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Bernie Sanders Single-Payer Healthcare plan

 
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jan, 2016 11:02 am
@maxdancona,
Actually I am not thinking of Hillary when I am speaking of Bernie, Hillary is my second choice, but there is difference in fighting same sex marriage and fighting health care policies. To deny someone rights based on their sexual orientation is discrimination. Health Care is different but I am not sure I am articulate enough to explain it. I see health care in the same category as I do other services such as roads and highways, public schools and things like that. It is more a fiscal decision than a civil rights issue.

Hillary has said the present health care system needs to be improved, I believe she will work to make that happen despite any of her ties to insurance companies. Nearly all politicians receive donations, that does not translate to their decision making process unless there is proof to their contrary.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jan, 2016 11:11 am
@revelette2,
Hillary will preside over the insurance takeover that is going on now. She says whatever the polls point her to say these days, but I dismiss her as an innovator. Sanders is the only candidate seeking to actually improve healthcare.
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jan, 2016 11:53 am
@edgarblythe,
I accept you feel that way, however, I do not see Hillary in the same light, nor do I think Sanders is the only who has interest in the seeking to improve health care. Nor do I think his plan will succeed.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  2  
Reply Mon 18 Jan, 2016 09:37 pm
@maxdancona,
I want a president who will be willing to drop their high flying socialist ideas in order to get passed laws in congress that will help all the citizens. Even the democrat congressmen are not going to go for socialist ideas. Congress has been cutting taxes ever since it became republican so tell me where is Bernie going to get the money for universal health care and sending every kid to collage and all the other good ideas he has. Can he afford to give up his proposals and be elected to a second term?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jan, 2016 09:45 pm
@RABEL222,
http://www.nelsdrums.com/portfolio/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/00-Spring-Fling-2011-v7-494x296.jpg
RABEL222
 
  3  
Reply Tue 19 Jan, 2016 11:35 pm
@maxdancona,
This is what we have been doing for the last 65 years. Dropping the cost of government on our kids while we live high on the hog.
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 07:54 am
One big problem with Medicare for all: Medicare coverage isn’t that great

Quote:
Bernie Sanders has talked a lot about a "Medicare for all" plan, releasing a proposal last Sunday for a public health plan that would cover all Americans.

But when you look at the details of the plan and the structure of health benefits there, it becomes clear that Sanders's plan isn't Medicare at all. Sanders seems to use "Medicare for all" as a catchall term to describe a publicly run insurance program. My colleague Ezra Klein wrote about that in detail here: (click on the source for link embedded in the article)

Sanders calls his plan "Medicare for all." But it actually has nothing to do with Medicare. He's not simply expanding Medicare coverage to the broader population — he makes that clear when he says his plan means "no more copays, no more deductibles"; Medicare includes copays and deductibles. The list of what Sanders's plan would cover far exceeds what Medicare offers, suggesting, more or less, that pretty much everything will be covered, under all circumstances.

But there's another key fact to understanding the Medicare-for-all debate, one that I didn't fully appreciate until reading this piece from Matthew Martin. It's the fact that Medicare coverage isn't actually that great. And if we really did extend Medicare to cover all Americans, a lot of people would likely find themselves quite disappointed with the benefits.

Medicare has high copays — especially for hospital visits

When we talk about Medicare, we're usually talking about three different programs: Part A, which covers hospital visits, Part B, which covers outpatient services, and Part D for prescription drugs.

"On deductibles, Medicare is pretty reasonable: $1,288 deductible for Part A and merely $166 for Part B," Martin writes. "It's everything after the deductible that's crappy."

Take, for example, copays for hospital visits. For the first 60 days, the patient does not pay anything. But after that, it starts to get expensive: Starting on day 61, patients are expected to pay $322 for each day of hospital care. On day 91, the price doubles to a minimum of $644. Eventually, a Medicare beneficiary is responsible for all hospital costs.




