6
   

The New State Religion: Atheism

 
 
momoends
 
  2  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 02:33 am
@Leadfoot,
demanding lgtb right to marry to be illegal based on God´s will for marriage to be between a man and a woman is Indoctrination
Religion being a compulsory subject at schools is Indoctrination
demanding abortion to be illegal based of Catholic Church believes is Indoctrination
Pressing a government to approve or ban a new law depending whether it suits their believes or not is Indoctrination
Having certain % of a country´s taxes being giving to their organization by law is Indoctrination
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 06:21 am
@momoends,
Any societal rules about marriage are indoctrination. You really don't think your views about marriage (or about how sex is regulated) isn't due to your indoctrination?

The idea that 21st century society isn't based on indoctrination is ridiculous.

Momoend's beliefs are due to her indoctrination, the same as all the rest of us.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:09 am
@momoends,
If you knew God, you would know what freedom from indoctrination really is.

Take for example your issue of marriage.

Marriage is a relationship that exists between 2 (or more if you like) people.
No-one can control that since a relationship exists in the minds of those people. You cannot ban a way of thinking.

Unless you give some government the power to control what you believe a relationship is or should be or you have some need of validation from others, there is no way for anyone or any government or any religion to ban any marriage.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:19 am
@Leadfoot,
Quote:
If you knew God, you would know what freedom from indoctrination really is.


Bravo Leadfoot! That is the funniest thing ever written on Able2Know.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:22 am
@maxdancona,
I thought you'd like that!
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:22 am
@Leadfoot,
I think you are wrong about what marriage means. Marriage is a legal/cultural contract between two people that is accepted by society (and perhaps by some deity).

There is a deep emotional sexual bond that forms between two people. It is fueled by passion by brain chemistry.

Let me ask you Leadfoot. What if this sexual bond and deep mutual attraction happens between you and someone other than the person to whom you are legally married?

Which "marriage" is the real one?



farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:31 am
@Leadfoot,
Since the town of Dayton Tenn had installed a statue of William Jennings Bryan in the town square (To honor his role in the Scopes "Trial"), atheists hve organized and have been pushing to have another statue (this one of the other guy). Its almost BELIEF that the scopes trial was some honored "battle" between science nd Religion. Honoring Bryn for his many achievements (Scopes aside), is still agood gesture to this man's memory (Especially in the south). Smooshing it up with another statue doesnt resolve anything. If they want a statue to the Scopes fiasco and what it really stood for, there should be statue of Sen BUTLER, who wrote and pushd for all the anti science laws for school curricula, which stood in plce until the 1960's. It was the Butler ACts that drew the "Curtin Call" for a sham trial to get some action on the books to repeal Butler
Forcing a statue of Clarence Darrow is, to me, just a tourit draw like the "Scary Lucy" statue of Lucille Ball in her home town in New York State.

Dayton TEnn still hs form of that historic soda fountin/snck hop/drugstore under some bigss trees. Thats enough of a draw. We dont need NO statues to tart it up. Those interested already know the facts, those not interested have the milk shake shop.

0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:33 am
@maxdancona,
yeh but I think you nd Leadfoots are reading it from totally different poles .(Otherwise I think hed a worded it better)
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:36 am
@Leadfoot,
Do you not think that bringing kids to church and telling them they will burn in hell forever if they don't believe what they are being told is indoctrination? Or do you think that simply doesn't happen. Because I can tell you from personal direct experience that it happens all the time.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:52 am
@maxdancona,
Quote:
@Leadfoot,
I think you are wrong about what marriage means. Marriage is a legal/cultural contract between two people that is accepted by society (and perhaps by some deity).

Could it be that you believe that only because you have been indoctrinated?

Quote:
There is a deep emotional sexual bond that forms between two people. It is fueled by passion by brain chemistry.

This 'passion' needs more definition. Is it the same as or part of brain chemistry? Or?

Quote:
Let me ask you Leadfoot. What if this sexual bond and deep mutual attraction happens between you and someone other than the person to whom you are legally married?

Which "marriage" is the real one?

You have introduced a completely different relationship into the question of marriage - that of the contractual relationship, so this is not a simple question.

But ignoring the legality aspect of the scenario, it simply means you now love one more person. You may or may not want to include them in your marriage. Marriage implies a degree of cooperative effort beyond just love.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:52 am
@farmerman,
That's what makes it funny Farmerman. Just read it for what it is and enjoy the humor.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:55 am
@maxdancona,
"I never knew what indoctrination was, till Jesus taught me"

Somethin like that?? Smile
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 09:56 am
@Leadfoot,
Marriage has a definition in our culture (and most culture). This is a culturally and legally regulated institution.

When I got married, I (with my partner) went to City Hall to apply for a license. We had to provide documents and answer legal questions under penalty of perjury. I don't remember exactly what was asked... but I do remember laughing at some of the questions (regarding whether we were cousins etc.).

I was having sex with this woman long before the legal process. The brain chemistry had already taken root, we were emotionally bonded (at that point at least). Yet we did not consider ourselves married until after completing the legal process (nor did anyone else).

Our society regulates marriage. We have rules about who can marry whom. We have laws about the obligations of married people, and the rights of married people.

Later in life... when I went through the legal process of divorce, I saw this at work.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 10:25 am
@rosborne979,
Quote:
@Leadfoot,
Do you not think that bringing kids to church and telling them they will burn in hell forever if they don't believe what they are being told is indoctrination? Or do you think that simply doesn't happen. Because I can tell you from personal direct experience that it happens all the time.

As I qualified in my statements about it, no-one who believed in God or knew God would attempt to indoctrinate anyone. So I can only conclude that those who threatened their children with hell did not believe or know God.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 10:37 am
@maxdancona,
Quote:
Our society regulates marriage. We have rules about who can marry whom. We have laws about the obligations of married people, and the rights of married people

Max, I get it, you buy into this society's definitions. I don't. But we are talking 'religion' here. That's just you and me talking about what could and ought to be.

If you havent imagined better than 'society', try harder.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 11:39 am
@Leadfoot,
There is no religion without society. Religion comes from society.

Humans evolved as social creatures. That is how humans work.

Society is all we have. There is nothing else.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 11:42 am
@Leadfoot,
I'm a late-comer and have not read all the posts. However, I submit the following.
Some scientific findings are theories while others are facts that cannot be disputed.
What are you talking about?
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 01:16 pm
@Leadfoot,
So you agree that what I described is indoctrination. And I'm guessing that you realize that millions of Christians do exactly what I described. So you agree that it's commonplace for Christians to indoctrinate children.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 02:01 pm
@rosborne979,
Rosborne,

We all pass down our beliefs and values to our children. I agree with you that what Christians do is indoctrination. The question I am asking is is how is this any different what secular Atheists do?

Every society survives by passing values and beliefs to the next generation. Without indoctrination the society dies.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Aug, 2016 02:12 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
Every society survives by passing values and beliefs to the next generation.
I'm not really sure if "passing" is the correct word - but I don't know a really alternative either.

I think, you somehow inherit the religion or non-religion of your parents here in Germany, but you can legally decide from age of 14 onwards, if you want to change your religion (that's joining a church/religion or leaving it - without consent of the parents)
 

Related Topics

 
Copyright © 2019 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.05 seconds on 10/13/2019 at 05:00:19