Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

To get back to the topic, people who believe in Intelligent Design still believe that the Universe runs as a Casino. They just believe it is a crooked casino. In intelligent design God lets science happen as the cards are played, He just makes sure the deck is stacked to get the outcome He wants.

The idea of a God who cheats science is somehow appealing.

I gotta admit that this is the first description of ID that appeals to me. Wink

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@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

.I'd love to get you and your money at a table where I am playing.

Decoded into plain talk Apisa means Herald and max are mugs and cleaning them out will be a doodle. It's a macho blustering. Almost everything he says is a "big mon" thing.

But not to worry--he thinks we all are mugs.

How could almost infinite odds against have actually come off? An intelligent designer is bound to be almost infinite odds on to have caused it. Infinite actually assuming perfection. Which a follower of Pascal would do. Especially at 77 when sinning is extremely difficult and tiresome.

He's just squeamish. He thinks deaths, persecutions and general mayhem are bad things and shouldn't be allowed. And obviously he thinks an intelligent designer should take the same view and thus not expect him to become a penitent at the altar rails before allowing him inside the Pearly Gates.

And he is proud to have served in an organisation specifically designed to cause deaths, persecutions and general mayhem. As I have myself.

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@timur,

Quote:

It's a behavior common in many species, including man:

Obviously I know that tim. It was actually the point of my post. It was not a question about the "what" but of the "how".

We certainly don't use insect emblems on our coats-of-arms and in team sports' names. The Philadelphia Flagellas are actually wafting themselves upwards on the cultural currents.

Are we in constant denial of our animal inheritance and good old evolutionists at the same time? No wonder the pharmaceutical industry thrives and massive hospitals are unable to cope.

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@spendius,

Quote:

An insect colony contains large numbers of individual insects but to an outside observer it displays a unity. Is it possible to say that there is no coordinating agent present, a sort of colony self, and if not what do you think the coordinating agent is which transcends the generations of insects?

I don't know but its most probably chemistry

Quote:

2---If the pursuit of happiness, freedom and the sunny uplands is the name of the game in what way is truth superior to faith and myth as a means to achieving the objective?

I have no idea. Often when Im seeking the truth, it takes a hell of a lot more effort and equipment investment than does simple faith.
Am I happier ? AM I on some sunny upland? How the hell does one know?
Whats so great about happiness if it requires one to ignore easily acquired facts?

Most of the 1940's lobotomized folks had a dull witted "happy countenance" about them.

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Personally, i like Ike.

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@Setanta,

my nabors name is IKE and he fixes lawnmowers. (Ive been posting on a DAVE thred)

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I remember back when Ike was the President--we never saw black people, there was no such thing as a homosexual, and the women kept their mouths shut (mostly) and did the cooking and cleaning. America has gone to Hell, Sam Grant, gone to Hell . . .

(I was in Salon Salon in New York getting my hair cut . . . oops! getting my hair styled in about 1980. There was an elderly Jewish lady who did the shampooing. She told me this long, very affecting story about her husband driving to Florida one year, to save the cost of airline tickets. The story was very sad as she described the conditions in which she saw black people living along the way in Ike's America.)

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@farmerman,

Quote:

I don't know but its most probably chemistry

That's as wimpy as Dawkins with the "probably there's no God" drivel.

Quote:

Whats so great about happiness if it requires one to ignore easily acquired facts?

There are many facts it is best to ignore. Some philosophers think that Christianity, Humanism and Atheism, which is a derivative of Christianity, are all concerned with ignoring certain facts.

The 40's folks were capable of some wonderful things.

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@farmerman,

Quote:

I have no idea. Often when Im seeking the truth, it takes a hell of a lot more effort and equipment investment than does simple faith.

An evolved organism would obviously choose simple faith if a hell of a lot of effort and investment is the alternative.

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@spendius,

then I suggest you consult an OED for the significance of "evolve". It does take effort to evolve to a next generation. Thts why a slacker like you is the "end of a line"

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@farmerman,

You're stumped fm.

The insects were intelligently designed and truth has no advantages over faith and myth in the pursuit of happiness. Quite the contrary I would say.

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@spendius,

Quote:

truth has no advantages over faith and myth in the pursuit of happiness.

Since you assert that they're two quite distinct concepts, Ill accept your
"well evolved" analysis

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@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

And in any case, like Max...I'd love to get you and your money at a table where I am playing.

You and Max are great poker players as it seems - why don't you both just sit down on a poker table ... and measure what you have there.
It is exactly people like you and Max that have forged the Genesis of the Bible with the Abraham story - people that cannot solve the real problems (and not rarely not even able to understand what the problem is) and in order to show that they are great they replace it with with a straw-man problem - where by relying on some other skills and means of cheating (scamming, fraud, hoax or whatever) they hope to 'prove' that they have better knowledge ... in probability theory (in this case).
I am not fond of sitting on a table where I will be dead on arrival. When I have a computer data center with high-frequency trading and can rely on some 'competitive advantage' ... maybe I will think over.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

Its done all the time in labs.

Done by whom? By the intelligence present there (the scientists) or by the big bang (doing the housework in a desert lab)?
What is the probability for the big bang to make the amino acids from the salts in an empty lab (without people and without any automation and working computers). Big bang has everything at its disposal in the lab to do the amino acids and somehow it is not happening.
So, in brief: do you have any carbon capture technology to start fixing the mess with the CO2 in the air & in the ocean ... or you prefer to make another Ph.D. thesis in philosophy ... on the net?

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@Herald,

What a snotty son of a bitch, and what an utter loon. "Big Bang" is not a discrete entity, despite your religious hysteria. However, obviously, the eventual results of the such an event did result in amino acids.

Then you trot out this carbon capture technology bullshit, as though somehow FM were personally responsible to you for solving a problem about which you yourself are apparently doing nothing.

Do YOU have any carbon capture technology, and what are you doing to put it in place?

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This clown is obsessed with climate change, and he can't separate the thought of it from anything he writes, including his whacky religious delusions.

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@Herald,

"The BIg BAng" was only responsible for the creation of lighter elements. Probably carbon would be included but those like Phophorus and iron needed a second "kik start" from novae nd strs being born.

Amino acids aren't difficult to create from very simple compounds in the lb. Maybe some sophomore chem major taking an initial organic prep lab can teach you. Its routine

1 Reply

@Herald,

Quote:

So, in brief: do you have any carbon capture technology to start fixing the mess with the CO2 in the air & in the ocean ... or you prefer to make another Ph.D. thesis in philosophy ... on the net

As far as the CO2 "BUDGET" on earth
.Just keep planting c4 plants like bamboo and eat a lot of clams . Youll be fine.
Most people are worried about Too much CO2, You are being sensible in worrying about the health of plants in a LOW CO2 environment. But as for holding your god harmless in the "cause and effect" cycle of all creation , I find that really funny.
You celebrate a god who, by your own admission, has fucked up in the "CREATION PROCESS" of the biosphere.

1 Reply

Farmerman said:

Quote:

[@Herald] You celebrate a god who, by your own admission, has fucked up in the "CREATION PROCESS" of the biosphere

If you mean the Christian God, he's done pretty good!
I mean, the human race and dear old mother earth has had to put up with ice ages, famines, droughts, floods, plagues, asteroids, earthquakes, tsunamis, world wars, Barry Manilow, Piers Morgan, Justin Bieber etc but we're all still here and thriving.. Smile

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1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

thanks to good ole natural selection and simple species variation.

1 Reply

Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

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