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The coming Oz election thread ...

 
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Oct, 2004 07:30 am
Just 3 days to go (counting saturday, polling day)!

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,1658,385974,00.jpg
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Oct, 2004 07:30 am
Just 3 days to go!

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,1658,385974,00.jpg
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Oct, 2004 08:19 am
Pro and anti-logging groups have rejected the package. (ABC)

Critics attack Howard's forests policy

Prime Minister John Howard's announcement that a re-elected Coalition government would protect an additional 170,000 hectares of Tasmania's old growth forests has been criticised by unions, environmentalists, the Greens and a pro-logging member of the Labor Party.

Mr Howard also unveiled a $50 million plan to assist the timber industry and promised there would be no job losses.

Conservation groups have condemned Mr Howard's plan as a travesty.

The Wilderness Society, the Australian Conservation Foundation and Greenpeace joined forces to attack the plan.

Alec Marr from the Wilderness Society says it is a con job.

"Most of that 170,000 hectares is not trees and big chunks of it are the areas that were too remote and too uncommercial for the industry to log," he said.

"What John Howard has done is taken scraps thrown to him by the woodchip companies and the Tasmanian Government and tried to dress it up as a conservation outcome.

"So what they've cynically done is take the important names like the Styx and the Tarkine and protected little bits of them, the bits that the logging industry didn't want."


The Wilderness Society says that there is no commitment to ending land clearing, which it says is one the biggest problems.

Greens Senator Bob Brown says Mr Howard is offering to protect about one-third of what Opposition Leader Mark Latham has promised to save.

"What John Howard has done is pick bits and pieces from the Tarkine, from the Styx, from other forests in the eastern highlands and said 'we'll allow those to be protected but we're ultimately guaranteeing that large areas also go to the woodchip mills'," he said.

He has now asked his party to give preferences to Labor in another 26 seats.


"I've asked the party tonight to contact those electorates in the view of this appalling destruction of forests, imminent in the policy that's been greeted by the loggers today with handshakes from Prime Minister Howard, but which sells out this nation's heritage, to review that decision by those electorates," he said.

"I'll be hopefully able to coordinate or collect that data and pass that on to the electorate between now and Saturday."

Labor's forestry spokesman Joel Fitzgibbon says it does nothing to protect the most threatened old-growth forests in Tasmania.

"Not one additional hectare of old-growth forests will be protected as a result of John Howard's policy," he said.

The Forestry Union's Michael O'Connor says Mr Howard's package falls short of union demands.

"We don't want to give up one hectare, one tree, we don't want any changes to the Regional Forests Agreement, that's our position," he said.


"There's only two politicians that support making no appeasement to the Greens and that seems to be Paul Lennon and Dick Adams."

Before releasing the policy, Mr Howard was applauded timber workers at an address at a local hall in Launceston.

The pro-logging Labor member for the Tasmanian seat of Lyons, Dick Adams, says he cannot support either of the major parties' forestry policies.

Having already spoken out against his own party's forest plan, he has also denounced Mr Howard's policy because it involves locking up more land.

While he concedes the Liberal plan would lock up fewer trees, he would not say he supported that policy over Labor's.

"There is a difference here and I don't support locking up any more of Tasmania's forests," he said.

"The decision today by Howard was to do that so I don't support that."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200410/s1214519.htm
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realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Oct, 2004 04:15 pm
(oops, somehow I got the notion that yall would be voting Oct 7...so my request for predictions was a couple of days premature. Maybe I got you confused with Afghanistan, which also begins with the letter A.)
The influence of the Greens could be interesting. Thanks, -rjb-
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Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Oct, 2004 12:46 am
"What happened to our representative democracy Daddy?".

"We lost it in the trees honey".
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Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Oct, 2004 03:36 am
I have just talked to my father, who has the fortunate/unfortunate status of being in a critical electorate for the Coalition. He received a telephone call from the PM today - first time the leader of this nation has noticed him since he (my father, not the PM) naturalised in 1961.

Dad said, "Not HAPPY John!" and hung up. I don't care what the outcome may be, but at least my father got to razz that little git!
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Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Oct, 2004 03:38 am
For those folks amazed that the leader of the nation should phone my Dad, they (the Govt, not my parents) are using a recording to bother the good folks of the Hunter. Shithouse state of affairs when any bastard can bother innocent pensioners!
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Oct, 2004 05:04 am
Mr Stillwater wrote:
I have just talked to my father, who has the fortunate/unfortunate status of being in a critical electorate for the Coalition. He received a telephone call from the PM today - first time the leader of this nation has noticed him since he (my father, not the PM) naturalised in 1961.

Dad said, "Not HAPPY John!" and hung up. I don't care what the outcome may be, but at least my father got to razz that little git!


Good on ya' dad, Mr Stillwater! Very Happy
What is it about the Howards? The spamming son & his old man making nuisance calls to pensioners!