The same structure applies to stays in nursing homes: The first 20 days are covered, and after that there is a copay of $161 per day. After 100 days in a nursing home, the patient is responsible for all costs.

This is really different from how private insurance works under Obamacare. Right now health plans that cover people younger than 65 are barred from putting a limit on hospital stay coverage.

Most seniors won't ever need to use that many hospital or nursing home days. But some sicker patients will — and those prices will add up quickly. These are the exact sorts of catastrophic situations that are typically the whole point of buying insurance. Under Medicare, they're not covered.

Most seniors buy supplemental insurance to fill in Medicare's gaps

Eighty-eight percent of Medicare beneficiaries have some sort of other insurance that helps cover the things Medicare leaves out.

Low-income seniors are eligible to enroll in Medicaid, the public program that covers the poor. About 14 percent of Medicare beneficiaries do this.

Another quarter rely on employer-sponsored benefits, which they might have as retirees or because they're still working. Beyond that, 24 percent (9.3 million seniors) buy "Medigap" policies, which are insurance plans specifically designed to fill in these spaces in Medicare coverage. This works out to about one in four Medicare beneficiaries buying plans to cover the things that their insurance plans leave out.

These plans aren't especially cheap: Medigap premiums averaged $183 per month in 2010. They also provide a lot of coverage: All Medigap policies, for example, will cover any hospital co-insurance after the public plan's benefits have been exhausted.

Most Americans don't think of "Medicare for all" as a world where most of us still rely on our employers and private plans to pay our medical bills. But if we were to extend Medicare to the entire population and keep the program we've built for the elderly, this is the exact type of insurance system we'd be signing up for.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 07:57 am
@revelette2,
This is a weak argument for two reasons.

1) "Medicare for all" is the name of the program. This doesn't give the details. Attacking the name of a program without considering the details of the actual program isn't valid. A similar system in Canada works quite well... and we should be comparing Bernie's plan to that system.

2) The alternative isn't that great either. Right now, even with the ACA, we have small hospitals closing and premiums for many people rising. There are increasing number of people who now have healthcare, but are too far from providers for them to use it.

revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 08:01 am
@maxdancona,
Well, then, perhaps he should call it what it is, free health care for all. Sound too socialist for conservatives huh? I am not familiar with Canada's plan, nor I am familiar with the details in Sander's plan. I would need to study it, if it can be found?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 08:10 am
@revelette2,
He has published his plan which you can study all you want.

https://berniesanders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Medicare-for-All.pdf

And a longer explanation on his issues page

http://feelthebern.org/bernie-sanders-on-healthcare/
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 08:12 am
I hardly think the way Sander's plans to pay for the plan would appeal conservative and even democrat business owners.

Quote:
Here's a look at five key proposals from the senator's plan.

1. New payroll taxes

Sanders's plan would increase taxes on business owners. Instead of the current tax rate of 2.9 percent paid jointly by employees and employers for Medicare as part of payroll taxes, his plan would increase the rate to 6.2 percent. Hudak says that in order to pay for the increased payroll taxes, employers would likely pass the costs along to employees in the form of smaller wage increases, or even wage freezes.

2. Changes to employer-provided health care

The plan would close the tax loophole that allows employers to deduct the cost of health insurance plans for their employees. While most people would presumably not need employer-sponsored plans, the deduction would disappear for business owners who might want to offer alternatives to federal plans.

3. Individual taxes

Households would pay a 2.2 percent tax to fund premiums, with exemptions for low-income families. Middle-income workers are likely to feel the bite of the premium tax the most. "They are already in competition with other countries for wages, and this could be a problem," says Jim Kessler, senior vice president for policy and co-founder of Third Way, a centrist think tank.

4. More progressive income taxes
To raise revenue for the plan, Sanders would increase the top tax rate for those who earn between $500,000 and $2 million to 43 percent, up from the current top rate of 39.5 percent. Rates would rise to a top level of 52 percent for those earning income of $10 million or more.

