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What good does religion offer the world today?

 
 
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Tue 23 Feb, 2016 06:38 pm
https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/12742241_1694632424149185_4564789894118428569_n.jpg?oh=ccbe8bc60fe76067ec2ee5d0bb48efaf&oe=576CBD82
0 Replies
 
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 02:55 am
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Amoh5
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 03:11 am
@TheCobbler,
It deters people from worshipping scientists, polticians and robots...
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 04:11 am
@TheCobbler,
Oh jeez, don't get me started...
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 04:14 am
@Amoh5,
It is an un-holy concept that deters people from actually loving anything or anyone.
Amoh5
 
  2  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 04:41 am
@Leadfoot,
It was meant to be a humorous implication from some smart-ass theist. But I suppose there was a tinge of seriousness where theists may view atheists as synthetic souls with artificial robotic intelligence, not to mention the two-faced politicians. But all in all just harmless humor from a theist perspective. But no, I don't seriously believe all this. There are honest decent respectable atheists and theists, there is no discrimination on my part. I think un-holy concepts can come from theists and atheists. I'm not deluded by segregated concepts...
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 04:56 am
@Amoh5,
Well you prove to be a more civilized person as a theist then many new reactive atheits. It is true of course that many theists fail your grade just like atheits do.
Amoh5
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 05:09 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
As a Christian, I am obligated to view all human beings as sacred according to Lord Jesus, but at the same time I must be vigilant as well, because people may not view me as sacred. But I would not cast a stone at any human being deeming myself perfect. I'm only human, and trying to get along with my fellow human beings, hopefully we can create a better world for ourselves and our children...
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 07:09 am
@Amoh5,
I figured that's where you were coming from and agree.

That "unconditional love" thing sets me off though. Not so much when an atheist says it as when theists do although both are guilty of embracing that twisted concept.

At least cobbler said it mockingly. Just makes me cringe when theists posit it as something we should strive for.
Amoh5
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 08:22 am
@Leadfoot,
As a Christian, I think unconditional love is better explained from a parental perspective where a parent loves their child regardless of whether it is ill-behaved, well-behaved or deformed. Concluding, that in order to have unconditional love we would have to know a person very intimately as close as a family member. However, trying to give unconditional love to unfamiliar people would be somewhat unrealistic because you don't have an intimate understanding or experience of them. Therefore, one must have a conditional love that is cautious and vigilant just in case there is no mutuality...
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 08:31 am
@Leadfoot,
Oh but you are wrong... love is the obscure wording for understanding and universal unity. It takes a slightly above average azz to screw everyone with some cunning tricks, but it takes a genius mind to understand the importance of Neo Darwinism and cooperation for developing energy efficient group complex tasking. Unconditional love represents universal understanding and acceptance on why tbe world is the way it is. No place for rage or anger when you grasp the causes on the clockwork motion that unfold the world exactly as it is. One simply does not correct nature. One learns from it.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 10:58 am
@Amoh5,
Do you see the conflict here? Before, you said this:
Quote:
As a Christian, I am obligated to view all human beings as sacred according to Lord Jesus
But now you are saying that family are the ones that unconditional love is reserved for.
Furthermore, who did Jesus say was 'your brother'?

Both because of the principles that Jesus taught and an objective view of 'life's lessons', one's family is no more deserving of a person's love than anyone else.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 11:22 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:
Unconditional love represents universal understanding and acceptance on why tbe world is the way it is. No place for rage or anger when you grasp the causes on the clockwork motion that unfold the world exactly as it is. One simply does not correct nature. One learns from i
Words do have meaning, and the specific meaning of the words 'Unconditional love' absolutely precludes what you say it represents. If love is the automatic response expected of you, it requires no understanding or acceptance, just blind obedience without ANY conditions.

Why add this unnecessary and counterproductive qualifier to the word? Love, if properly understood, eliminates rage, anger, and all the other negative emotions.

By specifying that it is to be unconditional, rather than adding understanding, it destroys any value, beauty, noble intent, indeed ANY MEANING AT ALL of the word 'Love'.
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 01:06 pm
Without unconditional love, "giving" cannot exist.

Giving is giving, where "payment" is a wage and does not qualify as giving...
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 01:20 pm
@Leadfoot,
Religion is obsolete if it does not foster love unconditionally.

God so loved that he gave...

Many who profess faith are nothing more than stingy bastards and many with nothing and no religion to prove are the most giving souls on earth.

The Bible says "he who does not work should not eat" so people who profess a Christian God have taken it upon themselves to see that the world is starving and homeless.

Even people who work themselves to death do not get the praise of these twisted Christians and their rich masters.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 01:31 pm
@TheCobbler,
Quote:
Without unconditional love, "giving" cannot exist.

Giving is giving, where "payment" is a wage and does not qualify as giving...
Forgive my error in where you stood in those shoes of yours. You weren't mocking after all.

I would say you are short changing 'love' or maybe adopted the view of it presented by the world around you rather than the real thing.

Properly understood, you can only love that which you find lovable.

Why could I not give without expectation of repayment to something/someone I love? To declare the impossibility of doing that is to demote love to something very cheap indeed.

0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 01:46 pm
@TheCobbler,
Quote:
Many who profess faith are nothing more than stingy bastards and many with nothing and no religion to prove are the most giving souls on earth.
No argument there, but we were talking about love.

Re: 'he who does not work should not eat'. - simply means that if given the opportunity to work and you chose to live at the expense of the work of others instead, then you are not worthy of charity. If for circumstances beyond your control you cannot work, that is a different story. Those you help out of love for a fellow human being created by God.
0 Replies
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 02:28 pm
@Leadfoot,
Well I think the term unconditional behind love is redundant in the field we were coining the usage...either you have it and are at piece with the world or you don't...no need to inflate the thing. That was my point.
0 Replies
 
Amoh5
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 04:18 pm
@Leadfoot,
I find no conflict as a Christian deeming human beings as sacred (or acknowledging value towards human life) and having a conditional love towards people I don't know. Also, I was not saying that unconditional love is only limited to family members. I was saying that in order to love someone unconditionally you would have to have an intimate understanding and experience of them like a birth-family member, so there is undoubtly mutuality and trust. In other words you have to be very close to this person in order to express unconditional love, otherwise you are only expressing blind love towards people you do not know where they may see you as an easy target for abuse. As a Christian I do believe in valuing human life, but one must be vigilant also towards people they do not know...
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Thu 25 Feb, 2016 04:20 pm
@Amoh5,
In today's world, vigilance is necessary.
 

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