Are there any peaceful muslim nations?

Any thread like this should have people for, against, curious, and/or fence sitting. I think CI's posts are fine.

Hello Osso.

Any thread like this should have people for, against, curious, and/or fence sitting. I think CI's posts are fine.

To each his own. I find him pedantic at best.

Sorry, coldjoint, you're another victim to having no idea what the difference is between actuality and "allegory".

These books are allegorical - they are not to be read literally, but poetically.

The entire "holy book" series we have here is based on no other than nature's wrath (the superstitious called nature god), which is why this god is known for destroying with fire, water, lightning and wind, which is what nature does. Then on the other side of the book, it speaks of Man's animosity allegorically. Then finally, the book which proceeds these books are the allegorically expressed "transcendence" of Man and Nature.

You are wrong the Koran is meant to be taken literally. It says so in the Koran itself. Do some research.

That does not make sense, because the Koran, like the Bible, consists of fictional events and supernatural occurrences.

Why would it say such a thing, coldjoint? Do prove me wrong, I enjoy it.

coldjoint, there are verses in the bible that simulate certainty and absolution; it's in our blood to bluff and to puff ourselves up, gods or not. Movies, books, games, every entertainment system and Man, say the same things, without meaning any of it. It's simply us channeling our universal energy in a communicative manner, to represent our passion and power. It's what I like to call "An illusion that alludes to an allusion".

This is about Islam not the Bible. I am tired of excuses. Islam is what these people believe. And the Koran is a hateful book full of violence and obligations to advance Islam anyway possible. It is the inspiration for terror, sexism, and supremacy.

This is reality, not a ******* word game.

Why are you going to say that, when there's clearly a similar tone in the bible, as there is in the koran? I'd be more worried about your zealous behavior towards all of this, to disregard valuable information to support your hate towards a religion, when it's not the religion, much like it's not the gun, is dishonest and rash. These are double standards; hatred runs deeper than religion, friend.

Do not let the fire settle, it will lead to decadence.

The hate comes from that religion/ideology. My reaction is quite normal. I will not tolerate evil. You should do the same.

The evil is not in a book of allegories and artistic colloquy.

It's in us.

It's in you.

That is why you disregard my point about these books having similar tones of supremacy, but you did not want to accept that because you cannot let go of your own hate.

This is no longer about them; this is about you. You have already demonstrated you are willing to live in fear.

The Koran is neither. As far as books go the Koran is mediocre at best. And again is supposed to be taken literally. So yes the hate comes from that book.

61% of the Koran concerns how to treat non-Muslims. That right there makes it more political than religious. And 81% is Mohammed while only 19% are Allahs words. It is like Mein Kampf. Is there hate In Mein Kampf?

It's a book. The issue is not the book. The issue is the people misusing the book for power and prestige.

This is why you need to control your fire, so you can see clearly. You're not even addressing the root issue. You're just trying to cut off whatever you think is the culprit of your anguish, that you took in without responsibility mind you.

The root issue is Islam. Islam is the Koran and Mohammed. After his death his succession caused a schism that goes on to this day. That is why there is no peace in Islamic nations. They fight amongst themselves and persecute or kill any other religious minority.

And I do not need another blowhole spouting platitudes about anger that I learned in Psych 101.

No, it's the hatred in men that sacrifices humanity for a dead man's cruelty. You are blaming a book, when you are absolutely wrong - people have been at wars before these books were made. Please if you're going to blame something like a book, make sure the same violence didn't exist before the book, because that'll just contradict your claims.

Keep in mind, Muhammad did these things before the book existed, therefore it was inside Man - it still is inside Man, and that book is causing that side of man to react to it, but it's not the book - it's that side of people that should have been confronted, but these people, like you, never deal with the real issues, so that part of humanity lives in many people today. You encourage the very thing you loathe, all of this is because you don't know how to control your own emotions, and completely missing the point of danger and destruction.

No, the Koran does not require these people to be cruel backwards people any more than the Bible requires Christians to remain cruel backwards people. It is a choice, and we should object to this choice and confront it at every opportunity.

I think one of the major flaws in western thinking is to believe that 'Islam shares so much in common with Christianity that it must be the same'.

To me that line of thought is somewhat akin to "a horse & a dog both have 4 legs, multiple joints in those legs, a tail, body hair, interestingly similar ears, a long muzzle, eyes in similar places, heart, lungs, kidneys, blood, bladders, stomach (etc) and are fiercely loyal to humans...so they must be the same, or close enough to make not difference." While bearing so many similarities - they are very different creatures...and it is of course the differences that define them.

So for example in Hawkeye's example - both the bible and the koran have calls to violence. Differences that exist include:
- most biblical calls to violences are close ended calls (not stretching beyond their historical context).
Vs
- many (I don't know quite enough to state 'most') Islamic quotes are open ended, and can apply in todays world

and

the christian version...most biblical violence is contained in the old testament, balanced by what christians focus on...the peacefulness of their 'saviour' Jesus

Vs.

the islamic version...with the old testament, and the convert by the sword methods of their prophet.

None of this of course is meant to be a 'one religion is better than the other' statement, but rather ...pointing out that believing two religions to be the same because of inherent similarities is a flawed basis to judge whether either religion is problematic, violent, or dangerous....for it is the differences that define them as different religions (this should be obvious), and different beasts (colloquially speaking)

Hence, each should be judged on it's own merits. And the evils of one should never be used as excuse of the evils of the other. Evil isn't acceptable in either.

Lastly, I would point out that actions speak louder than words...and patterns of actions speak way louder than words. If patterns arise, and have a common thread - then there is something in that common thread contributing to the pattern.

And that advocate of said pattern is the hatred in men, not a book...

Well your reply completely avoids the point of the post, which was talking about how comparison can sometimes be inappropriate...and tries to put it onto a different track...why do you suppose you did that?

As a note - you have used 'advocate' erroneously in your reply...only words can advocate.

And, to excuse ideology's influence on violence with 'humans are hateful anyway' is a ridiculous way of excusing the ideology that contributes to so much hate, and the severity of hate.

Advocate was used as a noun. Please tell me you're not colloquially illiterate as well.