declaw a cat, but not simply to make your life easier or as a lazy way out of preventing clawing. I would always discuss this procedure thoroughly with a vet first. I typically do not promote any type of altering an animal unless there is a well thought out reason why it is necessary. I love my cats completely and would have ended up giving them up as an alternative to declawing. Luckily there were no issues and one cat is completely fat and lazy and the other is as sweet as ever.
I use to think that way, now my cat can not walk she has to have one leg amputated next week and her good pawl is swollen, I will never de claw a cat again, it is cruel and unusual behavior on us adults" josephine
Phoenix32890 wrote:
Craven- I think that a law banning the declawing of cats would be far too much government intervention into areas that do not belong to the government. From a practical standpoint, I think a ban would find many more kittens left in pounds waiting to be killed or experimented on. Eventually, there would be far less cats, because a believe that a good percentage of people would not keep a cat with claws in their homes.
I understand the feelings of some people that declawing may be painful for the cat, at first. But I have seen too many homes that were ruined because of the claws of some overzealous cat.
The reality is that that some people love cats, but would not put up with having their furniture destroyed. My son adores cats, has three, and they are all declawed. IMO, they are none the worse for wear.
Years ago, I had a cat for a short time. He would wake me up, by jumping on me when I was sleeping, and tearing at my face with his claws. After a few days of this, and a bottle or two of iodine, I had to give him away. At the time I was young, and didn't really know about declawing. If I had, I probably would have kept the cat. Except for his peculiar habit, he WAS a sweetie!
When people domesticated animals, and took them into their homes as pets, there had to be some compromise, so that the two species could live together. Maybe declawing is not the best situation for the cat, but it sure beats scrounging around the streets for food!
Phoenix32890 wrote:
Maybe declawing is not the best situation for the cat, but it sure beats scrounging around the streets for food!
I think cats would be better off in the streets than with an owner such as yourself, if you think they OWE you. Cats come with nails. Easy as that. If you don't like them, clip them. Just like a dog's. I foster cats/kittens because of ignorant people who let their animals breed incessantly, when there are no homes for them. If i can clip 140 nails (7 cat/kittens) a few times a week, there's no reason why a person can't clip the nails of one or two cats every couple weeks.
We just adopted a kitten from a local shelter.
My kids say that the selection process is a
"beauty contest". There were so many older
homeless cats there that it was quite pitiful. I would
prefer that they are adopted and declawed than
put down.
I agree that declawing should not be taken lightly and a vet experienced at this process should only do it. I know many people who have declawed their cats and never had an issue; that is not to say that there are not risks, however, there are also risks with any type of surgical procedure. What you need to do is way the benefits and risks. I would not suggest declawing a cat unless there is a strong need - in other words if it is between a home for a kitty or being put down as shepaints notes.
ossobuco wrote:Can you clip kitty nails?? Trying to picture this. Hit cat with brick..(sorry dlowan) and then file....
Actually, we had a cat who would let us trim his claws. He loved to be groomed, and as long as we were brushing him he'd let us do. Then again, we'd been doing it since he was a tiny kitten. It's definitely something you have to start early on.
our Maine Coon loves grooming and wouldnt think of harming the furniture. he uses his claws to intimidate , and get your attention. Our street cat that we rescued was taking out his urges on a Stickley setee. Im sorry, but gustav wins. We had "lucky" declawed and hes no worse, hes a happy cat with no ill effects, physical or mental.
I think this growing movement of animals as "equal companions" is insane. They live in the moment and , as far as Im able to read, have little capability for abstract thought and long range planning.
If the companion move,ment goes much farther, were going to not be able to afford veterinarian services because of the fear of lawsuits by anaimal "rights" groups who, while well meaning, are just out of touch with the concept of speciation. We, as the (up to now) pinnacle species, set the rules.
We neuter animals as a personal health priority and societal control. Nobody seems to be against that
we give breeds of all kinds of animals many ridiculous accout/s and shaving
We neuter livestock and draft animals
weve crearted heretofore unnatural species and varieties(where the hell do you think all these cat breeds came from, wAL MART?) weve diddled with their genetics to comply with our wants and conformity desires
We take care of about 8 cats, 2 of which live in the house and one is declawed because of he was a street raised sociopath.
All our cats are neuterd ( anybody cool withn that?)
we have 3 dogs, 2 of which are neutered and the female border collie had a litter and we chose not to neuter her at 5 years age
we have 150 Corriedale sheep, all of whome are polled when needed and the majority of males are castrated
we have 14 Dexter and Highland and 2 angus , all of whom are castrated,(the cows are artificially inseminated rather than serviced) (kids cross our pastures and can get hurt by 1200 pounds of a high velocity meat train.
To be criticized for "declawing" and cast as a person who "shouldnt have animals by some who have no idea in hell whaat the harms/benefits are" is just too much thinking with your feelings and not your brain
I like to talk about pets and **** but this, castigation by some of you is based purely upon ignorance and selective memory when it comes to how
we as a species, treat our animal friends.(some we love and some we eat
i hope that, when my time comes to put me in a home, Ill be treated with as much care as is given to our animals.
BTW, whenever weve had a procedure like this done, our vet , who is a great animal person himself (he raises a pack of hunting hounds )and has a passle of cats on his farm, he too parallels what eva has so wisely said about declawing.HE will not do cosmetic alterations like cropping tails or ear clipping, but he will do dew claw removal, which is the removal of a vestigial appendage which can cause pain and loss of limb if torn off and infected
Just thinking of it gives me shivers
weve genetically altered cows to have bigger longer teats so the milking machines can better fit. Ever see a holstein in a field with a huge bag? Until the 1950s the average lactofactory of a cow was about 1/3 the size it is today. lets get the farmers for depraved mammary inflation
What makes me sad is when people adopt breeds
that are completely incompatable with urban life...... and then, blame the irreconcilable differences on the dog!
yeh I agree. People in apartments should be more concerned about owning a Border Collie or Irish setter.
Border Collies have been quite "fashionable" for young girls and urban professionals. ANd its a shame to not allow these dogs the daily romp and working session they need. A tired Border Collie is a content one.
my vet friend had to put down an irish that got just whacky from a number of causes. It was inbred, it was kept in a small area and walked once a day on a leash. It got neurotic and bit someone. My vet wanted to take it but the bitee demanded the ultimate retribution afforded him by the laws of the state.
We helped save a boxer who, after being severely neglected and beaten for the first 2 years of life was defensive to everyone. She growled and slunk in her cage. We had the dog for about a week and after about 3 days of just sitting near her and slowly getting closer, all of a sudden this happy exposively loving dog with the biggest heartbreaking whine and begging manner emerged. Th dog would wag her entire body My secretary and her kids and husband just fell in love with her-- and this dog now is the greatest , friendliest, most protective member of their family. Its true that some people should not own animals but that sentence needs to be pronounced after a host of factors are known . Lucky(the declawed one) is sitting behind me on the back of my chair. every time I lean back I get a head bump from him, he knows that , since Ive been on the computer writing today, Im soon gonna be running the printer and printer time is major fun watching sheets come shooting out. Every 10th one or so gets some teeth marks but its only aa manuscript and it gets mailed home to the office for final format and production, so everybody down there can recognize lucky"s teeth prints
I remember Lucky, what a cat!
We had an irish, found him skin and bones at a lumber yard. He perked right up at our house. My ex used to spend a lot of time walking with him in obedience mode - we had a school lawn across the street, so it was pretty much their parade - but they'd also go for nice long runs. A sight to see, a happy irish setter running along. After Kelly died, we never got another dog because hub's heart was never over the loss.
