GMOs, Monsanto, the future of food, and deGrasse Tyson

I know where Mt. Dora is...but haven't been there yet. It's just out of my reach about 150 mi...2.25 hr drive. It's on my list to visit, as is the Bok Tower Gardens in Lake Wales (near Lakeland).

FWIW, my girlfriend (local to Bradenton) had a lime tree in her backyard but she never did anything with the limes. They're always small and not edible she said.

Ah... I see I didn't remember in two ways - re the why of it, and that it was lemons I read about. It was probably oranges. I figure it was some temporary problem.

On meyers, well, mine were from my own tree.. no chemicals, and not tart.

The anti-GMO argument I hear most around here is about pollen drift. It seems that all the GMO plants are patented and if they cross pollinate with another farmer's field that farmer could lose his crops to due to patent violations.

It also creates a problem for organic farmers as they could lose their organic certification should their plants cross pollinate.

The only problem with the "Total Dismissal" approach is that GMO has many faces. It provides a degree of protection of plants from drought conditions;, it asserts a bio -protection "Shield" about a plant being sucked dry by lrval moths;, it enables farmers to make plants ripen "in schedule";. It also makes plnts immune drom certain classes of chemical pesticies. Many of these typws aren't really "frankenfood" manipulations of genomes, but, alas, many are.

Just like there are many species of ants, there are many typs of GMO, and some are well documented to cause variable degrees of sensitivity reactions in vertebrates. As I said, I WILL NOT USE Bt jiggered seed for my soybeans or corn because there IS significant juried research that shows a relationship between the grain

ingestion and sensitivities, including tumors.



Ask a cross section of grain or stock farmers what they think. (I don't believe that anyone would be so married to their political beliefs so that they would jeopardize their income by ignoring indisputable facts)

Several assertions by "Anti-GMO" groups can be put on the shelf and weighed with the myopic views of several of the producers. Remember, it was the tobacco industry that swore until the day the verdicts came in, that smoking DOES NOT cause lung cancer.

As the lqte Sen Dirkson said "Follow the money"

I jumped right up on the anti-GMO bandwagon early because I'm pissed that they have politicians steamrolling their cause through congress - and I hate the Monsanto Protection Act. But, I don't want to get swept away and become a useful idiot for the anti-Monsanto people anymore than I want to lay down and let Monsanto poison me. It's a great luxury to hear you guys.

Finn, farmer, osso, Ragman - and everyone who brings personal stories, links, ideas - I'm reading and following. Thanks for balanced info. There are a lot of local farmers to talk to here.

Ok, I stirred myself to do an a2k search re monsanto, looking for what I remember about later resistant weeds, re round up. Bingo, this is the thread I remember and right away MsOlga gives a link that includes mention of superweeds/some study (that doesn't work now, old link), then a quick comment by green witch (someone I miss badly), and then the post by farmerman that I was remembering....

The thread -
http://able2know.org/topic/144844

farmer's post -
http://able2know.org/topic/144844-1#post-3989408

haven't read the rest of the thread yet..
as I said, I also read some other article re the superweed problem; I checked, and while I likely saved it, it must have been before my last exciting computer meltdown.

I've also used round up in my various yards once in a while, but mostly have hand weeded (or shoveled and grabbed) for years, even decades.. I used to like to weed, quiet time, and progress happened.
I do remember specifying round up (the grow and kill application, that uses it three times) to clear the dreaded algerian ivy.

Now I'm gonna try Edgarblythe's recipe that involves original dawn soap and vinegar, back with a link or at least the recipe. I need something since I'm now way less apt to run out my front door just after dawn (hot days here) to start weeding, much less at twilight, never in the mood then, baaaaad.

I remember something called pre-emergent, which I probably only used once, ever, years ago. I've no idea how much an environmental problem that has turned out to be, but am pretty doubtful it's a great thing. It keeps weed seeds from emerging.


On the superweeds, I've not read up yet. Are they still considered a problem?

