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Rumsfeld Ordered Torture at Abu Ghraib

 
 
greenumbrella
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 07:31 am
This paragraph carries so much damning weight in implicating Rumsfeld on the Abu Ghraib scandal:

According to interviews with several past and present American intelligence officials, the Pentagon's operation, known inside the intelligence community by several code words, including Copper Green, encouraged physical coercion and sexual humiliation of Iraqi prisoners in an effort to generate more intelligence about the growing insurgency in Iraq. A senior C.I.A. official, in confirming the details of this account last week, said that the operation stemmed from Rumsfeld's long-standing desire to wrest control of America's clandestine and paramilitary operations from the C.I.A.

Rumsfeld, like any good neocon, is rather power hungry and predatory.
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fairandbalanced
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 08:22 am
Bush is really arrogant in defending Rumsfeld. Rumsfeld is just dragging his poll numbers down. I say Rumsfeld should be fired from his job.
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Aris
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 08:27 am
Firing Rumsfeld who is basically the architect of this war would only send a message of failure to the public, and we all know how Bush puts his goals ahead of integrity and honesty Laughing
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 09:42 am
Sunday, May 16 2004
SEYMOUR HERSH: I don't pretend to be an expert on Sy Hersh. However, about a week into the war with Iraq I remember reading a Hersh piece in The New Yorker. I remember the article so vividly because it was at the height of the press hysteria that the war was turning into a disaster; sandstorms, not enough troops, Rumsfeld, Myers and Bush had no idea what they are doing, etc....

Here's a little sample from Hersh's appraisal on the Iraq War posted on March 31, 2003.



That, of course, was nine days before the fall of Saddam's statue in Baghdad and the collapse of Hussein's evil regime. The war plan was in fact "brilliant" and "on track" and Hersh's reporting and characterization of the war was about as wrong as you can get.

This brought back a memorable recollection from Bob Woodward's, Bush at War:

Musharraf said his deep fear was that the United States would in the end abandon Pakistan, and that other interests would crowd out the war on terrorism.

Bush fixed his gaze. "Tell the Pakistani people that the President of the United States looked you in the eye and told you we wouldn't do that."

Musharraf brought up an article in The New Yorker by investigative reporter Seymour Hersh, alleging that the Pentagon, with the help of an Israeli special operations unit, had contingency plans to seize Pakistan's nuclear weapons should the country become unstable.

"Seymour Hersh is a liar, " Bush replied.


To people who think President Bush is a liar, this opinion of the President's might not hold that much weight. But the directness of his answer to Woodward coupled with Hersh's article on the Iraqi War plan has made me extremely skeptical of anything Seymour Hersh has to say.

Which takes me to his latest from The New Yorker, with the heading:

FACT: The Gray Zone - Did secret Pentagon decisions trigger the Abu Ghraib scandal? by Seymour M. Hersh:

The roots of the Abu Ghraib prison scandal lie not in the criminal inclinations of a few Army reservists but in a decision, approved last year by Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, to expand a highly secret operation, which had been focussed on the hunt for Al Qaeda, to the interrogation of prisoners in Iraq. Rumsfeld's decision embittered the American intelligence community, damaged the effectiveness of élite combat units, and hurt America's prospects in the war on terror.

That is the first paragraph from this week's article. Hersh lays out a plausible story of how Rumsfeld and Under-Secretary for Intelligence, Stephen Cambone, are ultimately responsible for the abuses at Abu Ghraib.

The big question is whether Hersh has this story as wrong he had the story from March 31, 2003 of the "faltering ground campaign against Saddam Hussein."

Pentagon spokesman Lawrence Di Rita issued a statement calling the claims "outlandish, conspiratorial, and filled with error and anonymous conjecture." Di Rita went on to say:

No responsible official of the Department of Defense approved any program that could conceivably have been intended to result in such abuses as witnessed in the recent photos and videos. This story seems to reflect the fevered insights of those with little, if any, connection to the activities in the Department of Defense.

There is no question that Rumsfeld and the Bush White House have made many mistakes as far as the postwar administration of Iraq. The biggest mistake may have been the idea that the war was over last spring. However, mistakes are an inevitable part of all wars, even successful wars. But the enemies of Bush and his policy in Iraq, which like it or not happens to also be America's policy, are willfully using those mistakes to misrepresent and exaggerate the reality of the overall war.

I suspect there is a good chance we have seen the peak of the Abu Ghraib hysteria, and people should read Hersh's latest "investigative report" with a good deal of skepticism and remember he has gotten a great deal very wrong in the past.

Link
0 Replies
 
Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 10:31 am
Sorry, but I don't see where he was far off target on what was occuring at the time. He doesn't state it means we will lose and in fact it conforms to the assessments of what was being reported by the military at the time. That they pulled it off nine days later was due to some on-the-spot strategic decisions by the commanders who saved the day.
It also doesn't excuse the failure of the administration's in the "post victory" Iraq which makes the word "brilliant" non-operative.
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greenumbrella
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 10:37 am
Thoroughly and absolutely, non-operative.
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infowarrior
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 12:45 pm
I agree, I too would like to see Rumsfeld go, but as you point out fairandbalanced, he's having such a poisonous effect on Bush's approval numbers that i think he's serving the Kerry camp quite well.
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Rick d Israeli
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 12:58 pm
infowarrior wrote:
...he's having such a poisonous effect on Bush's approval numbers that i think he's serving the Kerry camp quite well.


In that case (shouts): Rumsfeld should stay, Rumsfeld should stay :wink:
0 Replies
 
Deecups36
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 May, 2004 02:41 pm
In that case (shouts): Rumsfeld should stay, Rumsfeld should stay

I agree wholeheartedly Rick. Rummy the Dummy is the best thing that's happened to Kerry!

Once Kerry announces his VP selection (Edwards or Clark) this election will be all wrapped up.
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