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Sun 15 Aug, 2004 08:58 am
DES MOINES -- Sen. Tom Harkin called Vice President Dick Cheney a "coward" for avoiding service in Vietnam and called on President Bush to end the "backdoor draft."
The Iowa Democrat was responding Friday to the call-up of a Des Moines police officer who has already completed his eight-year military commitment.
Harkin echoed comments earlier this week by Des Moines Police Chief William McCarthy, who said the military's treatment of Des Moines Police Officer Rodell Nydam was "evil."
Nydam, 26, is being called back to Iraq despite finishing his National Guard commitment in April. He's being called up under the military's "stop loss" exemption, which can extend duty in wartime.
Harkin, who served as a jet pilot in the Navy, said the exemption wasn't intended for situations like the war in Iraq. He said first responders like Nydam are needed to protect the community.
"The part of the U.S. code that provides for this anticipates major wars, major national emergencies," Harkin said. "That is not what we're confronting right now. You think about using this law only in (extreme cases), only when we're really in dire, dire need."
Harkin also shot back at Cheney, who said in a visit to Iowa on Tuesday that presidential candidate John Kerry lacks a basic understanding of the war on terrorism and cannot make America safer.
He noted that Cheney had several student deferments that allowed him to skip serving in Vietnam.
"When I hear this coming from Dick Cheney, who was a coward, who would not serve during the Vietnam War, it makes my blood boil," Harkin said. "Those of us who served and those of us who went in the military don't like it when someone like a Dick Cheney comes out and he wants to be tough. Yeah, he'll be tough. He'll be tough with somebody else's blood, somebody else's kids. But not when it was his turn to go."
I ldon't like to cut and paste but I liked this one...hit the nail on the head....
gosh Cheney hs really shocked me on this one, it's so unlike him! I wonder where he was Xmas of '68?
probably out trying to collect protection money from Salvation Army Santas....
well, he always said "charity begins at home"
BPB
BPB, you just made me spit my morning orange juice all over my computer screen with that one.
What a mess!
BBB
after all Santa was an illegal alien and no doubt from one those those socialist countries.
Dys
You betcha, Dys, only a commie santa would have a reindeer with a red nose.
BBB
in John Nicholas new book, Cheney is portrayed as a cynical manipulator of the draft system because , in his own words
'I had other priorities in the 60's"
Read the new essay in the September Vanity Fair on Bush, Cheney and the rest of the croonies by the historian Niall Ferguson. He compares Bush to Henry V.
A great Niall Ferguson essay
Another great Niall Ferguson essay: What is Power? It will help you understand why France and Germany are trying to bolster the EU as a counter-balance to the US and what's behind their opposition to many US foreign policies.
http://www.hooverdigest.org/032/ferguson.html
Do we now believe that applying for draft deferments during Vietnam was wrong? Just checking.
In my own case, my draft lottery number was high enough (363) that they just never got around to me.
I believe that if Cheney didn't think fighting for his country was a priority then, he has no right to demand that priority from others now.
I believe that through his public example Cheney wants to project as a tough guy, a warrior or at least a person who values the warrior mentality, and denigrates and attempts to humiliate those who deviate from this narrow path of belief for his own benefit and yet when he had the opportunity to display these qualities in real time chose not to do so and did not recognize the priority of it.
I don't want anyone watching my ass whose only interest is watching their own. Of what good is that to me or mine?
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:I believe that if Cheney didn't think fighting for his country was a priority then, he has no right to demand that priority from others now.
I believe that through his public example Cheney wants to project as a tough guy, a warrior or at least a person who values the warrior mentality, and denigrates and attempts to humiliate those who deviate from this narrow path of belief for his own benefit and yet when he had the opportunity to display these qualities in real time chose not to do so and did not recognize the priority of it.
I don't want anyone watching my ass whose only interest is watching their own. Of what good is that to me or mine?
So,can we take it then that the other members of the Bush Cabinet,the ones that are decorated combat veterans,the ones supporting the war,that its ok for them to call for more troops,and you accept their comments that the war is neccessary?
The idea that a president or vice president who wasn't in the military has no right to use it is ludicrous. The use of the army should be determined only by the need for its use. Clinton wasn't in the military, but he used it a lot, and appropriately, e.g. to stop the ethnic cleansing in Kosovo. Howard Dean obtained a deferrment from the Vietnam War. If he had been elected, he wouldn't have had the right to act as commander-in-chief? That theory is preposterous.
Brandon Mystery
Thats not what they said. They said he hasent the right to call a decorated war hero a coward when he was too CS to go to war himself because he had other priorties. And futher perhaps you need to check how many of the Bush bunch went to Vietnaum.
Re: Dick Cheney Called A Coward....I Couldn't Agree More
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:Yeah, he'll be tough. He'll be tough with somebody else's blood, somebody else's kids. But not when it was his turn to go."
Daaaaamn! He just verbally "bitch slapped" Cheney!
Thanks rabel but I've got it.....I don't think decorated combat veterans in the cabinet are correct that this war is useful or necessary....I will never agree with them....but I can honor their service to their country and am at least willing to give them a respectful listen whether I agree with them or not......because they earned the right to their opinion through service to their country....can't say the same for Cheney......exactly what should I honor Cheney for?
What's really ludicrous is the idea that a President, Vice President or one of his lackeys and followers should lay claim to the right to use their power to declare a war and run it their way while denigating, humiliating and minimizing the ideas and service of someone who has actually been in combat, someone who, as they are so fond of pointing out, was much wealthier and privileged than they, and yet still volunteered, just because their ideas are different.
You cannot spew venom and hatefulness from your crooked mouth and expect anything else in return.
Real warriors follow the creed of no quarter given none asked for, not no quarter given to others but don't pick on me.
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:Thanks rabel but I've got it.....I don't think decorated combat veterans in the cabinet are correct that this war is useful or necessary....I will never agree with them....but I can honor their service to their country and am at least willing to give them a respectful listen whether I agree with them or not......because they earned the right to their opinion through service to their country....can't say the same for Cheney......exactly what should I honor Cheney for?
What's really ludicrous is the idea that a President, Vice President or one of his lackeys and followers should lay claim to the right to use their power to declare a war and run it their way while denigating, humiliating and minimizing the ideas and service of someone who has actually been in combat, someone who, as they are so fond of pointing out, was much wealthier and privileged than they, and yet still volunteered, just because their ideas are different.
You cannot spew venom and hatefulness from your crooked mouth and expect anything else in return.
Real warriors follow the creed of no quarter given none asked for, not no quarter given to others but don't pick on me.
But what you actually said, I think, was that someone who hasn't served in the military has no right to order it used.
Brandon9000 wrote:
Quote:In my own case, my draft lottery number was high enough (363) that they just never got around to me.
So, why didn't you volunteer? I did. John Kerry did. A bunch of folks on this board did. Some of us came out feeling a bit different about our government's use of the military, I did, John Kerry did. So how come you and Dick didn't come with us? I know, he had other commitments, but who cares about how high your number was, where the heck were you?
Inquiring minds want to know.
Joe
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