The Waco Massacre

Janet Reno screwed the pooch. That's what happened.

Could you back that McGentrix?

Actually McG...it was the wacky leader of that cult David Koresch who was screwing children in the religious compound. Koresch and the nutty adults who supported his evil deserved everything they got. The poor children were the innocent victims of those religious zealots.

Wow! That's something I would envision someone like SWolf saying, not a liberal!

Now, it does seem that - reading his biography - David Koresh was not the most sane person alive. He already tried to kill Lois Roden's son George. A person also capable of starting a shooting, or is this too much of a speculation?

No question he was a wack job, but it seems that the FBI was a tad heavy handed. Not as bad as Ruby Ridge though.

From what I remember, the compound had been cordoned off for like 2 months. The FBI had been using loud music and search lights to keep the Davidians off balance and afraid. they had shut down all the outside utilities and were trying to get the Davidians to surrender as they had a warrant for Koresh's arrest. (Seems a lot like the current situation in Najaf now that I think about it...). After a period of time, it became obvious that Koresh was not willing to cooperate, so the FBI, under Reno's orders attempted an assault on the compound which ended horribly for everyone involved.

both Ruby Ridge and Waco are excellent examples of government authority exceeding reason; just goes to show you that terrorsim is what governments do to their own citizens. albeit even wacko citizens. Even yet, it's hard to compare Ruby Ridge or Waco to the Sand Creek Massacre or Ruby Valley in how our government has handled "problems"

I got this from a website, and I'm curious whether there are people here who have seen the documentary 'Waco: A New Revelation' and know the answers on these questions.

link

McG:


I guess it all depends on perspective.


(I'm not sure either of those offerings has enough grey to be real)

But what went wrong during the siege? How come 74 people, among them 21 children, died?

I have mixed emotions about Waco, Rick. I heard David Koresch talking to the sheriff, and joking around with him about the fact that his name was Lynch. Although Koresch had a stockpile of weapons, they were all legally obtained. He didn't hole up in the fortress, so he could have been arrested anytime without going through that horror.

If I'm not mistaken, Bill Clinton said the Waco debacle was his biggest regret as president.

I think the worst move was by the Alcohol, tobacco, and firearms group. Had I been in charge, I would have the seige still continue until those children were saved.

Now, I've also come up with this link, stating that 'the self-proclaimed messiah [David Koresh] used the sect as a cover for rape'.

Koresh's "legally obtained" weapons included many AR15's which had been illegally modified. Koresh refused an interview with ATF agents, and then threatened to shoot any ATF agents who showed up on the compound. ATF had been notified of the illegal weapon's modifications (a device which allows the trigger to be mechanically tripped, allowing a rate of fire near that of a fully automatic military assault rifle) by the local police. When ATF did go to the compound, Koresh's boys opened fire on them.

The Branch Davidians are a rather screwy, small sect. But David Koresh was not the be all and end all of the Davidians, and the rest of the sect repudiated him. It is highly likely that Koresh had already planned to immolate himself and his group. This has been quite common down throughout history, and was very widespread in the forests of northern Russia, when the "Old Believers" opposed to the reforms of the Patriarch Nikkon would barricade themselves in their churches and immolate themselves rather than surrender to the Tsar's authority.

I see what Koresh did in terms of his following as no different than the actions of Jim Jones and his followers in Jonestown.

Setanta views it very nearly the same as I. The government could have waited much longer than it did, but, chances are, the result would have been the same.

Well, whatever Setanta says is obviously the truth. I just think Of McVeigh's eyes as he looks into the camera of collateral damage.

No children were killed by religious zealots at Waco. The children were innocent victims of Janet Reno and the BATF, who needed only to nab Koresh on one of his frequent trips to the local 7-11.

Yes, Koresh was a bit up a nut job; but then I think all religious zealots are nut jobs. He may or may not have been having sex with all the young(teen) females, but then it seems as though most male cult leaders do. Koresh didn't hole himself up in the compound, in fact if memory serves he was in town the day the standoff began. Why wasn't he picked up while in town?
The explosions and fires were caused by people outside attacking people inside. Didn't anyone else see the FLEER(forward-looking infrared) footage? Reflections of sunlight aren't going to show up as a heat signature as firearm rounds will; some "experts" were trying to say that those heat sources came from reflection. How stupid do they think people are? They sent in a noxious gas, they shot at people inside, and the gas caught fire. When people were trying to escape it showed up(in the FLEER footage) that they were being fired upon. Mind you, children and old people were totally disabled by the gas, so they couldn't even try to escape.
They wouldn't even wait until Koresh was finished with his manuscript. They had absolutely no plan to kill themselves when the manuscript was done. But, let's say for the sake of argument that they were going to kill themselves when the manuscript was done, how would that differ from the outcome that did occur? No, they could have left a skeleton crew observing the compound, when someone tried to leave they could have taken that person into custody. I think they should have just picked him up in town in the first place.

I got this from a website, and I'm curious whether there are people here who have seen the documentary 'Waco: A New Revelation' and know the answers on these questions.[/quote]

I haven't seen the documentary, but if I recall correctly, Hillary Clinton had something to do with setting up some crisis center for the Waco situation inside the White House, and it was Linda Tripp alleged that it was Hillary who ordered Janet Reno to act... but I don't recall Reno or anybody else credible claiming Hillary had done so...

Koresh was loony. He believed he would live again, just like Jesus, so wasn't afraid of death for himself... He believed God spoke directly to him, for other people as well as himself. The peaceful ending God predicted at Waco not happening didn't shake his faithful followers who still await Koresh's return to this day...