Superweeds are still a problem becaue, mostly, the "labeled glyphosates" and those with glyphosate mixes with colorants and PARAQUAT (how's that for scaring the **** our of those who know what chems can do to you) (Roundup, Ally, Crossbow) all have gone off patent and are being produced in home labs. The stuff requires several other herbicides to be 100% effective now. SO, the demise of Roundup's "Lone" effectiveness is on track. It should become a pretty
useless ag chem in about 20 years.

Don't use pre-emergent on anything but ornamentals. Food plant (transplants of course) , will take this up and store it in the fruits or tubers. I have no idea of its breakdowns and half life but since the packages have nice warning labels and scripts, Id ask around to an ag school prof (I use Penn State and U Cal Davis)

Thanks, farmer.



I don't even like amaranth.. (the grocery store kind).

Here's the recipe edgarblythe has been trying with poison ivy, turned out not strong enough so on a later page or two he mentioned that the person who told him about it said to make that original dawn (which is odd, as it just has a different perfume than the new one, I take it) and to add more. See the link and then look at the pages before and just after it for the commentary..

http://able2know.org/topic/90584-252#post-5685987

I've mixed it up but now I have to read the direction for the sprayer (not my old one, this one is newfangled).

I think I'll step aside and let every one else try GMOs while I shop at Trader Joe's and any place that can guarantee organic.

I hope you all thrive. I really do.

she posts on this topic on FB through her business account

The yard man who takes care of the water department property next door uses that exact formula. He said he had to increase the amount of soap. Original Dawn is thick. The other Dawn pours quicker.

Gotcha, now, the thickness would matter.

My sentiments, exactly!

Most of the GMO's have been developed for NON FOOD or NON CATTLE FEED uses. For example, the 2006 requirements on using Ethanol mixes in our fuel hs resulted in severl strins Of GMO corns that can
1 be raised in swampy mucky soils
2 beRaised in ARid environments
3 be raised in very short growing season climates
As a result, corn has boomed as an ag product for making fuel additive ethanol

Its really kind of stupid because the increases in growing ethanol corn has resulted in prices of gas actually going UP, due to the fact that ethanol fuls are quite a bit less energy dense than regulr gqsoline. Also, ethanol is responsible for eating engine parts in smaller engines and marine 2 cycle engines, so besides spending for more ful nd higher refining cots, we once again , have an issue with engine wear that parallels the time when "Lead ethane" in gas actually caused acid erosion of car engines. My dad was lucky to get 100000 miles out of a car. (nowadays we have cars that are humming along with 300000 miles on em)

EU uses canola for its ethanol production and even GW Buh wanted an ethanol "economy" based on switchgrass and other tall grsses. Corn lobby is trying to reverse all that in congress. (Watch the monet please)

farmerman, I agree that GMO's original concept was to develop corn for ethanol purposes. However, that was done to get their foot in the door, so to speak. I know that gas from ethanol has tanked in the U.S. - I had Pacific Ethanol stocks for a while.

A much better option is to build cars like Tesla has done where your battery reaches 300 - 400 miles distance in between charging and the life expectancy of their batteries is guarantied up to 8 years.

A tesla S , with an 85 Kw battery (an additional 10K option) still gets only about 250 miles of range. When electric cars start reaching 500 qnd then 600 mi rqnges and a 30 min rechqrge, then Ill seriously look at one. Now, its a very expensive toy.

The issue that GMO' are mostly into NON FOOD qg production is the way it may continue, (so long s the industry isnt regulated out of existence and then only China will be the source of new variants

I do have an opinion about GMOs: they're no better and no worse for me than any non-GMO food we currently eat. The difference between GMO corn and non-GMO corn vanishes compared to the difference between both and the wild plant species they derive from. DeGrasse-Tyson is absolutely right: We humans have been genetically modifying organisms for 10,000 years, with dramatic consequences. So far, we're doing just fine.

I do not have an opinion about Monsanto.

Where the hell have you been? Off gallivanting, I suppose, and probably through fields of poppies.


(welcome back)