5. Capital gains and estate tax changes

An additional source of funding would come from increasing the rate on capital gains, which is currently around 15 percent. Rates would go up by an unspecified amount for those making more than $250,000 annually. The richest Americans would pay a progressive tax on estates valued at more than $3.5 million, rather than the current 40 percent rate.



source

Again I say, why would republicans pass this plan when we barely passed the ACA when it goes against all their principles?
maxdancona
 
  3  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 08:42 am
@revelette2,
We want to have a president who will be upfront, honest about what we need, and work toward goal of single payer health care.

Electing Bernie Sanders doesn't guarantee that we will have Single Payer healthcare during his administration. Electing Hillary will guarantee that we won't even try.

We are electing Bernie Sanders for his integrity, his consistent focus addressing the economic injustice and the fact that he isn't being funded by Wall Street. A president doesn't have the power to do everything. A good president will use the power he or she has to do the right thing for the people he or she represents.

That is what the Bernie Sanders offers.
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 07:36 pm
@maxdancona,
I haven't said so, but I should. I really like what you're made of.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jan, 2016 09:01 pm
@Lash,
Thank you Lash. I haven't heard that much around here. I like having you around too.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 11:30 pm
@maxdancona,
So even though you know he is lying about his ability to get universal health care you will still vote for him?
Miller
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 01:26 am
As noted above, Medicare doesn't pay for everything. In general what Medicare doesn't pay for, a Medicare Advantage Plan ( through an Insurance company) must be bought.

Another aspect of Medicare , often ignored by many individuals, is the fact that many physicians refuse to take Medicare patients, because the fees paid to the physicians by the Government for treatment of Medicare patients are too low.

Moreover, many physicians will not take either Medicare or any health insurance as payment for care.. They take only cash.

There is no law in the US that states that physicians must take Medicare patients, just as there is no law that states that physicians must treat those without insurance, or those living in poverty-stricten urban areas infested with rats, guns and crime.

If there is a plan to have Medicare for all in the US, the physicians will be paid by the US government and will become federal employees, if they decide to continue treating Medicare patients. If specialists become medical Federal employees, do you really think the Government will be willing to pay them the annual salaries ( $350,000-$600,000+) they usually receive in today's market? I don't.

Today, there is a growing shortage of quality physicians in the US. With the installation of a univeral single payer plan ( Medicare) for treatment of the elderly and others, the shortage of physicians will become even more extreme.

The absolute number of physicians isn't decreasing today but the total number of patients seeking medical care has increased dramatically because of Obamacare.

Even with Obamacare, a significant number of individuals still receive most of their medical care via the ER at a very high cost.

Medicare for all is not the way to cure the problems associated with the provision of health care today in the US.

Moreover, stop and think...do the very rich receive the same sort of health care that is received by those in the lower or middle classes, even today with Obamacare? Of course not!

0 Replies
 
Miller
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 01:28 am
@RABEL222,
RABEL222 wrote:

So even though you know he is lying about his ability to get universal health care you will still vote for him?


I wouldn't .I'd vote for Trump, before I voted for Sanders.
Miller
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 01:33 am
@RABEL222,
RABEL222 wrote:

This is what we have been doing for the last 65 years. Dropping the cost of government on our kids while we live high on the hog.


You may be living "high on the hog", but most Americans are beating their asses off each and every day trying to earn a living, put food on the table and have evnough cash left over for an occassional movie or even a beer.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 07:43 am
@Miller,
Miller wrote:

RABEL222 wrote:

So even though you know he is lying about his ability to get universal health care you will still vote for him?


I wouldn't .I'd vote for Trump, before I voted for Sanders.


Who would you vote for if it were Trump vs. Clinton?
Or perhaps more interesting Fiorina vs. Clinton?
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 09:51 am
@maxdancona,
I could be wrong, but I seem to remember once Miller said she was for Clinton. Think she was in 2008. Why does it matter? Her health care views are pretty logical but some of her personal views are disgusting, on this thread in particular comes to mind.
0 Replies
 
 

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