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,1658,385984,00.jpg
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Oct, 2004 05:16 am
... All this talk of interest rates, scare tactics & bribes, yet this is by far the most pressing reason to remove the Coalition government. A letter to the editor from today's AGE. (My sentiments exactly!):

This Government has betrayed our trust: it must go
October 7, 2004/the AGE

There are very strong reasons why the Government does not deserve another term. Those reasons are quite independent of the position of the Opposition.

In this country, we have a strong and proud democracy. We have strong institutions to support it: the Parliament, the judiciary and the media. But in the end, and most fundamental, is the fact that we have to be able to trust our political leaders.

The most serious charge that can be made against a government is that it has deceived or misled or lied to the Australian people. If such a charge can be proved then it is essential that a government that has indulged in such behaviour be removed from office. Not to do so would send the message that such behaviour is acceptable and not to be punished.

Moreover, an electorate that refused to punish such a government would by such action become a partner in the deception and the misleading and the lies. If we return the Government to office we will be saying to the politicians in Canberra that we approve of their deception and they are free to do it again and again. We will no longer be able to demand honesty in public life. We would be a diminished people.

My recent travels have highlighted to me the different way in which we are now seen overseas. Our detention camps are regarded with horror and disbelief: the use of our defence forces to detain men, women and children sits uneasily with the long-held image of a caring and compassionate country.

The position is no better domestically. The people of Australia have been lied to, misled and deceived. We have been taken to war on a completely false basis, we have been told that children were thrown overboard, and that lie was persisted with despite the fact that the allegation was widely known not to be true.

We owe it to ourselves and our children and their children to say that we will not allow our system to be so corrupted.

The Government must be removed from office. Only in this way will it be made clear that above all else we will in the future be told the truth.

There is no alternative to this message.

- Frank Costigan, QC, Melbourne
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 01:13 am
Tomorrow is polling day. Most "experts" predict a Liberal win. Most are advocating a vote for the Liberals, saying that Latham is too inexperienced. Better the devil you know, apparently .... Rolling Eyes

http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2004/10/08/810toon_gallery__500x350,0.gif
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 05:29 am
The people doing the betting for the election say that the money went straight to the Libs after Latham declared the ALP logging policy - in a landslide.

Waaaaaah!
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 05:39 am
I've read/heard lots of criticism of Latham's "lack of judgement" about the policy re old growth forests in Tassie, too, Deb. I think the theory goes that most Greens preferences were going to go to Labor, anyway, so why take the policy so far? An error of judgement? Was he pushed too far by Howard to declare his hand? I don't know, Deb, but I think it was a real problem that the policy was delivered SO LATE in the campaign. Not enough time for the voters, media, Tassie unionists to consider the ramifications fully. It all got lost in headlines & short grabs for TV news. I don't think this did credit to the issue, nor Latham's policy. Too much information, too short a time for the relevant people to think it through before responding. Yep, a bit of a blunder.
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gozmo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 06:55 am
GUESS WHICH WAY I'M VOTING !!
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 06:56 am
Green? Laughing
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gozmo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 07:10 am
no , that's the colour I'll be if the rat wins.
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 07:14 am
Only joshing, gozmo! I know where your votes are going. Just trying to keep my spirits up. It'd better not be a bloody Coalition landslide, that's all I can say! May as well just chuck it all in, if that's the case. Sad
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hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 07:17 am
I had a dream last night the ALP won - but I have no powers of prescience and I don't believe it.

Since 1996 elections have depressed me because they prove to me that the majority of my country men don't care of the perception of my nation throughout the world.

I can't believe the Australian distrust of authority and power doesn't knee jerk at some prat, like Jamie Packer, endorses the libs. How stupid are we? Kerry Packer still wants those media ownership laws nobbled so Australia can benefit from mass media ownership like Italy benefits from Berlusconi's 90% ownership, and Fox News is so helpful in informing Americans about what the f* is happening on this planet.

And the libs hack into Mark Latham's financial management of Liverpool Council - HA! Hey, Jamie, your qualified to judge after screwing all those one.tel investors at no cost to yourself. You tool.

Is it time to seek New Zealand citizenship?
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 07:24 am
Hmmm - possibly.
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msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 07:27 am
Hello, hingehead & welcome to A2K! Very Happy

Nah, don't take out NZ citizenship just yet .... As I said earlier in this thread, it's not over till the rodent crows! And I'm holding out some hope that a Coalition win is not necessarily inevitable ... The media & pollsters have gotten these things badly wrong before ... maybe this time, too?

Do you really think anyone listens to Jamie Packer? I doubt that he'd influence anyone's vote, really. Prat!
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Adrian
 
  1  
Reply Fri 8 Oct, 2004 07:37 am
Hi hingehead. Haven't noticed you around. Welcome to A2K.

Don't become a Kiwi, there's no need, you can already go there any time you like.

Labor may still win. Outside chance, but it may happen.

I hope they do because I REALLY DON'T want Costello to become PM.

Latham didn't push that issue enough.....
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